The "Sugarbush Thread"

ericfromMA/NH/VT · Nov 16, 2022

They did this with the GH terrain in 2019, we were there for thanksgiving. It was a good time and cost us 29 bucks per person to ski.

This year its $99 per person for a lift ticket. That's the joke. We were considering doing it again but for $99 bucks per person? no thanks.

The thanksgiving buffet is AWESOME btw...

cdskier · Nov 16, 2022

ericfromMA/NH/VT said:
They did this with the GH terrain in 2019, we were there for thanksgiving. It was a good time and cost us 29 bucks per person to ski.

This year its $99 per person for a lift ticket. That's the joke. We were considering doing it again but for $99 bucks per person? no thanks.

The thanksgiving buffet is AWESOME btw...

Opening day in November 2019 also had VH terrain opened...not just GH. They also did a soft open that year on Friday for pass-holders.

Blurski · Nov 16, 2022

Los said:
So 6 inches at the most... Not that 6 inches isn’t great, but actual snowfall seems to almost always fall far short of predictions (very generally speaking)… I immediately halve the estimate so I keep my expectations in check. I can’t cope with disappointment!

Things are setting up for some nice upslope activity starting Thursday evening into Sunday.

Jhammond · Nov 16, 2022

I know the expert skiers will be disappointed in a Gate House opening but when looking at the forecast we could see only limited snowmaking temps to the base so we went with the GH side to get open and start skiing. It can open with less snow then you need on a steeper trail like Spring Fling and the load area of the VH lift. Going with Bravo was not an option as the spacing on the hydrants below HG are too spread out and it is a lot of ground to cover to get it open with no natural base and marginal temps. We also really did not want to open with downloading. When Killington which has over 5 times the water and air capacity is opening only 2 days earlier I think some of you seasoned posters should appreciate that we will be opening on time 11/19.
The forecast starting Friday looks cold through the weekend and into the early part of the week and we intend to get the Valley House lift open as soon as we can because we also like skiing steeper terrain and that should come in quicker then downspout to the base.
As for Mount Ellen, again with the warm temps in the base we knew making snow on Inverness was not going to be successful so we tried to lock in training space for the WC athletes and for GMVS so they can train and not interfere with the public skiing. We will be moving down to Inverness by the weekend.

Hope to see you on the mountain on Saturday
John

Here is a graph of the average base temps since our electric meter read

SteezyRob · Nov 16, 2022

I don't think that Pushover's that bad. It's one of the more interesting trails they could've opened first, and it's only for a day or two.

Blurski · Nov 17, 2022

Jhammond said:
I know the expert skiers will be disappointed in a Gate House opening but when looking at the forecast we could see only limited snowmaking temps to the base so we went with the GH side to get open and start skiing. It can open with less snow then you need on a steeper trail like Spring Fling and the load area of the VH lift. Going with Bravo was not an option as the spacing on the hydrants below HG are too spread out and it is a lot of ground to cover to get it open with no natural base and marginal temps. We also really did not want to open with downloading. When Killington which has over 5 times the water and air capacity is opening only 2 days earlier I think some of you seasoned posters should appreciate that we will be opening on time 11/19.
The forecast starting Friday looks cold through the weekend and into the early part of the week and we intend to get the Valley House lift open as soon as we can because we also like skiing steeper terrain and that should come in quicker then downspout to the base.
As for Mount Ellen, again with the warm temps in the base we knew making snow on Inverness was not going to be successful so we tried to lock in training space for the WC athletes and for GMVS so they can train and not interfere with the public skiing. We will be moving down to Inverness by the weekend.

Hope to see you on the mountain on Saturday
John

Here is a graph of the average base temps since our electric meter read
View attachment 55062

Open is open, does not matter to me, remember it was in the 60’s with a couple inches of rain less than 1 week ago.
I say brovo to mountain.

