Private Political Discussion Forum?

bvibert said:

If you don't want people finding this site because of the political discussions then you probably don't want them to find this place based on the misc-discussions in general

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A misc discussion in and of itself isn't usually bad. Political discussions tend to pull in bad apples who aret rying to incite rather than contribute.

-Stephen

BeanoNYC said:

...I can't help but think that this will end up being an opportunity for some heavy flames. At least if it is out in the public, there is some sort of self monitoring going on...

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I agree.

ctenidae said:

That's a good idea, bvibert- is it possible to make a thread un-indexed?

bvibert said:

I don't know much about search engine indexing, but if having a separate forum for politics that is only viewable by certain members will stop those posts from being indexed then the same should work for the misc discussion if it was only viewable for members. If you don't want people finding this site because of the political discussions then you probably don't want them to find this place based on the misc-discussions in general

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Excellent points. Making the Misc forum private would achieve the same thing in terms of the search engine results. Actually, the most common search phrases that refer folks to these forums are from threads in Miscellaneous. For example, so far in July, here are the top twelve search phrases:

nh ezpass
nh ez pass
ez pass nh
tour de france faq
nh tolls
utah forest fires
randy jackson journey
which state has the longest coastline
dicks picks 35
maura murray
discovery bike team
deadliest catch

Last month:

randy jackson journey
randy jackson american idol
maura murray
lowering the drinking age
deadliest catch
ez pass nh
nh ezpass
which state has the longest coastline
winter colors
product testers
wives and girlfriends
nh ez pass

I guess you could argue that the fact that we have such a presence on the SE's is a good thing. I'm sure we've gained some new members as a result; some of whom may not be skiers or hikers or even live in the Northeast, however. Making the Miscellaneous forum private would definitely reduce the number of lurkers here. Not sure if that's a good thing or not...? Threads that are currently indexed will remain so until the SE's re-spider the forums. They should then update their index to reflect the post no longer existing (actually I think they will "see" a log in screen).

Back to the topic at hand. Perhaps I should've started a thread to gauge whether all the political discussions were annoying members or not. If so, there would only be two options - (1) ban all political discussions, or (2) the private political forum. I would prefer the latter. As far as moderation, we can institute the same guidelines as the rest of the forums, i.e. the political discussions wouldn't be allowed to get out of hand any more than they are now.

In any event, remember, we can always just try it out. Nothing is set in stone and we could always revert back to the old approach if we all think that's better. phpBB 3 will have nested forums. Imagine including a political forum as a sub-forum to Miscellaneous. This is sort of the same thing - it's just presented within the limitations of phpBB 2.0.x. With all the integration between the forums and the rest of the AZ Web site, it's a version we are going to need to stick with for some time...

This is all great feedback - please continue.

bvibert said:

What if you just made the Misc section only viewable for registered members? That would eliminate the search engine, riff-raff thing...

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I like this idea, I voted no.

I voted no; I don't think it's a problem here. And if this is for folks who get offended by it, read no further than the topic line and then stop reading.

If you don't like the channel you're watching on TV, change the channel. The political topics here are relatively few.

It would be ironic if the outcome of the intelligent and occasionally boisterous political conversation here wound up hidden and censored.

JimG. said:

I voted no; I don't think it's a problem here. And if this is for folks who get offended by it, read no further than the topic line and then stop reading.

If you don't like the channel you're watching on TV, change the channel. The political topics here are relatively few.

It would be ironic if the outcome of the intelligent and occasionally boisterous political conversation here wound up hidden and censored.

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Thanks Jim. Just to clarify - this idea was not in response to any complaints, but more of a preemptive approach. Perhaps it's not necessary.

Your last comment is a good point, but again, censorship is not what we're after here. This is all great feedback. Keep it coming. I'd like to stick with tradition and only implement things once I get feedback from the community.

Greg said:

JimG. said:

I voted no; I don't think it's a problem here. And if this is for folks who get offended by it, read no further than the topic line and then stop reading.

If you don't like the channel you're watching on TV, change the channel. The political topics here are relatively few.

It would be ironic if the outcome of the intelligent and occasionally boisterous political conversation here wound up hidden and censored.

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Thanks Jim. Just to clarify - this idea was not in response to any complaints, but more of a preemptive approach. Perhaps it's not necessary.

