Equipment question

Ph0eniX · Feb 2, 2005

I haven't found a better forum to ask this so I'll post the question here (BTW - I think it would make sense to have an equpment forum - just MO).

Now to the point - I've been the #1 Rossignol fan since the 80's. The last pair of skis I bought were Viper X (high performance) back in '98/99. Yes, they're from the pre-shape ski era. I absolutely love them but they're getting old. I'd love to find a replacement for them but I have not seen anything even remotely similar on the market. I've tried all sorts of shape skis and to be honest I hate them all (Solomon Pilot 9/10, scream, all sorts of Rossi Bandits - you name it). I love the fact that my Vipers are long, heavy and stable which I can't say about any shape skis. What are my options?

Thanks in advance

DEVO · Feb 2, 2005

Volants.....VERY stable. If you live anywhere near Danvers you can pick up a pair at Sports Authority for CHEAP. They have Machete sins, genesis, fb's etc.

RossiSkier · Feb 2, 2005

Well the VIPER X Oversize continues your legacy:

Longest at 181cm; TIP/MID/TAIL - 109-68-92

Or just get yourself a pair of Bandits. A B1 or Bandit X should be fine. You can get them at 191cm, which is a long ski by today's standards. The TIP/MID/TAIL is 109-70-99 which is northeast ski.

You can get a pair of Bandit X 191's at the end of the season cheap. The 191's don't seem to see well and they're always marked down to about $150.

oneotwoandcounting · Feb 2, 2005

Skis

Hi Ph0eniX,

I went from straight skis to a pair of Rossi Vipers at 198 cm in 1998. Since than I have become a huge shaped ski fan. I also have gone from skiing the longest skis I could find in a ski shop to being an advocate of short shaped skis. Here’s my shaped ski history:

1998 Rossi Vipers @ 198 cm
1999 Fisher RC4 GS Shaped Ski @ 196 cm
2000 Solomon Pilot 10 @ 184 cm
2001 Atomic SL 11 @ 164 cm
2002 Volkl Vertigo @ 177 cm
2003 K2 AXIS mid-fats @ 171 cm (I have not yet skied these – they are going to be my western powder skis).

This year I have skied the Atomics and Volkls. The Atomics have over 100 days of skiing on them and I have to slow down or they become squirrelly. I used to ski them as fast as I did a previous Volant GS 208 cm skis. I have gone primarily to the Volks and ski them as fast as the old Volant GS skis. I have demoed an all mountain shaped ski at the maximum length they make it (191 cm) and hated them. I went to a shorter length (184 cm) of the same ski and loved them.

What helped me adjust to shaped skis alot was in 1998 I took weeks worth of lessons at Whiteface with their best "carving" ski instructor. He changed my skiing (for the better) for ever. I now ski much more two footed than before and unless I am in powder or the bumps I ski with my skies further apart (shoulder width) and do not unweight as much as I used to. Actually when I really get cooking I don’t unweight at all. I just pressure the tips at the start of the turn and tip both skies in the direction of the turn. The skies practically turn themselves as I feel them cross over under my body. In powder, the bumps, and on really steep trails I change the technique more to my old straight ski technique modified by hundreds (if not thousands) of miles on shaped skis.

I have friends that refuse to ski shaped skis and still manage to find straight skis some place but it’s getting harder and harder to find them. They also refuse to wear a helmet and one of them still wears jeans under his ski pants and 17 year old rear entry Solomon ski boots. Healso can ski circles around me on a 15-year-old Atomic straight ski. I ski pretty well but he is much better. No matter how good you are, unless you are Bode Miller (or the likes) there is always someone better than you are, especially at my advanced senior citizen age.

Anyway good luck in your pursuit of skis and I hope this rather long post helps you a bit.

Oh by the way. I have another skiing fanatic ski that bought a pair of Rossi Bandit Xs @ 177 cm and he skis faster than I do (or just about anyone else on the mountain).

thetrailboss · Feb 2, 2005

Welcome to AlpineZone, Ph0eniX. I hope you can stick around! :wink:

I'm sure that Greg will take your advice (as to a gear forum) seriously...not a bad idea for us "gearheads!" :wink:

Rossignols are great skis...I own a pair of the old 7SK's still...nice ride. RossiSkier is a great resource here for any questions regarding those models (and I see he has already replied).