Newpylong · Nov 17, 2022

Jhammond said:
I know the expert skiers will be disappointed in a Gate House opening but when looking at the forecast we could see only limited snowmaking temps to the base so we went with the GH side to get open and start skiing. It can open with less snow then you need on a steeper trail like Spring Fling and the load area of the VH lift. Going with Bravo was not an option as the spacing on the hydrants below HG are too spread out and it is a lot of ground to cover to get it open with no natural base and marginal temps. We also really did not want to open with downloading. When Killington which has over 5 times the water and air capacity is opening only 2 days earlier I think some of you seasoned posters should appreciate that we will be opening on time 11/19.
The forecast starting Friday looks cold through the weekend and into the early part of the week and we intend to get the Valley House lift open as soon as we can because we also like skiing steeper terrain and that should come in quicker then downspout to the base.
As for Mount Ellen, again with the warm temps in the base we knew making snow on Inverness was not going to be successful so we tried to lock in training space for the WC athletes and for GMVS so they can train and not interfere with the public skiing. We will be moving down to Inverness by the weekend.

Hope to see you on the mountain on Saturday
John

Here is a graph of the average base temps since our electric meter read
View attachment 55062

You folks should be confident, those are all sound reason/decisions. Can't please everyone, only can do your best.

Castlerockrisk · Nov 17, 2022

John thanks for the update, considering the unusual warm weather your team has had some pretty significant challenges and I think that it is great that you will be open before Thanksgiving. How did the snow making pond Dam and inflation bladder work out- how are we doing with water? Looking forward to a snowy season

1dog · Nov 17, 2022

Jhammond said:
I know the expert skiers will be disappointed in a Gate House opening but when looking at the forecast we could see only limited snowmaking temps to the base so we went with the GH side to get open and start skiing. It can open with less snow then you need on a steeper trail like Spring Fling and the load area of the VH lift. Going with Bravo was not an option as the spacing on the hydrants below HG are too spread out and it is a lot of ground to cover to get it open with no natural base and marginal temps. We also really did not want to open with downloading. When Killington which has over 5 times the water and air capacity is opening only 2 days earlier I think some of you seasoned posters should appreciate that we will be opening on time 11/19.
The forecast starting Friday looks cold through the weekend and into the early part of the week and we intend to get the Valley House lift open as soon as we can because we also like skiing steeper terrain and that should come in quicker then downspout to the base.
As for Mount Ellen, again with the warm temps in the base we knew making snow on Inverness was not going to be successful so we tried to lock in training space for the WC athletes and for GMVS so they can train and not interfere with the public skiing. We will be moving down to Inverness by the weekend.

Hope to see you on the mountain on Saturday
John

Here is a graph of the average base temps since our electric meter read
View attachment 55062

Whatever our (multiple) opinions are ( like nostrils, we all have a couple) we appreciate your communication. Makes da' Bush unique, unlike other large areas. Good forecast at 1600' too temp-wise:

Mount Ellen (Vermont) Weather Forecast (1244m)

Mount Ellen (Vermont), Green Mountains, Appalachians, United States Mountain weather forecast for 1244m. Detailed 6 day mountain weather forecast for climbers and mountaineers.

www.mountain-forecast.com

cdskier · Nov 17, 2022

The reason for GH over VH makes sense with those trails needing less snow to open. However given the base area temps I still don't quite understand why they didn't just shift the focus to upper mountain terrain where temps were much better and use downloading on SB. It has been done in the past as recently as last year and at least to me offers a far better skiing product than GH terrain. Trying to force lower mountain terrain open with very marginal temps on the lower mountain is just a bit odd to me.

On a side note, nice to see John make his first post here! It is great to see management participate here. We had that for a long time with Win and it is much appreciated. Welcome and sorry for giving you guys a hard time, but I'm just one person with an opinion. I'm not going to deny that my opinions can be critical at times, but when SB does things well, I'm also very vocal with praising those situations...

tumbler · Nov 17, 2022

John- Thanks for posting. Question, when you move over to VH for SB->Fling would you consider also running Lower SB-> Racer's Edge or Spring Road to get more terrain open then move up top? Those don't take too much. Could also add Stein's & Coffee Run but that is too much runtime. I agree that downloading stinks and Jester->DS is a huge amount of terrain to cover and takes more capacity than what you have.

teleo · Nov 17, 2022

John thanks for keeping us informed here. Very much appreciated. Hope it continues.