Your last comment is a good point, but again, censorship is not what we're after here. This is all great feedback. Keep it coming. I'd like to stick with tradition and only implement things once I get feedback from the community.

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The last line in my response sounded a little harsh, didn't mean to say you were instituting censorship.

Maybe I'm weird, but I'm more likely to want to meet up with folks like Stephen or JayTrek who have disagreed with things I've written. Constructive confrontation is good and should lead to effective compromise.

Then again, I understand folks who don't want to read that stuff, and they shouldn't.

I voted "no." It would probably be tricky to differentiate b/t Political and Miscellaneous in many cases, as any current events tend to dissolve into political rants. There's a number of current threads in the Misc that go in and out of political territory.
I also agree with whomever said that it is easy enough to avoid the political threads if so desired.
So, I don't really see the need being worth the hassle.

Interesting how the poll is basically split...kinda like in politics... :idea: So is it the coservatives or the liberals that voted "no"?

JimG. said:

I voted no; I don't think it's a problem here. And if this is for folks who get offended by it, read no further than the topic line and then stop reading.

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Unfortunately that isn't the case. Any topic can turn into a very heated politcal discussion. At this point all Greg can do is ask people to get back on topic or lock the post.

With a poly forum, the political posts can be split out and both the original discussion and the heated poly dicsussion can live on.

-Stephen

I voted yes, and I would likely sign up.

IMO it's a good idea, especially if it "steers" the site away from people who would just join to troll in the political discussions.

If it was decided that political discussions were taboo on AZ, I'd be OK with that too...as much as I like to participate in a good, constructive political debate, I'd rather do without them if they detracted from the original purpose of this forum.

In response to the question on politics and response, FWIW, I usually lean left of center (guess it comes from living in Mass. for a couple of decades).

hammer said:

IMO it's a good idea, especially if it "steers" the site away from people who would just join to troll in the political discussions.

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Arent trolls the only thing that keeps ski forums exciting in the summer :wink: , jk i think it is good idea to make a new forum. the most important thing i think is that if u start a convo in misc. folder it wont turn politic on u and if it does then u can move that part to the politics folder... kinda on the fence of this idea, good arguements on both sides.
If there was one i probably wouldnt post, but it is still entertaining to read what people have to say

So anyway who would sign up and participate regulary in this political forum???

Seems to me the only reason to make a private forum is to keep contentious issues off the search engines. I think that's worth while. Like bvibert's idea, can you do a public-access but non-indexed forum?

I have to wonder, though- why are so many people interested in the longest coast line? Top twelve hits for two months? That's bizarre. There must have been an email being forwarded around.

Back when I was at WPI, the school had it's own set of newsgroups, one of which was "wpi.flame". The newsgroup name was warning enough. Here anything goes, from your mama wears combat boots to your daddy's a neo-nazi pig. The only things not tolerated were blatant hate and bigotry. Anyone could rant about anything, and it was generally assumed and expected that one would be flamed until charred to an unrecognizable briquette.

It seemed to relieve a lot of tension during finals. It may still exist on usenet (I think that's where it was), though I haven't searched since I stopped looking in alt.rec.backcountry and alt.sports.hockey.botsonbruins (or something like that), back when VFTT was in it's infancy at lexicomm.

Maybe we need a forum like this, blind from the SEs like google and dogpile.

Smitty

ctenidae said:

...can you do a public-access but non-indexed forum?

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From my research today I think the only way to stop the search engine bots from finding it is to make a login required to view the posts

bvibert said:

ctenidae said:

...can you do a public-access but non-indexed forum?

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From my research today I think the only way to stop the search engine bots from finding it is to make a login required to view the posts

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.
BVibert... I knew you would keep us informed. Good info. Kind of what I thought. That might move a couple of not sures.

fwiw, i voted for the political forum but would like to point out that i have not seen trolls participating in political discussion threads (at least the one's i have followed), so that may not be a good reason "for" requiring log in and seperating them out. i still am for a seperate forum, but always enjoy playing the other side when things don't add up carry on.

Bump. Just trying to break the tie - I'd like to see a majority vote. Considering that there's not overwhelming support, we'll probably shelve this one too...

Looks like a hung jury.

JimG. said:

Looks like a hung jury.

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Split, just like in politics... :lol: