The "Sugarbush Thread"

njred said:

I like this idea.. neither Alta nor Squaw has the double diamonds,.. and those ski places run just fine.

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Double-Diamonds are fine and I can see them being useful. There's a definite difference between a trail like Cliffs vs FIS or Black Diamond at ME. And a big difference between trails like CR Run, Cotillion, and Middle Earth vs Liftline and Rumble on CR peak. I think the double-diamonds make sense to at least give some guidance to new people. I may not agree with each individual trail rating (i.e. Ripcord is really a questionable double unless it is a sheet of ice).

I'm kind of new here so I hope you guys don't mind me chiming in so much. I feel like ripcord is for the people who absolutely have to ride HG and ski a "Double" so they can go home feeling like they got the goods.

Squaw's old trail map didn't even rate runs..just the lift.
And if you want to run natural trails you can find skis made for them..hardened thick edges and bases. A little research needed but not all skis are made equal..

Powder Whore said:

I'm kind of new here so I hope you guys don't mind me chiming in so much. I feel like ripcord is for the people who absolutely have to ride HG and ski a "Double" so they can go home feeling like they got the goods.

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100%. Any given weekend you’re almost sure to see some person skidding down ripcord over-and-over-over again from the chair if you spend enough time lapping HG.

Keeps the traffic down on OG and Paradise tho so I ain’t complaining.

shadyjay said:

If Sugarbush patrol thinks a trail should be closed, then up goes the rope. And like I've said before... if the rope is up, it's up for a reason!

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I do generally abide by the ropes, but there are definitely exceptions to that SB "it's up for a reason."

One powder day at ME a bunch of years ago, Lower FIS remained roped. Saw a few poachers from the lift, I followed suit with my crew, and headed straight back up for another round. Conditions were absolutely prime and the runout was covered.

shadyjay said:

I think Hammond addressed it quite well in the video. If you don't like the way the trail looks, don't take it! Don't knock people who will. It's their choice. I used to look at those trails and be like "yeah, right" and move on.... way beyond my ability, but if someone wants to have at it, then go for it! I believed Sugarbush had/has some of the best skiers around, and they didn't get that good by just skiing the groomers. And that goes for the patrollers too... excellent skiers and riders! If Sugarbush patrol thinks a trail should be closed, then up goes the rope. And like I've said before... if the rope is up, it's up for a reason!

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There is a pattern to patrol dropping ropes at Sugarbush, weekend before last was a example, almost no ropes were dropped on Saturday or Sunday, come Monday & Tuesday almost all came down. I get it dropping the ropes with such thin cover on the weekend will be a nightmare for patrol. Midweek rope drops, trails get skied and by the next weekend they look like hell, so the majority of the tourists will stay off them.

Many years ago Ripcord was rarely groomed and was wall to wall bumps. The second pitch is also one of the steepest on the mountain although it is short. Jester and OG were groomed every night. That made Downspout even worse with a lot of traffic coming off OG.

Exactly this. I prefer it like this and it makes total sense. I just wish they didn't blow the really hard pack snow on OG early season and then leave it. It makes for some very hard and fast conditions until we get an large amount of snow.

few thoughts - agree with 'some of the best skiers/riders in the East'. Trails open mean it's doable, but take responsibility. It's a risk, just like getting over the Rox Gap in April in 2-WD and low height vehicle.
Recall the only bumped up days of Ripcord. But those 'sliders' who keep. going up and down and up and down - we were all there at one point - reason we improved. We didn't learn how to control speed or edge hard pack/ice on Jester.

There are a few of us who almost (I mean almost) prefer CR being hike to only. But even that pod. is self-limiting. Always wondered what % of those newer expert wanna-be's take CR Run as opposed to ME or Liftline/Rumble. I bet it's 60% ( or they take CR to lower LL to avoid headwall.)

Either way, snow making was. great this past weekend and its impossible to compare it to other years or teams. Weather, $$, management, employment, and crowds all factor in. Heard from employee there was 30% of normal holiday week crowd on the slopes. Between weather and Cold, that makes perfect sense to me.

Have never been in a longer than 5-8 min line except once on HG in 8 days.

Hawk said:

Exactly this. I prefer it like this and it makes total sense. I just wish they didn't blow the really hard pack snow on OG early season and then leave it. It makes for some very hard and fast conditions until we get an large amount of snow.

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What can be done to change this? I skied at SB on 12/28-30 and OG was one of the best runs from an edgeable snow standpoint and there was pretty solid amount of people on it. I also skied at SB on 1/9-10 and OG looked pretty slick and there were very few (almost none) people on it.

Wait for colder temps, deep groom it and then blow a thick layer of snow with less water content. Up the air. Or wait for a huge dump to be in the forecast and deep groom it the day before.

tumbler said:

Many years ago Ripcord was rarely groomed and was wall to wall bumps. The second pitch is also one of the steepest on the mountain although it is short. Jester and OG were groomed every night. That made Downspout even worse with a lot of traffic coming off OG.

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I think thats exactly right. Ripcord was designated double black when it was ungroomed and left to bump up. IIRC, It wasn't until about 10 years ago that they started grooming it regularly.