We all of course want more opened. I was hoping both sides for this weekend too. But given this week didn't stay cold and I was mtn biking and saw kayaks in the valley 2 weeks ago, just glad to be able ski this weekend.

slatham · Nov 17, 2022

Jhammond said:
I know the expert skiers will be disappointed in a Gate House opening but when looking at the forecast we could see only limited snowmaking temps to the base so we went with the GH side to get open and start skiing. It can open with less snow then you need on a steeper trail like Spring Fling and the load area of the VH lift. Going with Bravo was not an option as the spacing on the hydrants below HG are too spread out and it is a lot of ground to cover to get it open with no natural base and marginal temps. We also really did not want to open with downloading. When Killington which has over 5 times the water and air capacity is opening only 2 days earlier I think some of you seasoned posters should appreciate that we will be opening on time 11/19.
The forecast starting Friday looks cold through the weekend and into the early part of the week and we intend to get the Valley House lift open as soon as we can because we also like skiing steeper terrain and that should come in quicker then downspout to the base.
As for Mount Ellen, again with the warm temps in the base we knew making snow on Inverness was not going to be successful so we tried to lock in training space for the WC athletes and for GMVS so they can train and not interfere with the public skiing. We will be moving down to Inverness by the weekend.

Hope to see you on the mountain on Saturday
John

Here is a graph of the average base temps since our electric meter read
View attachment 55062

Definitely agree with the strategy given the hand dealt. However, it does seem that having the focus at the base has meant missed opportunities at the summit - like right now where it is 16 at the summit and 24 at mid mountain. My guess is that its too heavy a lift to shift from GH to summit for a short period? And I presume tonight when temps drop at the base you will be back on GH (and/or VH)?

Thanks for posting John. And all the luck for a great season!

THINK SNOW!

thetrailboss · Nov 17, 2022

Cool for John to chime in. Also cool to have opening day in a different area other than the usual suspects.

jaybird · Nov 17, 2022

Harkening back to November a few years ago .. we were storming the Castle

Will look forward to the results of the water bolstering work that was done.

Have a Great Season .. one and all !

HowieT2 · Nov 17, 2022

Jhammond said:
I know the expert skiers will be disappointed in a Gate House opening but when looking at the forecast we could see only limited snowmaking temps to the base so we went with the GH side to get open and start skiing. It can open with less snow then you need on a steeper trail like Spring Fling and the load area of the VH lift. Going with Bravo was not an option as the spacing on the hydrants below HG are too spread out and it is a lot of ground to cover to get it open with no natural base and marginal temps. We also really did not want to open with downloading. When Killington which has over 5 times the water and air capacity is opening only 2 days earlier I think some of you seasoned posters should appreciate that we will be opening on time 11/19.
The forecast starting Friday looks cold through the weekend and into the early part of the week and we intend to get the Valley House lift open as soon as we can because we also like skiing steeper terrain and that should come in quicker then downspout to the base.
As for Mount Ellen, again with the warm temps in the base we knew making snow on Inverness was not going to be successful so we tried to lock in training space for the WC athletes and for GMVS so they can train and not interfere with the public skiing. We will be moving down to Inverness by the weekend.

Hope to see you on the mountain on Saturday
John

Here is a graph of the average base temps since our electric meter read
View attachment 55062

Welcome aboard! Your input is much appreciated.

For the record and fwiw, I luv bombing down those trails on GH (no idea what the names are except for sleeper and waterfall). Not an all day kind of thing by any means, but a couple of runs to get in the groove. I like this skiing thing. sure beats doing 'nothing at the inlaws.

Hawk · Nov 17, 2022

It shows that the improvements over at gate house make a big difference. That's my take. I agree that open is open. I am actually going elsewhere this weekend to ski with some friends.

Los · Nov 17, 2022

SteezyYeeter said:
I don't think that Pushover's that bad. It's one of the more interesting trails they could've opened first, and it's only for a day or two.

Completely agree - it’s a nice trail. I actually prefer it to spring fling which is my least favorite of all sugarbush trails (Lincoln and Ellen combined)

tumbler · Nov 17, 2022

Los said:
Completely agree - it’s a nice trail. I actually prefer it to spring fling which is my least favorite of all sugarbush trails (Lincoln and Ellen combined)

Wow, that's a pretty strong take. Fling is awesome!

Los · Nov 17, 2022

tumbler said:
Wow, that's a pretty strong take. Fling is awesome!

It’s boring! But don’t worry - just because we disagree doesn’t mean I want you dead. (I feel like that needs to be stated now thanks to a certain narcissistic sociopath who frequently posts on this forum.)

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