Interesting to watch....
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Balsams Grand Resort teams up with ski industry legend Les Otten
- Thread starter bobbutts
- Start date
VTKilarney
Well-known member
You are misrepresenting what I said. I said that it is rough to encourage the state to have a steadfast negative position prior to obtaining the relevant facts. I think that the state should get the data before making a decision. I think that most people would find my position to be more reasonable.
Great! I didn't realize there was a contest.
Sorry you have a problem with me not wanting my state to be financially tied to the project. You know, I hope the lawmakers take a look about 75 miles to the east. About 12 years ago Saddleback had one of those fancy maps with all these lifts, trails and real estate development. It was going to be the next big mega-resort in the East and transform the Rangeley area. Fast forward to today and maybe 10% of what they wanted to accomplish has been done, and they're trying to sell. They sunk $40M into the place and are trying to get $12M.
People are free to think that the Balsams' story might have a different ending than Saddleback. I don't.
VTKilarney
Well-known member
There is no point in going around and around about this. You have pre-determined the matter and I am suggesting that the state should gather facts prior to making an ultimate decision. Our positions are clear. Move on.
mbedle
Well-known member
I find it interesting that their website says this resort will have the largest vertical drop of all east resorts! Not to sure about that fact, got to love marketing.
Edd
Well-known member
The Conway Daily Sun has an article today that mentions the golf course being a part of the initial phase, designed by Donald Ross, whoever that is.
drjeff
Well-known member
In the big scheme of things, the golf course and the other summer activites at the Balsams are a much more known commodity and won't be nearly the big gamble that the ski resort proposed expansion.
The Panorama Golf course there is a classic Donald Ross Design with great views, and one of the most memorable courses I've ever played. Reviving a golf course like that after a few years isn't nearly the challenge that massively expanding a ski area is and/or getting the pool area and hiking/paddle boat/kayak areas back into "working order"
drjeff
Well-known member
Donald Ross is(was) one of the most influential and significant significant golf course architects of all time! Truly one of the "legends" of golf course design not just in the United States, but all over the world. What he did during his heyday back in the early 1900's, in a time where earth moving wasn't nearly as easy as it is now, was spectacular and still gets rave reviews today, even to the point where many of his designs that have been in play for 100 years and have over time had some "evolving" (read as other people try and tweak what he initially did) often go through extensive reworking to undo the changes that others have done to his original design work and restore the course back to how he intended it to be - he was that good!
I get that, and I'm familiar with Ross courses, what I was really thinking was....they had the golf course before, they had the lake, they had the pool......and they went belly up. So I'm wondering if they are placing the entire turn around hope on the ski season and still running the resort the same in the summer which reminds me of the resort in Dirty Dancing or are they figuring out how to capture my demographic (30-50 years old with disposable income and many outdoor hobbies for all seasons).
drjeff
Well-known member
One of the reasons why they went belly up was that they gambled (and lost) that in this age of information overload and the apparent need for 24/7 immediate access connectivity to the web and various other media outlets, especially for kids, that their "old school" ways (there weren't even TV's in the rooms the last time I stayed there 8 or 9 years ago) that they'd be able to draw the younger families there, where the parents now with younger kids might have gone to The Balsam's with their patents and grandparents when they were growing up. Those families, when they saw something quite similar at The Mount Washington Hotel or The Mountainview, where they had all the charm of an old grand hotel but with modern amenities that will allow their kids to communicate with their friends at home, and still enjoy the outdoor majesty that the White Mountains offer, and often have a shorter drive to get there, helped seal the fate the the "old" Balsams IMHO
Even when it was "with the times", the place lost money every year. It was run as a hobby by a very wealthy man.
VTKilarney
Well-known member
That may be the reason it lost money. It was run as a hobby and not someone proficient in the industry. Who knows.
St. Bear
New member
Put a casino in. Problem solved.
The guy ran it for 50 years. He was on the Board for the New England Independent Resorts Association. I've known a few industry people who knew him and spoke well of his knowledge as well as the management staff that he hired to help him. I don't think his proficiency as a businessman was the issue. I know the company I used to work for, Ocean Properties Limited looked at buying it and deemed it would never turn a profit. OPL is the third largest family owned hotel company in NA and are no strangers to seasonal resorts owning pretty much half the tourism industry in Bar Harbor, the Sagamore in New York and other seasonal destinations.
That's a big factor as to why I don't want the State of NH getting involved. Everything OPL touches turns to gold. If they didn't want anything to do with it, that's telling.
thebigo
Well-known member
As a lifelong NH resident and lifelong skier, who would love to see this project built, I can assure any lawmaker that supports state involvement will never see another vote from me. NH has a viable four season resort area in north conway with terrible road access. Any available money would be much better spent upgrading rte 16. For scale the little bay bridge replacement between dover and portsmouth has a price tag in the $50M - $60M range. Granted the overall project has a much higher price tag but the bridge replacement alone is a project decades overdue that will impact far more lives than some investment secured with snow guns or high speed quads.
Private money would be lining up for a stake if the project was viable. Remember reading that somewhere north of ten banks were lined up to loan demoulas $1.5B. This is because low cost food stores in populated areas make sense, grandiose resorts in the middle of nowhere do not make sense, especially when the person leading the charge has a record of failure in the industry.
Private money would be lining up for a stake if the project was viable. Remember reading that somewhere north of ten banks were lined up to loan demoulas $1.5B. This is because low cost food stores in populated areas make sense, grandiose resorts in the middle of nowhere do not make sense, especially when the person leading the charge has a record of failure in the industry.
Jully
Active member
Very good point. How are the roads getting up there anyways? I get the impression that the roads north of Lancaster aren't the greatest.
If they do have $28 million to spend, there are infrastructure upgrades that would probably be better options. I also, unfortunately, don't think that if this bill fails the state will suddenly pump money into the Conway area though.
gmcunni
Active member
must be pissing off the K crowd.
from_the_NEK
Active member
If the Pico interconnect ever happens that would keep them pretty even.
ThinkSnow
Member
Shouldn't matter, as the Balsams is way too long of a drive for Kmart shoppers.
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