Vermont Auditor: Should the State Re-Evaluate Ski Area Leases?

thetrailboss · Feb 18, 2015

SkiRaceParent said:
There are a lot of other states where I'd be a lot more worried than I am in Vermont about these issues....low population, strong tourism and natural resources and beauty will go a long way to keeping it sustainable. I agree there's an element of communism/socialism which needs to be neutralized in the standing government, but I feel like the tide is shifting (slowly) away from that direction.

Boy I hope that things on the ground are different than what I read and hear in the news from Vermont (VPR, WCAX, WDEV, Cal Rec, VT Digger) because it seems to me that folks forgot that there was a very close election in November and have doubled down on the "we need more money" routine instead of focusing on economic development, cost of living, and reducing property taxes. I think it will take at least another election before folks get the message that the average Vermonter is not happy with things in Vermont.

VTKilarney · Feb 18, 2015

SkiRaceParent said:
There are a lot of other states where I'd be a lot more worried than I am in Vermont about these issues....low population, strong tourism and natural resources and beauty will go a long way to keeping it sustainable. I agree there's an element of communism/socialism which needs to be neutralized in the standing government, but I feel like the tide is shifting (slowly) away from that direction.

Vermont has minimal marketable natural resources. Some granite, marble, and not much else. The timber industry is not nearly as big as people assume. And agriculture and tourism are about the lowest paying industries around.

And your comment about the direction state government is heading... Whaaaaat????

.

VTKilarney · Feb 18, 2015

thetrailboss said:
Bbecause it seems to me that folks forgot that there was a very close election in November and have doubled down on the "we need more money" routine instead of focusing on economic development, cost of living, and reducing property taxes.

The reason the election for governor was close is because the liberals didn't vote for the Democratic candidate because they thought that he was too conservative. If you compare votes for the Federal House race to the governor race, you can see that a lot of people didn't vote at all for governor.

There may be a silver lining in all of this. The last election may spur on the Progressives. When there is both a Progressive and Democratic candidate, the Republican candidate stands a chance.

BenedictGomez · Feb 18, 2015

VTKilarney said:
There may be a silver lining in all of this. The last election may spur on the Progressives. When there is both a Progressive and Democratic candidate, the Republican candidate stands a chance.

Are there now Republican candidates in Vermont?

From what I saw, you have far-left candidates (Vermont Democrats) and Democrat-Light (Vermont Republican) candidates. The people who run as "Republicans" in Vermont, would/could often be Democrats in other US states. At least that's how I recall it.

VTKilarney · Feb 18, 2015

BenedictGomez said:
Are there now Republican candidates in Vermont?

From what I saw, you have far-left candidates (Vermont Democrats) and Democrat-Light (Vermont Republican) candidates. The people who run as "Republicans" in Vermont, would/could often be Democrats in other US states. At least that's how I recall it.

The Vermont Republican party has been struggling with an internal rift. Within the last year or so the moderate faction of the party has taken control, albeit tenuously. If the party is to have any relevance in Vermont the moderates are the key to success. To have any chance of winning a statewide election the Republican candidate must be a moderate.

VTKilarney · Feb 18, 2015

The auditor responds:
http://vtdigger.org/2015/02/18/doug-hoffer-setting-record-straight-states-land-leases-ski-areas/

He still fails to address why it was worth his office's resources to audit leases that are not coming due for decades. Unless he advocates breaking contracts how can he justify this waste of resources?

BenedictGomez · Feb 18, 2015

VTKilarney said:
He still fails to address why it was worth his office's resources to audit leases that are not coming due for decades.

I added some snark about that. I'm also a bit worried that Smuggs is clearly in the cross-hairs. They cannot afford to a squeeze.

deadheadskier · Feb 18, 2015

BenedictGomez said:
I added some snark about that. I'm also a bit worried that Smuggs is clearly in the cross-hairs. They cannot afford to a squeeze.

Disagree. They can afford it most unless things have changed. I remember taking a resort management class at UVM. There was a panel of about a dozen ski area GMs in one of our classes. It was driven home by several people that Smuggs was the only ski area in the state that ran in the black every year for the past 20 seasons. Smuggs knows best how to balance their books and maintain profits. They'd adapt to a squeeze as good as anyone. Hopefully it never comes to that.

MadMadWorld · Feb 19, 2015

deadheadskier said:
Disagree. They can afford it most unless things have changed. I remember taking a resort management class at UVM. There was a panel of about a dozen ski area GMs in one of our classes. It was driven home by several people that Smuggs was the only ski area in the state that ran in the black every year for the past 20 seasons. Smuggs knows best how to balance their books and maintain profits. They'd adapt to a squeeze as good as anyone. Hopefully it never comes to that.

Making money....yes. Balancing the books.....not so much!

BenedictGomez · Feb 19, 2015

deadheadskier said:
Disagree. They can afford it most unless things have changed. I remember taking a resort management class at UVM. There was a panel of about a dozen ski area GMs in one of our classes. It was driven home by several people that Smuggs was the only ski area in the state that ran in the black every year for the past 20 seasons. Smuggs knows best how to balance their books and maintain profits. They'd adapt to a squeeze as good as anyone. Hopefully it never comes to that.

Well that's good to hear. I always assumed they operated on very slim profits given how bare bones the place runs. Smuggs reminds me of the old person who offers to buy his great-grandson an ice cream cone, then hands the kid 52¢ because he doesn't realize ice cream cones cost more like $2.75.

MadMadWorld said:
Making money....yes. Balancing the books.....not so much!

They obviously have terrible financial controls in place (more like lack-thereof), that's for sure.

thetrailboss · Feb 19, 2015

VTKilarney said:
The auditor responds:
http://vtdigger.org/2015/02/18/doug-hoffer-setting-record-straight-states-land-leases-ski-areas/

He still fails to address why it was worth his office's resources to audit leases that are not coming due for decades. Unless he advocates breaking contracts how can he justify this waste of resources?

BenedictGomez said:
I added some snark about that. I'm also a bit worried that Smuggs is clearly in the cross-hairs. They cannot afford to a squeeze.

I agree. While I am sure is a good auditor, I have to question why an office that has limited resources to begin with has decided that doing "an audit" of long term leases that are not coming due for renewal in two decades is a pressing issue. I don't think there is a large constituency clammoring to look at these leases nor should there be any reason to. It is not like Vermont has all of its issues solved--Vermont now has one of the highest rates of embezzlement by public officials and officials of small businesses. The cases are now coming out almost weekly. And yet we are auditing leases that are legal, binding, and nowhere remotely close to being renewed?

deadheadskier · Feb 19, 2015

MadMadWorld said:
Making money....yes. Balancing the books.....not so much!

That's right. They had an accountant robbing them blind didn't they. So, then they REALLY were doing a good job of still making money through all the ups and downs of a weather dependent business.

Vermont Auditor: Should the State Re-Evaluate Ski Area Leases?

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