Waterville Valley Lift Issues - Page 2

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  1. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by machski View Post
    If you are talking the T-Bar, it's an LST if I recall correctly.

    As to management lift decisions, the current management inherited the Green Triple from the previous management who cheapped out to get Green going and then sell. WV's biggest problem in my opinion is lack of terrain. Green helps, but they still can't grow too much variety. The current management has made some decent improvements I think (Lodge especially), but the lift infrastructure is going to need some big investments soon. Same goes with a lot of New England.

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    If WV could ever expand onto Tecumseh, it'd rival Cannon for the best skiing 2 hours from Boston. Top 3 in NH. I think the USFS has basically said no permanently to that though so they're stuck going towards Green.

    WV reminds me a lot of Attitash actually. Lift issues, crowd issues due to the mountain layout (80% of people ski White Peaks), and they groom EVERYTHING. While the Attitash terrain is a bit steeper and more engaging, the WV trails are not Okemo/Snow/Stratton IMO (which actually hurts them with family appeal I think). They could be cool bumped up, especially Sunnyside.

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jully View Post
    If WV could ever expand onto Tecumseh, it'd rival Cannon for the best skiing 2 hours from Boston. Top 3 in NH. I think the USFS has basically said no permanently to that though so they're stuck going towards Green.

    WV reminds me a lot of Attitash actually. Lift issues, crowd issues due to the mountain layout (80% of people ski White Peaks), and they groom EVERYTHING. While the Attitash terrain is a bit steeper and more engaging, the WV trails are not Okemo/Snow/Stratton IMO (which actually hurts them with family appeal I think). They could be cool bumped up, especially Sunnyside.
    They need to do the Village to top of Green expansion they have plans for. Would add a bunch of blue and green plus link the lodging to the hill. But that is a lot of $$ and a lot of lower elevation terrain to have to cover with snowmaking

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  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by machski View Post
    They need to do the Village to top of Green expansion they have plans for. Would add a bunch of blue and green plus link the lodging to the hill. But that is a lot of $$ and a lot of lower elevation terrain to have to cover with snowmaking

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    Thought the plan was just a gondola from the village up to the lodge.
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  4. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Smellytele View Post
    Thought the plan was just a gondola from the village up to the lodge.
    Basically. It's a dozen-ish trail terrain pod of lower intermediate terrain with a new lodge at the bottom and a gondola from the down square. Would be a game changer for families. With Loon going upscale I bet there's a market too (as much as the word market and skiing can be used together).

    Agreed with Machski's concerns though.

  5. #15
    I think people overstate the importance of replacing lifts after 30 years. These devices cost millions of dollars, and are mostly non moving parts. A thirty year old lift should not have any problems replacing the drive terminal, sheave wheels and return terminal cannot fix, and I am not sure you even need to do all that for a lift to run like new, and work very well into its 50's like Sugarbush's Valley House.

  6. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by benski View Post
    I think people overstate the importance of replacing lifts after 30 years. These devices cost millions of dollars, and are mostly non moving parts. A thirty year old lift should not have any problems replacing the drive terminal, sheave wheels and return terminal cannot fix, and I am not sure you even need to do all that for a lift to run like new, and work very well into its 50's like Sugarbush's Valley House.
    I'm not a lift engineer (so apologies if this is insulting/dumb) but it seems like that theory is harder to apply to detach lifts. I agree with you for fixed grips, but the older detach chairs I see are really struggling these days even after resorts spend millions replacing the guts. I'm maybe biased because of Barker at Sunday River though...

  7. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Jully View Post
    I'm not a lift engineer (so apologies if this is insulting/dumb) but it seems like that theory is harder to apply to detach lifts. I agree with you for fixed grips, but the older detach chairs I see are really struggling these days even after resorts spend millions replacing the guts. I'm maybe biased because of Barker at Sunday River though...
    I have seen that too. I am not sure why they look much worse than old fixed grip chairs. Greek peek recently bought an old tipple from Wyndham and seams to have a lot of chairs and towers, buy no drive terminal. They lost some terrain to store them so the parts must be useful.

  8. #18
    Green Peak should have been a detach quad from the start. Reusing the world cup triple on new prime intermediate terrain showed that ownership was broke. What the world cup triple should have been used for is to replace the northside and high country doubles with a single lift in a new alignment and hopefully cut a couple new trails from the summit down into the northside ravine.

    And white peaks is going to need to be replaced soon. That quad is roughly 30 years old and has a lot of hours being the main lift on the mountain. A bubble six would be a perfect replacement.

  9. #19
    machski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jully View Post
    I'm not a lift engineer (so apologies if this is insulting/dumb) but it seems like that theory is harder to apply to detach lifts. I agree with you for fixed grips, but the older detach chairs I see are really struggling these days even after resorts spend millions replacing the guts. I'm maybe biased because of Barker at Sunday River though...
    Well, Barker along with Superstar/Snowshed/Both Pico's and Grand Summit are Poma converted Yans, so tough to compare them against any other aging HSQ. But both Poma and Dopp have made huge changes to the grip sets and cadence systems in the current lineups vs their legacy equipment, and it's not cheap to just change out.

    As to just "upgrading" FG lifts, sure you can replace the drive and return terminals and maybe change out the sheave sets (depends on the cross arm design), but as the foundation pour type that Spruce at SR showed, it may be prudent to replace towers for new footings. Replacing the drive and return terminals is probably 2/3 the cost of a totally new lift. Also remember, most of the towers are well beyond any type of manufacturer liability limits, so the resort shoulders all of that if they don't do all totally new. Not cheap insurance wise, probably more cost effective to just do all new.

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  10. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by xlr8r View Post
    Green Peak should have been a detach quad from the start. Reusing the world cup triple on new prime intermediate terrain showed that ownership was broke. What the world cup triple should have been used for is to replace the northside and high country doubles with a single lift in a new alignment and hopefully cut a couple new trails from the summit down into the northside ravine.



    And white peaks is going to need to be replaced soon. That quad is roughly 30 years old and has a lot of hours being the main lift on the mountain. A bubble six would be a perfect replacement.
    Completely agree with everything you said here. World Cup Triple to that shoulder alignment replacing Northside and High Country would have changed the mountain in a very major way. White Peaks is aging quickly, it was one of the very early detach lifts so tech wise things have changed a little bit. It is also run pretty much any day the resort is open even going back to years past when they would open with just HC and run downloading on White Peaks.
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