• Welcome to AlpineZone, the largest online community of skiers and snowboarders in the Northeast!

    You may have to REGISTER before you can post. Registering is FREE, gets rid of the majority of advertisements, and lets you participate in giveaways and other AlpineZone events!

Most profit / biggest rip off in gear?

deadheadskier

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Joined
Mar 6, 2005
Messages
27,921
Points
113
Location
Southeast NH
What gear item do you think is the biggest rip off or more kindly, offers the greatest profit for a manufacturer.


To me, it's got to be climbing skins. I simply can't wrap my mind around a piece of fiber that you clip onto your skis being sold at $100-$160. Yes, I know deals can be had for less. Yes, I know I will need them for my intended uses and will fork over somewhere in the $80-$120 range and be very glad to have them at some point but.......

I still don't get it.

Some of the designer sunglasses and gloves you see out there blow me away too. Unless they're prescription I can' see how anyone would pay $100+ for sunglasses.
 
Joined
Aug 23, 2007
Messages
17,569
Points
0
What gear item do you think is the biggest rip off or more kindly, offers the greatest profit for a manufacturer.


To me, it's got to be climbing skins. I simply can't wrap my mind around a piece of fiber that you clip onto your skis being sold at $100-$160. Yes, I know deals can be had for less. Yes, I know I will need them for my intended uses and will fork over somewhere in the $80-$120 range and be very glad to have them at some point but.......

I still don't get it.

Some of the designer sunglasses and gloves you see out there blow me away too. Unless they're prescription I can' see how anyone would pay $100+ for sunglasses.

The price is only set where it is because that's what people are willing to pay. Most are not frugal like you. $150 sunglasses are crazy but you can pick up most of the high end Oakleys for $40-50 online..I think Ski boots at over $500 bust have quite a markup...In the industry I work in, a standard markup is about 250-300% and I imagine it's at least that in the ski industry...once ski shops become extinct and everything can be bought online, I see the markups decreasing..but for now several different people are profitting from everything. I think Turtlefur Balaclavas are a rip off..they must cost $2 to make but are about $30..but I try not to let prices bother me much..if I want it I buy it..and if it seems unreasonable then I usually go without it or find a better deal..
 

deadheadskier

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Joined
Mar 6, 2005
Messages
27,921
Points
113
Location
Southeast NH
perhaps it's because I'm used to wholesale mark ups. My business, my GP is 33% and we run with some of the highest margins in the industry. Of course when that gets to the stores, it's marked up 100% or 200% in a restaurant.
 

deadheadskier

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Joined
Mar 6, 2005
Messages
27,921
Points
113
Location
Southeast NH
I'd be interested in knowing how much a set of skins cost to manufacture. It can't be over $15
 

mondeo

New member
Joined
Mar 18, 2008
Messages
4,431
Points
0
Location
E. Hartford, CT
Skins don't seem that bad to me. It's not just a piece of fiber, it's an engineered fabric with directional properties and a glue that is very sticky but lasts mulitple applications. Plus the market isn't that big for them, so in order to cover overhead they probably have to charge a decent amount.

Anything top end qualifies as larger profit margin. Look at the difference in price between a 14 DIN binding and a 12 DIN. They might swap some plastic out for metal, or swap one metal for another, but the fundamental design doesn't change that much. But the people that feel the "need" for a 14 DIN binding are just as willing to pay $75 extra as $25.
 

roark

New member
Joined
Oct 28, 2005
Messages
2,384
Points
0
Location
Seattle WA
Like sunglasses the markup on goggles is insane. My dad used to manage a sunglass factory - we had more free raybans than you can impagine... can't cost more than a couple bucks to make high end goggles.
 

Trekchick

Active member
Joined
Oct 19, 2007
Messages
3,131
Points
36
Location
Reno - North Lake Tahoe
Knee joints! There, I said it.
C'mon, why does it cost tens of thousands of dollars for replacement of a knee when the one that came stock really cost nothing?
 

deadheadskier

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Joined
Mar 6, 2005
Messages
27,921
Points
113
Location
Southeast NH
Knee joints! There, I said it.
C'mon, why does it cost tens of thousands of dollars for replacement of a knee when the one that came stock really cost nothing?

should you happen to have a connection in the knee joint biz, let me know. ;)

Those 10K knees = far more pay for sales reps in that biz than where I am. Looking to get into medical sales and maybe bitch a bit less about the cost of skiing :lol:
 

Glenn

Active member
Joined
Oct 1, 2008
Messages
7,691
Points
38
Location
CT & VT
I used to work in a ski shop on my breaks in college. The owner was very cool and would give employees stuff for his cost....+15%. There's a pretty decent markup on a lot of things....skis, boards, jackets, pants...you name it. A lot of this stuff goes through a lot of channels. The guy who owned this shop wasn't calling up each company and order X# of products, he was part of a buying group. So I'm sure that added another layer to the cost structure.

