Ski areas with buyer's remorse

skiNEwhere · Dec 21, 2014

Not a complaint against a specific ski area, but I wish ski areas cut really narrow trails similar to rumble at sugarbush instead of the wide boulevards....those trails are pretty good at seeing how good you and your technique really are vs. what you perceive them to be.

Blue hills has one to the skiers right of big blue, unless they've widened it now. Winter park has a blue that's 8-10 feet wide max (wide as an average traffic lane) with BUMPS! Hardest blue ever lol

And def has the feel of an August thread....but so what?

VTKilarney · Dec 21, 2014

But do ski areas regret cutting wider trails? On the one hand, casual skiers seem to like them. On the other hand, they seem like they are harder to keep snow on.

ss20 · Dec 21, 2014

VTKilarney said:
But do ski areas regret cutting wider trails? On the one hand, casual skiers seem to like them. On the other hand, they seem like they are harder to keep snow on.

I remember reading a quote from Sugarloaf's GM that said (s)he regretted taking down so many trees over by timberline in the 80s. I'm sure K regrets destroying Double Dipper and North Glade since neither is much of a "glade" anymore.

MadMadWorld · Dec 21, 2014

Killington needs the wide trails. The problem is that very few ski areas can expand into additional terrain so they just widen the crap they already have.

Scruffy · Dec 21, 2014

abc said:
There're plenty of thread praising ski resorts doing thing right. You're the only one who focus on the negative ones.

You think those threads are disrespectful? Take a look at the tone of your own post!

Ok, I'm sorry for my tone. Shouldn't post after drinking a few :lol: I still think there are too many resort "second guessing" and finger pointing blame threads on this forum, but that's just my opinion. If that's what floats your boat, go for it.

xlr8r · Dec 21, 2014

Lifts:

Jay Peak-Buiding the freezer longer than the original Green Mountain Boys double
Sugarbush-Moving the original GMX to Northridge, so much remorse that they fixed their mistake under new ownership.
Killington-Building Devils Fiddle in a very odd location before Parker's Gore fell through. Possibly shortening Rams Head when the quad was put in.
Stratton-Building the Shooting Star where it is instead of replacing Kidderbrook with it.
Loon-Building the current gondola with cabins that only fit four people.
Waterville-Building the White Peaks quad to the summit, another example that has already been fixed under new ownership.

Layout/Trails:
Sunday River-OZ and White Cap trails cut far too wide.
Killington-Double Dipper and Ovation cut too wide. Half of Ovation's width is no longer used and left for regrowth.
Okemo-South Ridge Layout.
Jay Peak-Can-Am cut too wide.
Cannon-Profile cut too wide.
Sugarloaf-Building the West Mountain pod. The lift ride is ride far too long and there is only one trail.

Other:
Sunday River-Building the Jordan Grand in its isolated location.

Savemeasammy · Dec 22, 2014

xlr8r said:
Cannon-Profile cut too wide.

I don't ski Cannon a lot, but to me, Profile (Cannonball) looks like such an uninspiring run. I don't understand why they don't let it bump up (I will qualify this by saying I've never seen bumps on it when I've been anyway).

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jack97 · Dec 22, 2014

I heard that cannonball/profile was a surface lift, back then, they had to make them wider. Maybe that's why it has no character.

imo, letting it bump won't help. That trail has too much exposure to winds ....essentially no cover to protect the bumps.

joshua segal · Dec 22, 2014

Savemeasammy said:
I don't ski Cannon a lot, but to me, Profile (Cannonball) looks like such an uninspiring run. I don't understand why they don't let it bump up (I will qualify this by saying I've never seen bumps on it when I've been anyway).

I was at Cannon last spring and they did let Profile bump up. The moguls turned a pretty blah run into something pretty good. However, to groom or not is a day-to-day policy issue - and if they had any regrets, they can fix this problem by literally doing nothing!

One of skiing's great problems: In the 60s and 70s,weekend liftlines were epic - often over an hour, but once at the top, the trails weren't crowded. As lift capacity was increased, trail capacity was not. I cite Killington's North Ridge where the 700 person per hour poma was replaced by a 2100 person per hour triple without adding any trails.

I suspect the shortening of Ramshead may be regretted by a bunch of Killington old-timers, but I doubt Killington regrets it. There was not a lot of trail capacity at the top of Ramshead and going from a double to a quad, doubled the uphill capacity with no increase in downhill capacity.

I'd vote for the carpet at the entrance to the Grand Express at Mt. Snow as one of the biggest wastes, (although Mt. Snow's management may not agree with me). With detachables, there's not problem getting into place to load the chairs and it doesn't permit them any extra uphill capacity. Those things are most effective on FGs which they can run a bit faster.

Mt. Ascutney's management may regret the purchase of their HSQ, because it may well have pushed them over the fiscal cliff. I suspect that ASC has enough fiscal regrets to fill a book!

