Jay Peak / Burke Sweepstakes

Zand · Jun 6, 2018

With both expected to be sold before the new season and the recent dominoes falling I thought this would be interesting to discuss.

I have to stick with my original gut feeling of Vail (I originally said this at least 3 months ago). But definitely a case can be made for quite a few companies.

Edit: Have to imagine Vail would take just Jay and sell Burke off to who knows what.

sull1102 · Jun 6, 2018

If Peak wants to keep up with the big guys even a little bit then they might want to find a way to get both mountains. Yes, Peak is not in the greatest place financially, but I think things are better now than say a year or two years ago before the EB-5 funding came through at Snow. Now if they can find a way to finance the acquisition Jay and Burke both fit into their portfolio, for Burke they do already run Wildcat which has 0 bed base and cannot change that factor so they are used to some challenges while knowing how to utilize that new hotel. Jay would be another Mount Snow quality property and if they got things firing on all cylinders I can see Jay becoming the crown jewel for the company overall.

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BenedictGomez · Jun 6, 2018

I selected "other" as my choice. My W.A.G. (Wild Ass Guess) is that by next ski season:

Jay Peak - bought by hedge fund

Burke - has no buyer*

*caveat being the hedge fund could be "forced" to take Burke if it wants Jay Peak, but likely only if a bidding war emerges

VTKilarney · Jun 7, 2018

Burke is not expected to be sold before this season. At a condo owner’s meeting, management said that Burke will take longer to sell than Jay. They anticipated the receiver running Burke through the entirety of this coming ski season.

But who knows... Things can change.

JDMRoma · Jun 7, 2018

It would be sweet if Peaks bought them both !! Id certainly get more use out of my Ranger Pass !!

gregnye · Jun 7, 2018

What's weird here is that Burke is actually the better off mountain infastructure wise. First, burke doesn't need any new lifts--everything has already been upgraded. Hpwever they are just so far out of the way that it's just worth driving the extra distance to Jay

I personally don't want Peaks buying Jay. It would then be overrun with Mt. Snow people. Also judging from the fact that Peaks hasn't invested anything into Attitash, I doubt they would do anything to make Jay a flagship resort. And that's bad because Jay desperately needs lift improvements. I don't see Peaks going in and replacing the Bonnie chair anytime soon. Instead I predict all that would happen will be more crowds that would rather instagram "powder skiing" than people who actually wanna ski.

Smellytele · Jun 7, 2018

I guess this should be a 2 part question. Who would you like to see buy them? Then who do you think will buy them?

Pez · Jun 7, 2018

We could easily do another poll: Who will purchase Smugglers?

gregnye · Jun 7, 2018

Smellytele said:
I guess this should be a 2 part question. Who would you like to see buy them? Then who do you think will buy them?

Not sure what company I would want to buy them. I kinda wish Jay and Burke could just be successful as independent resorts. If they did have to partner up, my perfect world would be Sugarbush being partners with them, as both mountains are similar vibes.

Another unpopular opinion, would be Jay Peak turning into Vermont's version of Cannon, as it is already basically the same thing (or was the same thing back in the day, before the waterpark was added). What I'm saying is: if no one wants to buy Jay, I'd be ok with the State of Vermont running it like NH runs Cannon, while contracting a business out to run the other things like the waterpark and hotels.

machski · Jun 7, 2018

Not sure who will buy Burke, but I think Alterra may have big interest in Jay. They would corner the Montreal market if they did, considering they already have Tremblant. Both are quasi Eastern destination resorts too now (Tremblant always with the village and Jay now with the new lodging/alternate attractions).

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gregnye · Jun 7, 2018

What's really sad about Burke is that it's actually an ok mountain. If it were on the 93 corridor in NH around Waterville Valley it would probably be thriving. However because it's in the middle of nowhere and not as big as the other destination resorts, it is forgotten.

sull1102 · Jun 7, 2018

gregnye said:
What's really sad about Burke is that it's actually an ok mountain. If it were on the 93 corridor in NH around Waterville Valley it would probably be thriving. However because it's in the middle of nowhere and not as big as the other destination resorts, it is forgotten.

And sadly there are dozens and dozens of NELSAPped areas with that exact problem, but they died off before the 80's.

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ss20 · Jun 7, 2018

I think I'd have to know more about who owns the big mountains up in Canada to answer this question... My guess is one of the companies/hills up there buys Jay to secure themselves against future swings in the CAD/USD.

FBGM · Jun 7, 2018

Hahahaha at people saying Peak is gonna but them. Peak has no money. All their money is funny money. They are upside down in debt up to their cocks. Look at their info. Their company net worth is less then the most recent vail purchase of Stevens Pass. Maybe if they sell some more drugs or ask the kooks for more funny money they will be good.

BenedictGomez · Jun 7, 2018

If someone bought Jay Peak and added it to a mega pass it would be the final nail in the coffin for weekend skiing there. The place is already overrun on a bunch of weekends.

BenedictGomez · Jun 7, 2018

gregnye said:
I'd be ok with the State of Vermont running it like NH runs Cannon

I've never been to Cannon, but if it's anything like the horrendous way government totally mismanages the New York ski areas in Keystone Cop fashion, I wouldn't be enthusiastic for that.

Government is rarely the answer to best run......... well....... anything.

JDMRoma · Jun 7, 2018

BenedictGomez said:
I've never been to Cannon, but if it's anything like the horrendous way government totally mismanages the New York ski areas in Keystone Cop fashion, I wouldn't be enthusiastic for that.

Government is rarely the answer to best run......... well....... anything.

Yup Cannon Sucks........dont go there ! All miss managed by the State !

gregnye · Jun 7, 2018

BenedictGomez said:
I've never been to Cannon, but if it's anything like the horrendous way government totally mismanages the New York ski areas in Keystone Cop fashion, I wouldn't be enthusiastic for that.

Government is rarely the answer to best run......... well....... anything.

I've never been to the state run ski areas of New York so I can't compare. Cannon seems to be run ok. But they don't have any hotels so it's literally just running the lifts. Is it the best ski area ever--no. But as locals say around there: "Keep Cannon shitty". Because that keeps the crowds down, the prices low (lower).

If New Hampshire's government, a republican state whose motto is "live free or die" can operate a ski area, I can't see why the citizens of Vermont wouldn't be ok with a similar operation at Jay Peak if managed correctly. As for Burke, yeah who knows.

Maybe, in this hypothetical scenario where Vermont runs Jay Peak, we could see a Cannon-Jay pass, which I'd buy!

Smellytele · Jun 7, 2018

BenedictGomez said:
I've never been to Cannon, but if it's anything like the horrendous way government totally mismanages the New York ski areas in Keystone Cop fashion, I wouldn't be enthusiastic for that.

Government is rarely the answer to best run......... well....... anything.

Cannon has been run better in the last few years with an influx of money from the FSC and also the leasing of Sunapee (now to Vail) has helped.

Killingtime · Jun 7, 2018

gregnye said:
I've never been to the state run ski areas of New York so I can't compare. Cannon seems to be run ok. But they don't have any hotels so it's literally just running the lifts. Is it the best ski area ever

Of the three NYS ORDA resorts, Gore is terrific, Belleayre is meh and I'll most likely never be back and I haven't skied Whiteface yet.

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