Greg · Feb 2, 2005

thetrailboss said:
I'm sure that Greg will take your advice (as to a gear forum) seriously...not a bad idea for us "gearheads!" :wink:

http://forums.alpinezone.com/viewtopic.php?t=3154

Ph0eniX · Feb 2, 2005

Re: Skis

oneotwoandcounting said:
Hi Ph0eniX,

I went from straight skis to a pair of Rossi Vipers at 198 cm in 1998. Since than I have become a huge shaped ski fan. I also have gone from skiing the longest skis I could find in a ski shop to being an advocate of short shaped skis. Here’s my shaped ski history:

1998 Rossi Vipers @ 198 cm
1999 Fisher RC4 GS Shaped Ski @ 196 cm
2000 Solomon Pilot 10 @ 184 cm
2001 Atomic SL 11 @ 164 cm
2002 Volkl Vertigo @ 177 cm
2003 K2 AXIS mid-fats @ 171 cm (I have not yet skied these – they are going to be my western powder skis).

This year I have skied the Atomics and Volkls. The Atomics have over 100 days of skiing on them and I have to slow down or they become squirrelly. I used to ski them as fast as I did a previous Volant GS 208 cm skis. I have gone primarily to the Volks and ski them as fast as the old Volant GS skis. I have demoed an all mountain shaped ski at the maximum length they make it (191 cm) and hated them. I went to a shorter length (184 cm) of the same ski and loved them.

What helped me adjust to shaped skis alot was in 1998 I took weeks worth of lessons at Whiteface with their best "carving" ski instructor. He changed my skiing (for the better) for ever. I now ski much more two footed than before and unless I am in powder or the bumps I ski with my skies further apart (shoulder width) and do not unweight as much as I used to. Actually when I really get cooking I don’t unweight at all. I just pressure the tips at the start of the turn and tip both skies in the direction of the turn. The skies practically turn themselves as I feel them cross over under my body. In powder, the bumps, and on really steep trails I change the technique more to my old straight ski technique modified by hundreds (if not thousands) of miles on shaped skis.

I have friends that refuse to ski shaped skis and still manage to find straight skis some place but it’s getting harder and harder to find them. They also refuse to wear a helmet and one of them still wears jeans under his ski pants and 17 year old rear entry Solomon ski boots. Healso can ski circles around me on a 15-year-old Atomic straight ski. I ski pretty well but he is much better. No matter how good you are, unless you are Bode Miller (or the likes) there is always someone better than you are, especially at my advanced senior citizen age.

Anyway good luck in your pursuit of skis and I hope this rather long post helps you a bit.

Oh by the way. I have another skiing fanatic ski that bought a pair of Rossi Bandit Xs @ 177 cm and he skis faster than I do (or just about anyone else on the mountain).

I would love not having to change my quarter century old now technique to match the type of ski. I'm stubborn like that

Ph0eniX · Feb 2, 2005

thetrailboss said:
Welcome to AlpineZone, Ph0eniX. I hope you can stick around! :wink:

I'm sure that Greg will take your advice (as to a gear forum) seriously...not a bad idea for us "gearheads!" :wink:

Rossignols are great skis...I own a pair of the old 7SK's still...nice ride. RossiSkier is a great resource here for any questions regarding those models (and I see he has already replied).

I will stick around. I'm not sure how often I'll be posting though as I get pretty busy these days. Skiing used to be my passion for decades. These days it's a little difficult to find the time to do it a whole lot. Being a father/husband really gets in the way of things sometimes

I've been skiing for about 25yrs - grew up in Poland skiing mainly the ungroomed Tratra mountains ...been skiing on the east coast almost exclusively for the past 13yrs with just one small exception of a week long trip to Jackson Hole back in 2001. That was fun.

Thanks for your input everyone. I was looking at the Rossi Oversize. Perhaps that'll be my next ski.

oneotwoandcounting · Feb 2, 2005

Hi Again Ph0eniX,

You don't have to. It may take a while but you can ski shaped skies using straight ski technique. I still do it all the time and many of my skiing friends ski shaped skis and insist they haven't changed anything. If you buy a shaped ski designed for bump skiing it isn't nearly as radically shaped as others. GS skis also tend not to be as radical.

One of Whiteface's top instructors told me about carving twenty years ago and said unweighting were not necessary to turn your skis. He was definitely ahead of his time. He also told me there is more than one way to get down the mountain and turn technique varies with the terrain. My shaped ski-carving instructor insisted that no skidding was allowed. The head of Whiteface’s ski school had me (during that same year) practicing skidding my shaped skis down the mountain. He also insisted there is more than one way to get down the mountain. My skiing philosophy is to try a bunch of techniques and use the one that is easiest for the terrain and conditions. I think it's good to have a "quiver" of techniques as it's nice to have a "quiver" of skis.