Smellytele · Dec 22, 2014

jack97 said:
I heard that cannonball/profile was a surface lift, back then, they had to make them wider. Maybe that's why it has no character.

imo, letting it bump won't help. That trail has too much exposure to winds ....essentially no cover to protect the bumps.

The top of cannon had 2 t-bars separated by a thin line of trees/shurbs . When they put in the quad in 1990 they decided to put the trail in as well widening it to the ugliness that it is. They should let a 10ft line of trees grow in-between the lift and the trail.
It does bump up quite a bit.

Savemeasammy · Dec 22, 2014

Smellytele said:
It does bump up quite a bit.

I guess I've been unlucky on my visits.

I know it's not Cannon's m.o., but that seems like it would be a good run for seeded bumps.

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BenedictGomez · Dec 22, 2014

Scruffy said:
Like you know the resorts regrets. Whatever, have fun with your resort bashing politics. I'm sure BG will be in here before long with his EB5 shit. Me, I'd rather discuss skiing, techniques, gear, where the goods are, etc.. On TGR, you be called a douchnozzle for even bring it up, so you got that going for you.

That's clearly where you belong.

Though I do have to give credit where credit it due, as you are an extremely talented troll.

HighwayStar is way too obvious, but you, even though > 1/2 of your posts on this board are intentionally argumentative or inciting, you even have all the mods on this board totally fooled, and that it the true mark of excellence in trolling.

BenedictGomez · Dec 22, 2014

xlr8r said:
Lifts:

Jay Peak-Buiding the freezer longer than the original Green Mountain Boys double

I'd add the way it's orientated as well, I cant imagine there wouldn't have been a better buildable alternative.

I'd also add the complete removal of the double to the summit. This is the most obvious ski enhancement Jay Peak could make.

steamboat1 · Dec 22, 2014

xlr8r said:
Lifts:Killington-Building Devils Fiddle in a very odd location before Parker's Gore fell through.

Devils Fiddle lift was put in as a way to access the rest of the mountain from the Northeast Passage entrance. Without Northeast Passage there is no need for Devils Fiddle.

steamboat1 · Dec 22, 2014

joshua segal said:
I suspect the shortening of Ramshead may be regretted by a bunch of Killington old-timers, but I doubt Killington regrets it. There was not a lot of trail capacity at the top of Ramshead and going from a double to a quad, doubled the uphill capacity with no increase in downhill capacity.

Trail capacity wasn't the issue for shortening Ramshead. There were/are 4 maybe 5 trails off the summit, more than there are now from the top of it's present location. The reason they shortened the lift was the difficulty of the trails above it's present top. They wanted to cater to more low intermediate skiers & the top section of the old Ramshead was far to difficult to accomodate them. I miss Vagabond from the top of old Ramshead, it's not even half the trail it used to be now.

freeski · Dec 22, 2014

Profile adds a little variety to Cannon's trails. Yes it's a little too wide, but this allows a lot of skiers to go fast making GS turns and yea they let it bump up sometimes. I would guess it was Canons answer to Outer Limits and White Heat. I used to ride the two T-bars and they were fun and fast (good memories). Planting some trees to the right of the lift would help with wind scouring the trail and protect the chair, but growing trees up there takes a long long time. A nice island of trees at the top of the trail would be nice too. You'd have to have something to protect them from the wind and harsh conditions to get them started.

C-Rex · Dec 22, 2014

How about those stupid loading/unloading conveyor belts? If they don't regret those, they sure should. I don't see it helping anyone. In fact, I think it just weirds people out and they actually end up having a harder time of it.

I also disagree with the idea of having beginner terrain off every lift. I think it's better for beginners to have their own area where they aren't getting buzzed and feeling like they're in the way, or being laughed at by the more skilled crowd. However, I do understand the need to have an easy trail down from the summit. Most beginners want to go all the way up at some point to see the view and be able to say they skied the whole way down.

deadheadskier · Dec 22, 2014

Loading Conveyors make a significant difference in ride time on fixed grip chairs. It brought the Spillway Chair at Sugarloaf from a 12 min ride, down to about 8. At Shawnee Peak in now takes only 9 minutes to get to the top when it used to be almost 14.

C-Rex · Dec 22, 2014

deadheadskier said:
Loading Conveyors make a significant difference in ride time on fixed grip chairs. It brought the Spillway Chair at Sugarloaf from a 12 min ride, down to about 8. At Shawnee Peak in now takes only 9 minutes to get to the top when it used to be almost 14.

So they actually run the lift faster when using the conveyor? It doesn't seem to at Mount Snow or Okemo.

BenedictGomez · Dec 22, 2014

Is this what you're talking about? I've never skied anywhere that had one of these.

Ski areas with buyer's remorse

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