Vermont's chairlift safety bar law

I am looking for a little feedback on the Vermont law mandating use of the safety bars on chairlifts (they must be down or it is a fineable offense), and, I am trying to understand why it appears to be popular to not use the safety bars. It seems like a no-brainer when you are moving at a fair speed at 20-40' in the air but I see lots of skiers and riders ignoring the safety bars ?

in the bad old days, when the fixed grip chairs stopped, they did so suddenly and your chair would go swinging back and forth pretty good.

For me, I'm always screwing around with something - camera, tissues, whatever and prefer the bard down.

I never liked using the foot rest, which is a reason some folks put it down.

I agree that you never know what might happen. I would never think of leaving it up with little tykes.
I've skied at some places out west that DON'T have bars.

I agree with you, it's just a smart thing to do. love to hear why other's don't do it.

I see no reason for the law. I never put my bar down but don't begrudge fellow riders when they do so (as long as they tell me they are going to do so before bonking me off the helmet due to my height). There are many chairlifts in the country that don't even have safety bars on chair lifts. So with that in mind, I would reverse the question and ask why the safety bar law is even needed?

Personally, I have never felt unsafe on a lift without the safety bar lowered. On many chairlifts, I have felt down right uncomfortable with the bar lowered. Black chair at Magic, any one? Most uncomfortable chair lift ever with the bar down. I have large thighs so some bars are uncomfortably low on my legs. Jet at Jay comes to mind as well as so many POMA chair lifts (man, I hate POMA chair lifts with a passion!). I also don't use foot rests, partially because of comfort (I prefer to dangle my legs) but also because I have long legs and can't fit my legs on many, so safety bars with foot rests are annoying.

We aren't talking about a proven safety item like a seat belt. How many people (actual statistics please) have avoided injury due to the safety bar versus how many people have been injured because of it? I would have to guess that the reaching back to put the safety bar down has probably caused more mishaps on lifts than might have resulted from the bar not being down later in the ride. Just my opinion, though I would love to see some actual data to either prove or disprove that theory. Then again, if data actually backed up the supposed idea that safety bars reduce injury risk, then why do so few states have safety bar laws? Why do many chairlifts without safety bars still turn?

I prefer the bar down, partly for safety, but more so because I like to lean on it. Whether or not their should be a law.....

I could care less, should it be a law, no. The lifts out west are pretty nuts for no bars. Especially the doubl chairs, like Powder Horn lift at Solitude. That lift is pretty high over some sketchy terrain.

the original trailboss said:

I am looking for a little feedback on the Vermont law mandating use of the safety bars on chairlifts (they must be down or it is a fineable offense), and, I am trying to understand why it appears to be popular to not use the safety bars. It seems like a no-brainer when you are moving at a fair speed at 20-40' in the air but I see lots of skiers and riders ignoring the safety bars ?

Click to expand...

Kinda like seatbelt law arguments. Or helmet laws. They're there for safety, but can you force people to use a safety feature? Sure you can. Pass a law, and fine them when they don't.

I like it down as I am scared of heights

I think this is an example of a law that is observed in the breach. The only time I consciously observe this is when I'm in a lift with the trailboss. I usually have the bar up. The only other times I pull it down is when my legs are fried and I need the footrest, when the winds are howling and when I need to do stuff with my gear. I don't mind when other people put the bar down but I would appreciate a warning. I'm not tall but I had my head bonked too many times and my hand was crushed once.

They should send the violators to prison..

Danaxxmiller said:

I like it down as I am scared of heights

Click to expand...

Any lift can halt to a complete stop at anytime..and some seats are padded and or slippery...I always say coming down first..riding the blackfoot double at Grand Targhee yesterday which is an old style riblet with no safety bar $50 above a trail in flat light after a safety meeting was scary..

I don't see a reason for a law, but I don't understand, for the most part, why people find it so annoying to put the bar down. Outside of situations like rivercOil described, I see no downside of putting it down. Even when the chair has footrests, they're usually high enough up that my feet can still dangle freely, plus they get snowboards up high enough that they don't knock into my skis. Plus I tend to lean on it.