What really matters is being on a mountain and having a great time. My youngest daughter raced for years and used to get on me for always thinking about what I was doing and working on technique. In her words she said, "stop thinking, just ski." Her words reminded me of a Yogi quote, "How can you think and hit at the same time? How can anyone argue with Yogi?

You can see Yogi quotes at: http://adkron.bizland.com/yogi.html

riverc0il · Feb 2, 2005

Ph0eniX said:
I love the fact that my Vipers are long, heavy and stable which I can't say about any shape skis. What are my options?

a volkl six star would definitely meet you're long, heavy, and stable criteria. what type of skiing will you be doing? you definitely don't want the bandits if you're looking for heavy and stable. if you want to maximize the performance on the shaped skis, a little alteration of your technique will go a long way. trust me, you'll enjoy skiing much more if you buy into the differenet technique and give it an honest shot. there's a reason shops don't sell straight sticks any more.

RossiSkier · Feb 3, 2005

Völkl's seem to be popular amongst posters here. To be diversified, here is some info on Volkl's latest models:

GS STOCK
Völkl P60 GC Racing Cup

SL STOCK
Völkl P60 SC Racing WC

CARVING HP
Völkl Supersport 6 Star

CARVING PERFORMANCE
Völkl Supersport 3 Star

CARVING SPORT
Völkl Energy 380

ALL-TERRAIN CROSS HP
Völkl Superspeed

ALL-TERRAIN CROSS SPORT
Völkl Supersport 4-Star

ALL-TERRAIN RIDE HP
Völkl 7 24 EXP

ALL-TERRAIN RIDE SPORT
Völkl 7 24 EXS

FREERIDE HP MID-FAT
Völkl 7 24 PRO

HP FAT
Völkl Karma

BIG FAT TWIN
Völkl Gotama

http://www.volkl.com/ski/

thetrailboss · Feb 3, 2005

Great info, RossiSkier!

Ph0eniX · Feb 25, 2005

Thanks again for all the info. After holding a few pair in my hands I'm leaning towards Volkl Superspeed (w/Marker AT/Motion):

. I can get them at a local Ski Barn for $760 which is the cheapest I've seen them so far.[/img]

billski · Feb 26, 2005

superspeed

I demo'd the superspeeds. and was blown away. My new love affair, I have yet to purchase. mountain magnets with helluva edging. Kind of a new gold standard for high speed stability. Never lost control once. The only thing I've heard is that they can wear you out later in the day (didn't for me, but I only skied them one day in one set of conditions) because they do require more work, you can't sit back with them.

GadgetRick · Feb 26, 2005

Straight vs. Shaped

This is an issue which pops up from time to time. I remember when I switched to shaped skis and I felt very uncomfortable on them. Why? The shaped skis want to turn for you. Honestly, once you understand this and don't try and fight it they are a LOT of fun. The suggestions to work with an instructor will make a huge difference in your enjoyment of shaped skis. You put a lot less effort into skiing shaped skis properly than skiing straight skis (in general).

The shaped skis are plenty stable enough at speed these days. Just give them a chance and you might really enjoy them.

Ph0eniX · Mar 2, 2005

Actually found them on eBay for $575 (brand new). Just came today. Can't wait to try them!

patentcad · Mar 13, 2005

I'm a long time Rossignol fan - I have both 203cm Rossi 7SK's and 205cm Rossi 7G's in the basement and loved both in their day. Back then (early 1990's) I never found a ski that could touch Rossignol in terms of liveliness, snap, versatility, overall feel.

Now it's a new day gear wise, and after 8 years off skis I demo'd Rossignol B1 and B2's on my first day back. They were competent, fine, but very forgettable (for me, I realize this is quite subjective). Nothing to write home about for this skier (47, expert to advanced, high speed GS/Super G skiing style and short swing fall line turns on steeper terrain).

But the new Volkl Supersport 5 Stars that I just purchased are another story. I'm every bit as jazzed about them as I used to be about my Rossignols, even moreso (see my comments in other threads) Now I can see why Volkls inspire such loyalty and so many raves. Best ski I've ever had, by far, without any hesitation whatsoever. I ski them in the 175cm length. For me the 5Stars utterly blow away those B1/B2's from Rossignol. They're not in the same league, at least for me. Demo for yourself....

Equipment question

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