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Vail to buy Stowe?

thetrailboss

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Vail corporate folks were at Stowe all summer. That's when the rumors started. Then they died down & this past weekend it flared again because serious Vail bigwigs were back. I have it on pretty good authority that the deal is done. It was a "you didn't hear this from me" situation so make of that what you will. But this is a very well connected money guy who said the deal was in the 300-400mil range

It would be a way for the remnants of AIG to cash out and leave the business. Though Mr. Starr would be rolling in his grave.

It would also spell an end to Stowe's Mountain Collective membership.
 

bdfreetuna

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I'm with BG. They used to allow reciprocal one ride up tickets on Sterling and Big Spruce for those who ventured over. If you had a season pass you just went to the lodge at Smuggs and they'd give you a one up ticket they'd collect at the lift. If you had a Stowe day ticket, the lifty would hole punch it. Worked the same way in reverse. 2000-2001 we would start almost every day at Big Spruce and do a lap down to the birthday bowls sometimes sneaking a few laps on Sterling before heading back over. The skate was maybe ten minutes back to Spruce across the pond. Loved it.

This makes the most sense. People who want to ski backcountry and end up at the other resort's base should be able to lift their way back without cost or hassle. Why not?

But a full interconnect, I agree along the same lines as K and Pico analogy.
 

benski

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Vail should be broken up. The extra competition would help bring down lift ticket prices. I doubt there are many benefits to such large scale operations for ski areas.

As for the interconnect idea. The lift would be slightly shorter than the Breckinridge Peek 6 connector lift so I guess it would be reasonable by there standards.
 

dlague

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It would be a way for the remnants of AIG to cash out and leave the business. Though Mr. Starr would be rolling in his grave.

It would also spell an end to Stowe's Mountain Collective membership.
Pretty sure that the mountain collective pass losing Stowe is not a big deal. Losing 2 days of skiing in the east. I never found MC Pass to be attractive.

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cdskier

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Vail should be broken up. The extra competition would help bring down lift ticket prices. I doubt there are many benefits to such large scale operations for ski areas.

Not sure I agree. Their walk up ticket prices may be high, but their Epic pass options are hard to beat for people interested in skiing the resorts in Vail's portfolio.
 

Jully

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Vail should be broken up. The extra competition would help bring down lift ticket prices. I doubt there are many benefits to such large scale operations for ski areas.

As for the interconnect idea. The lift would be slightly shorter than the Breckinridge Peek 6 connector lift so I guess it would be reasonable by there standards.

Vail is by far the most efficient resort operator in North America IMO. They've proven there are VAST benefits to large scale market share and management. Why do you think there aren't benefits?
 

SnowRock

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Pretty sure that the mountain collective pass losing Stowe is not a big deal. Losing 2 days of skiing in the east. I never found MC Pass to be attractive.

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Wouldn't be too sure of that. It was the tipping point for me to purchase it when they added Stowe and I personally know a few folks who did the same. To have a mountain part of that pass that I could drive too and already hit about 10 times a year made it a no brainer. I'm sure there are others like me that made the purchase when they added Stowe.

Don't love the idea of a vail purchase... having been up there between Christmas and New Years it seemed like the road/parking infrastructure was maxed out this year. Hadn't seen anything like it before in all my years going up there since I was in high school... would imagine with the epic pass you would add to that crowd.
 

benski

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Vail is by far the most efficient resort operator in North America IMO. They've proven there are VAST benefits to large scale market share and management. Why do you think there aren't benefits?
Diseconomies of scale. Unless you want to use market share to increase prices I don't see many benefits since not much can be centralized.
 

dlague

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Diseconomies of scale. Unless you want to use market share to increase prices I don't see many benefits since not much can be centralized.
What benefits are we talking about? I love our benefits. $609 and we have access to a lot of great mountains including Whistler, Park City, Tahoe and the resorts in Colorado. Practically unlimited.

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benski

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What benefits are we talking about? I love our benefits. $609 and we have access to a lot of great mountains including Whistler, Park City, Tahoe and the resorts in Colorado. Practically unlimited.

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Don't you have the Mountain Collective, and Max passes too for mountain owned by different operatores along with smaller local deals like Solitude and Brighton. But i am shocked to here its that cheep. Its not for sale so i can't see the price on there website.
 

cdskier

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Don't you have the Mountain Collective, and Max passes too for mountain owned by different operatores along with smaller local deals like Solitude and Brighton. But i am shocked to here its that cheep. Its not for sale so i can't see the price on there website.

The regular Epic Pass was $809 I believe at the early price. Don't believe that one had any restrictions on their US resorts. The Epic pass sales do incredible volume, although I believe the thought is that many of the passes are not used for tons of days (i.e. some easterners buy them and only take a few trips out west, which still is enough to cover the cost of the pass). But Vail also counts on people spending money on lodging, food, etc as part of their business model.
 

VTKilarney

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The chicken hasn't hatched yet, but where are all of the people who have always insisted that Vail would never buy a resort in the northeast? I've seen many such posts here.
 

4aprice

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I had heard a rumor that Vail was looking into buying Stratton, so maybe there is more interest in the east then previously thought.

A couple of areas in the east might cause me to look into it. What I wonder is will moves (or potential moves) like this force some of the "independents" (Smuggs, Bush, Jay etc) to team up for survival? Like I said in the Max Pass thread, I'm loving my season so far and planned the whole thing around those options.

Alex

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tumbler

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I had heard a rumor that Vail was looking into buying Stratton, so maybe there is more interest in the east then previously thought.

A couple of areas in the east might cause me to look into it. What I wonder is will moves (or potential moves) like this force some of the "independents" (Smuggs, Bush, Jay etc) to team up for survival? Like I said in the Max Pass thread, I'm loving my season so far and planned the whole thing around those options.



Alex

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I dont think Vail owning Stowe and/or Stratton is going to put anyone out of business. There are only so many beds, parking and so much uphill capacity that either of them can handle. If anything the potential overcrowding of the ski vacation experience will drive people to other mountains.
 

Jully

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Diseconomies of scale. Unless you want to use market share to increase prices I don't see many benefits since not much can be centralized.

Right, because centralization is the only possible benefit of large scale operations like Vail...
 

Jully

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I dont think Vail owning Stowe and/or Stratton is going to put anyone out of business. There are only so many beds, parking and so much uphill capacity that either of them can handle. If anything the potential overcrowding of the ski vacation experience will drive people to other mountains.

I mean, someone's gotta be there doing the overcrowding though!!

I wonder if it would drive easterners to take more western vacations similar to how the Texas family takes 2 ski trips instead of one with the Epic pass because the lift tickets are already paid for.
 

cdskier

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The chicken hasn't hatched yet, but where are all of the people who have always insisted that Vail would never buy a resort in the northeast? I've seen many such posts here.

I never had a serious opinion one way or the other until reading Ski, Inc recently. When I read Chris Diamond say he believed Vail would eventually look to enter the northeastern market, I thought someone with his insider knowledge and experience probably had a better grasp of things than people on this board saying they never would.
 
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