I did order a snowboard directly from "Ride" one year. They had the board I wanted, but it was a "blem". By blem, I mean had a small scratch in the nose...nothing noticeable. I used that board for two seasons and then sold it for what I bought it for. Capitalism rawks.
 
Joined
Aug 23, 2007
Messages
17,569
Points
0
Capitalism rawks.

times two...alot of the racer dudes do that..buy skis at special proform pricing..ski them a few times but keep them in great shape..and then sell them for the same price or even a profit..is there a market for 2nd hand skins? I remember people from the ski vermont list making their own skins..
 
Joined
Jun 6, 2007
Messages
1,415
Points
0
Location
new hampster
. I think Turtlefur Balaclavas are a rip off..they must cost $2 to make but are about $30..

BINGO, we have a winner! Actually...Tutle Fur or Seirus masks come in a close second place to hand and toe warmers in terms of profit margin for most ski/board retailers. Those of you who think its equipment, think again...typically ski/board equipment (aka hardgoods) is the LOWEST profit margin in a snowsports retailer...even at full "street price" at the beginning of the year the margin in terms of % is lower for hardgoods than it is for sundries and accessories. And, typically, the more expensive things get at retail (in outdoor/wintersports) the lower the margin tends to be...the margin on those $150 shades is lower than it is on the $25 rack sunglasses that are crappy for your eyes anyway. Same is true for a bike shop...the margin in terms of % is much lower on a $3000 bike than it is on the first price point kids bike.
 
Joined
Jun 6, 2007
Messages
1,415
Points
0
Location
new hampster
The guy who owned this shop wasn't calling up each company and order X# of products, he was part of a buying group. So I'm sure that added another layer to the cost structure.

no...he's a member of a buying group because they negotiate for maximum discounts and terms for their members...so he ends up buying at a similar discount as someone like Ski Market or The Sports Authority even though his order is peanuts...the buying groups get a few points from dealer and they get a few points from the vendors and that covers their operating expenses...think of them more like a co-op...you pay a small membership fee each year and get to buy at lower prices. It doesn't add another layer of markup to the process...it helps smaller retailers be more price competitive with the big guys.
 

riverc0il

New member
Joined
Jul 10, 2001
Messages
13,039
Points
0
Location
Ashland, NH
Website
www.thesnowway.com
As a rule in retail, clothing has some of the highest mark up around. Soft goods are far more profitable than hard goods. And people wear out clothing faster than gear (gear ho's who buy new skis every year or two excepting). It is all about last years' gear in both soft and hard goods.

My opinion is the biggest jack is the top tier product lines. I just can't imagine their stuff is that much better than the mid-tier clothing that it warrants twice the price. The margin is the same for the retailer and manufacturer, but the increased cost just jumps the price into the stratosphere.

I am sure margins and markups in the ski industry are no different than those in other comparable retail sectors.
To me, it's got to be climbing skins. I simply can't wrap my mind around a piece of fiber that you clip onto your skis being sold at $100-$160. Yes, I know deals can be had for less. Yes, I know I will need them for my intended uses and will fork over somewhere in the $80-$120 range and be very glad to have them at some point but.......
There is a company selling skins direct to customers for around $100 a pair. I can not attest to the quality but I have read rave reviews online. A quick google search will pull up the site for you as I can not remember the name.

When I bought my skins, they were only about $120-130 tops less than half a dozen years ago. I have no idea what caused the dramatic increase in costs. I would have to imagine it is increased cost of production and not an increased mark up.
 

riverc0il

New member
Joined
Jul 10, 2001
Messages
13,039
Points
0
Location
Ashland, NH
Website
www.thesnowway.com
I'd be interested in knowing how much a set of skins cost to manufacture. It can't be over $15
I would be stunned if skins cost of production was anything less than $75 (don't forget R&D costs). That is some high tech equipment considering how versatile and long lasting the glue has to be. A product with inferior glue or hair would make for stunning difficult outings. When I got into BC, pretty much folks said go Ascensions or G3 and everything else was complete trash. Thankfully there are more options now. I will take other's experiences as truth and go forward with the understanding that there have been poorly designed skins out there that failed to work right.
 

snowmonster

New member
Joined
Jan 2, 2006
Messages
4,066
Points
0
Location
In my mind, northern New England
There is a company selling skins direct to customers for around $100 a pair. I can not attest to the quality but I have read rave reviews online. A quick google search will pull up the site for you as I can not remember the name.

That would be climbingskinsdirect.com.

Back to topic: Gore-tex fabrics. Not a rip-off because they deliver what they promise but the margins on those clothes must be really high. The Pro Shell is astronomically priced. I think it's like selling jewelry or a Ferrari: once a store rings up a sale on a GoreTex Pro jacket, they've met their margin for the month and can go on vacation (sarcasm). I don't think you can get a Gore Tex Pro jacket for less than $250. I know we're paying for the R&D on this but wow!
 
Top