Hawk said:

Wait for colder temps, deep groom it and then blow a thick layer of snow with less water content. Up the air. Or wait for a huge dump to be in the forecast and deep groom it the day before.

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They are blowing snow again, but I heard that they are running low on water in the pond.

Powder Whore said:

I'm kind of new here so I hope you guys don't mind me chiming in so much. I feel like ripcord is for the people who absolutely have to ride HG and ski a "Double" so they can go home feeling like they got the goods.

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chime away! Where in NJ are u coming from? Im originally from englewood.

About 10 years ago, we had a family come up for the day from their place at Okemo. They insisted on skiing paradise. The Mom, took off her skis on the top section and hiked back up. Dad wasn't much better but eventually made it down, although the kids were psyched.

Steins that is Howie!

HowieT2 said:

I think thats exactly right. Ripcord was designated double black when it was ungroomed and left to bump up. IIRC, It wasn't until about 10 years ago that they started grooming it regularly.

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I like the switch in strategy on those two trails. OG seems to hold snow better so it can be a lot of fun bumped up. RC is fun to hit first thing in the morning on a fresh groom to just rip down.

HowieT2 said:

chime away! Where in NJ are u coming from? Im originally from englewood.

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Either I never knew that or I forgot...I've lived in Bergen county most of my life.

cdskier said:

Not necessarily a lot of businesses and they've changed a bit over the years, but what little is there was always great. For a while you had one of the best NY-style pizza places around in SB village (Pizza Soul). I would easily take Pizza Soul over most of the pizzerias by me in NJ. Pizza Soul moved a year or so ago over to the plaza in Waitsfield by Mehurons (he didn't want to leave, but the tenant upstairs from him was constantly suing the landlord over stupid things like the smell of pizza and the "heat" from the pizza oven making the apt above it hot, etc. The landlord always won, but was just tired of fighting in court all the time).

Then there's Mutha Stuffers. They're a sandwich shop and make some good stuff (uses Boar's Head cold cuts and Dino, the owner is originally from Staten Island). Dino also has the bar over there called "The Rex". That part I've never been overly blown away by, but it was a good option for a quick burger close to my condo if I didn't want to drive down to town (particularly if weather was bad).

For a long time Mutha Stuffers and Pizza Soul were my lunch options to avoid eating in the lodges.

There's also Chez Henri which I believe is the oldest restaurant in the valley (been there over 50 years). It is a French bistro type of place and definitely on the pricey side. To me it isn't worth it, but others may disagree.

There's also a ski shop and a daycare center. Not sure what else is there this season. I heard there's another new take-out food place under Mutha Stuffer's but I know nothing about it.

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thanks - i knew of chez henri but then realized i had never seen it. i will take a drive that way next time i am there. i assume you keep going straight where you would turn left to enter the main parking lot or right to enter the overflow lot at lincoln peak. i always just assumed condos/homes were down there, not businesses. maybe chez henri with the lady when the world returns to some sort of normal. next season.

Couple of things here-

First, trail ratings are designed to show the relative difficulty of trails at a particular mountain. Black means trail is the most difficult at this mountain, etc. Double black was created 20-25 years ago to further differentiate those that fell in the black diamond category. Think Cliffs vs Paradise at Sugarbush or Hayride vs Starr at Stowe.

Next, on thin cover- I am sure some that are new to Sugarbush are a bit surprised that the perfunctory "Thin Cover" sign actually means what it says. Sugarbush is, and always has been, a skier's mountain and this policy reflects that. I recall being at a certain mountain south of here that actually had large signs at the top of certain trails warning of "MOGULS". The horror! and yes, their Double Black trails are not quite on par with those at Sugarbush (see above). I did feel a little bad for those skiing Inverness on Sunday and had to navigate the waterbars on the bottom of Semi-Tough. I think that caught a lot of people off guard.

My thoughts on the Village:
- Chez Henri is fantastic. It's not a bar and grill so if that is what you are looking for, go elsewhere. Worth the $ for fondue and a true dining experience.
- Mutha Stuffas has the best italian sandwich around. Dino is awesome and has really put a lot of energy into the Village space over the years- no easy task.
- the new place downstairs (sorry I forgot the name). Combo store and takeout, very nicely set up. Got some really good grilled burrito/wrap items there. It also looks like they are well set up for grab-and-go breakfast sandwiches. We were there late afternoon so we did not see those. Go here and support!

lol. the bottom of semi tough was not fun saturday, that's for sure.

honestly i am kinda shocked the village businesses can sustain themselves. I've been skiing sugarbush for years, always stay in off mountain lodging as far as montpelier or Waterbury, and i just learned these places exist. i imagine most visitors are totally ignorant of their existence.

KustyTheKlown said:

thanks - i knew of chez henri but then realized i had never seen it. i will take a drive that way next time i am there. i assume you keep going straight where you would turn left to enter the main parking lot or right to enter the overflow lot at lincoln peak. i always just assumed condos/homes were down there, not businesses. maybe chez henri with the lady when the world returns to some sort of normal. next season.

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Yes, literally the next driveway on the left after passing the main parking lot entrance. You can also take the "Out to Lunch" trail to ski to the covered bridge leading to SB village.