That being said, I'll let the other people on the chair make the move. They want it up, I don't particularly care. There are chairs where it's a little freaky when it stops, though.

mondeo said:

I don't see a reason for a law, but I don't understand, for the most part, why people find it so annoying to put the bar down.

Click to expand...

Because that's what the cool kids do.

I personally could give a rats ass if someone else on the chair wants it up. I'm polite and will make sure not to bonk someone. This tiny Asian lady I road the lift with today who didn't speak a lick of English bonked someone with the bar as we got on the Peabody Express, then at the top nearly bonked the same guy again raising the bar up.

funny this post was just made. Yesterday at Killington, they had an A mogul comp. A lot of the "cool mogul skier kids" (teens basically) were riding without the bar down. Ski Patrol constantly was telling them to put it down etc.

Well, finally they must have had enough of the flaunting and 2 competitors had their bibs taken away when they got off at the top. Of course they claimed they had "just raised it to get off"... This basically caused them to miss the rest of the comp (duals)

I'm disapointed in their behavior. They should be setting a good example not a bad one.

SkiDork said:

funny this post was just made. Yesterday at Killington, they had an A mogul comp. A lot of the "cool mogul skier kids" (teens basically) were riding without the bar down. Ski Patrol constantly was telling them to put it down etc.

Well, finally they must have had enough of the flaunting and 2 competitors had their bibs taken away when they got off at the top. Of course they claimed they had "just raised it to get off"... This basically caused them to miss the rest of the comp (duals)

I'm disapointed in their behavior. They should be setting a good example not a bad one.

Click to expand...

It is surpriseng to here a skier coach with empathy for the employees on the hill. A lot of NYSEF coaches think they are the coolest thing on the hill. If you think I'm kidding just ask one of them they will tell you. They dont think the rules are meant for them cause they can rip.
Good for you, to bad for the kids that lost there bibs, Hopefully on day out of comp will be a good lesson to learn. They are the best skiers on the hill they should set the example for the newbies.

tjf67 said:

It is surpriseng to here a skier coach with empathy for the employees on the hill. A lot of NYSEF coaches think they are the coolest thing on the hill. If you think I'm kidding just ask one of them they will tell you. They dont think the rules are meant for them cause they can rip.
Good for you, to bad for the kids that lost there bibs, Hopefully on day out of comp will be a good lesson to learn. They are the best skiers on the hill they should set the example for the newbies.

Click to expand...

I'm actually not a coach, just a parent. But I'll tell you, at least the killington freestyle coaches don't tolerate any negative behavior. They're all about great skiing skills AND great life skills. Amy glad to have my son compete with them

Safety bars actually have been proven to cause more injuries than they prevent. However, the injuries they prevent are much more catastrophic (potentially death) than the ones they cause (bumps and bruises.) Good communication with other riders is key.

I've taken many rides over the years where the safety bar was more than welcome. If the chair has it, I'm going to use it, regardless of laws.

John

I wonder if the people that don't use the safety bar are the same idiots I see riding their motorcycles in New Hampshire without helmets.

Phildozer said:

I wonder if the people that don't use the safety bar are the same idiots I see riding their motorcycles in New Hampshire without helmets.

Click to expand...

State Motto: "Live Free or Die"

Personally I like the safety bar lowered at all times especially since I am skiing with a 9 year old who's mind and eyes tend to wander on a chairlift. I have been on a few lift's out west where there was no safety restraint and felt a bit unsafe. A few really high chairlifts at Mammoth come to mind.

I always ask or say comming down before lowering the bar, but I have been knocked in the head by more than one in the past by people who have lowered it before I was ready or aware of it.

As with any safety item it is sometimes a matter of personal preference, my father for example refuses to wear a seatbelt in the car (his or mine) at any time even after several tickets.

OldsnowboarderME said:

I like the ones that only wear tank tops,shorts, and sandals while riding their MC ...

Click to expand...

I personally love the law here in Connecticut where you have the option of wearing a helmet on a motorcycle after reaching the age of 18, but where you still have to wear a seatbelt while in a car surrounded by 4,000 lbs of steel.

Makes sense to me:dunce: