Boy Scouts destroy Goblin Rock Formation

AdironRider · Oct 21, 2013

This story is interesting to me. Notably for the laughable backlash these guys got for tipping over a rock. I by no means condone the behavior, but a geologist buddy of mine did the math and the results really make this seem like nothing. Basically, when you do the math and realize how little force it took (breaks down to about 200 lb ft of force given rough estimates on the guys weight, etc), then if you do the math on how much pressure would apply if the wind blew in the right direction, and a 40-50mph gust would've taken that boulder down.

Basically this one rock happened to be ready to go during the next thunderstorm, so hardly worth making a fuss about. Furthermore it was a state park, so all that talk about a felony is pure internet bullshit.

dmc · Oct 21, 2013

Dude is lying through his teeth... thank god for videos so we can bust these idiots...

The douchebag needs to pay for his acts... somehow...

ScottySkis · Oct 21, 2013

dmc said:
Dude is lying through his teeth... thank god for videos so we can bust these idiots...

The douchebag needs to pay for his acts... somehow...

I hear on radio that police are arresting the accused.

thetrailboss · Oct 21, 2013

The BSA has thrown these guys out for violating the Leave No Trace policy.

Cannonball · Oct 21, 2013

AdironRider said:
Furthermore it was a state park, so all that talk about a felony is pure internet bullshit.

Is it not possible to commit a felony in a state park? Serious question, it's not something I know.

thetrailboss · Oct 21, 2013

Cannonball said:
Is it not possible to commit a felony in a state park? Serious question, it's not something I know.

The distinction between state and federal does not determine if it's a felony or not. I think what AR meant was that it is not a federal crime, which usually carry stiffer penalties. It could certainly be a felony under Utah law.

Cannonball · Oct 22, 2013

thetrailboss said:
The distinction between state and federal does not determine if it's a felony or not. I think what AR meant was that it is not a federal crime, which usually carry stiffer penalties. It could certainly be a felony under Utah law.

Gotcha, that makes more sense. So the whole 'it can't be a felony' thing was just pure Internet bullshit.

ScottySkis · Oct 22, 2013

Well in NYC were smoking cigarettes is a penalty you can be charged but in NY state park they can't charge you because it not against NY state law so you can smoke cigarette on west side park if you smoke which I don't in many years.

Nick · Oct 22, 2013

AdironRider said:
This story is interesting to me. Notably for the laughable backlash these guys got for tipping over a rock. I by no means condone the behavior, but a geologist buddy of mine did the math and the results really make this seem like nothing. Basically, when you do the math and realize how little force it took (breaks down to about 200 lb ft of force given rough estimates on the guys weight, etc), then if you do the math on how much pressure would apply if the wind blew in the right direction, and a 40-50mph gust would've taken that boulder down.

Basically this one rock happened to be ready to go during the next thunderstorm, so hardly worth making a fuss about. Furthermore it was a state park, so all that talk about a felony is pure internet bullshit.

To be totally fair I was sort of thinking the same thing. I mean.... it's nature. It was bound to fall over eventually. I've never been to this state park but I would assume there are probably rocks all over the ground from falling down naturally over time.

Still, you don't want idiots coming in and pushing them all over, it takes a long time to form and we should preserve it as much as we can. I'd rather have the wind push it over than these kids. But a felony still seems a little harsh to me, even if the kids are complete trash.

twinplanx · Oct 22, 2013

IT WAS NOT "THE KIDS"!!! These jack-asses WHERE the leaders. Good on the BSA for giving them the boot!

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thetrailboss · Oct 22, 2013

twinplanx said:
IT WAS NOT "THE KIDS"!!! These jack-asses WHERE the leaders. Good on the BSA for giving them the boot!

Sent from my SCH-S735C using Tapatalk

Yeah, watch the video Nick. Those were not kids.....these were grown men who, I think it is pretty clear, were screwing around.

Cannonball · Oct 22, 2013

Nick said:
To be totally fair I was sort of thinking the same thing. I mean.... it's nature. It was bound to fall over eventually. I've never been to this state park but I would assume there are probably rocks all over the ground from falling down naturally over time.

The fact that it's a rock that would have fallen over eventually isn't really the point. It's an attraction owned by the State (park). People think that stuff is cool enough to come all the way to the park and visit. That's what creates the value. Push over all the rocks....no more attraction....no more value to the State Park.

Let's say you have a State Park whose attraction happens to be artifacts or art (instead of a geologic feature). Some visitor comes in and smashes one of the pieces of art in your collection. Not a big deal? You've still got lots of other pieces in the collection and they weren't going to last forever anyway.

Nick · Oct 22, 2013

Cannonball said:
The fact that it's a rock that would have fallen over eventually isn't really the point. It's an attraction owned by the State (park). People think that stuff is cool enough to come all the way to the park and visit. That's what creates the value. Push over all the rocks....no more attraction....no more value to the State Park.

Let's say you have a State Park whose attraction happens to be artifacts or art (instead of a geologic feature). Some visitor comes in and smashes one of the pieces of art in your collection. Not a big deal? You've still got lots of other pieces in the collection and they weren't going to last forever anyway.

I know. I'm not disagreeing. Just a felony sounds harsh. Some penalty is in order to be certain, but prison and a felony conviction sounds kind of extreme to me.

The video alone shows what a moron the guy is.

AdironRider · Oct 22, 2013

No doubt these guys were total jackasses. I think we all agree on this. But as someone who has been to goblin valley, this also is like complaining that a blade of grass was stepped on in the badlands, or a pebble was removed from Acadia. There are thousands of these rock formations. Again, not condoning the behavior, but this wasn't some unique formation they built the whole park around either.

ctenidae · Oct 23, 2013

I wouldn't be against a felony conviction, simply because of the chain of ass-hattedness that occurred leading up to the decision to topple the rocks. I'm sure "Hey, y'all- watch this" was involved at some point. The fact that, in the whole group, no one's dumbass circuit breaker tripped causing them to call a halt to the tipping tells me that society is probably generally better off without them involved. Unfortunately, a felony conviction would only guarantee they became, in some greater way way, parasites on society, since we'd have to pay for them to be in prison or unemployable. The cameraman has apparently been on Headline News a lot around the Jodie Arias trial. Maybe he's tight with Nancy Grace.

thetrailboss · Oct 23, 2013

The dumbest thing that they did was to video it and then post it on YouTube. Boneheads.

Nick · Oct 24, 2013

Well the video basically speaks for itself.

Sort of reminded me of this video:

thetrailboss · Oct 24, 2013

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/57034653-78/video-goblin-hall-rock.html.csp

The plot thickens......the guy who shot the video has filed a "copyright claim" in order to remove the video from YouTube. (Damage is already done).

skiNEwhere · Feb 1, 2014

Nick said:
Just a felony sounds harsh. Some penalty is in order to be certain, but prison and a felony conviction sounds kind of extreme to me.

I agree. But looks like that's what they are officially being charged with, a 3rd degree felony

http://www.cnn.com/2014/01/31/us/utah-boulder-boy-scouts/index.html

If they do end up going to prison, they better start making up some good stories on why they're there.

jimk · Feb 4, 2014

In the old days they made bad guys break rocks when they were sent to prison. That would be poetic justice in this case ;-)

Boy Scouts destroy Goblin Rock Formation

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