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Haystack: Return from Nelsap?

vcunning

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From today's (10/8/09) Deerfield Valley News:

WILMINGTON- In a development sure to please some Wilmington residents, the owners of Haystack Club have announced that they intend to open Haystack ski area this season.

Haystack Club’s Bob Rubin said crews from Poma, the ski lift manufacturer, have been working on the Hayfever lift, refurbishing it in preparation for the approaching ski season. “There will be skiing this year,” Rubin said. “We want to get people back on the mountain.”

The lift will be load-tested within the next few weeks. The load test simulates operation of the lift with a full complement of passengers. Barrels filled with water are used to simulate riders and the lift is operated for several days with observers from the Vermont Department of Labor Passenger Tramway Division, the lift manufacturer, and the insurance carrier.

Once the testing and certification are completed, Rubin said the lift will be ready for operation this winter. Hayfever will bring passengers up to the mid-mountain area, about 3,300 feet, where skiers can access several trails. “We’ll have a minimum of five trails open this year,” Rubin said.

Under Haystack Club’s purchase agreement with Mount Snow, the ski area cannot be opened to the general public. Only the owner/members of the club, and up to 250 Wilmington residents per day, can ski at Haystack.

Rubin said the ski area will be open only on weekends, and through the holiday weeks. “We’ll be open for the 250 Wilmington folks that we can sell tickets to, and it will give people who are interested in purchasing the real estate a chance to sample the mountain,” Rubin said.

Haystack Club plans to open with “the other guys” in the area, Rubin said, meaning Mount Snow, and that means snowmaking. Haystack Club will be making snow “to the best of (their) ability” on the trails serviced by the Hayfever lift.

The former Haystack Upper Base Lodge was partially demolished during Haystack Club’s initial phase of construction. Rubin said one of the townhouses in the development’s only completed building will “probably” be converted into a place for skiers to warm up, get a cup of coffee, and take a look at Haystack Club’s real estate offerings. Rubin said he’s not expecting the “mini-ski area” will be particularly busy, at least until more memberships are sold. “We’ll be selling membership in our club, and we’ll have our real estate operation going, with units listed on the MLS (multiple listing service),” Rubin said. “We have one building complete and one foundation ready for us to start framing as soon as we need to. We’re hoping we can get people interested in the concept and the plan and sell some real estate to help fuel development.”

Rubin said the real estate will be priced very competitively, and those who buy early will “do quite well” once the ski resort is in full operation. Until then, he said, membership at Haystack Club includes membership at Haystack Golf Club. “People told us last time that if we could get the ski area open, it could help them make the decision to buy,” Rubin said. “Now it’s open. So when you size it up against the other folks in town, we’re offering a mini-ski area, attached to a townhouse, with an 18-hole championship golf course.”

The project slowed almost to a halt in January 2007, only a few months after officially breaking ground. Developers proposed an ambitious plan that included 118 four-unit townhouses, an 81-unit condominium complex on the upper mountain area, an 89-unit condominium complex on the lower mountain area, a 162-unit hotel, as well as an extensive remodeling of the former Haystack Upper Base Lodge, a new base lodge, restaurant, spa complex, a centrally located propane facility, and a mountain operations building.

The club also planned major improvements to the slopes, such as a “chondola” combination chairlift and gondola, as well as snowmaking and trail improvements.

Since 2007, however, 1 Cornell, the company behind Haystack Club, has continued to move forward with the permitting process and some construction. “The way the economy is, we felt like we needed to take a softer approach,” Rubin said. “We’re continuing at the same pace.”

Earlier this spring, 1 Cornell transferred its assets to Alt Charities, a company with many of the same officers as 1 Cornell.
 

riverc0il

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A wise decision from these turkeys, finally. How on earth they expected to get people interested in buying into a ski area when the lifts were not turning is beyond my comprehension. Surprised they don't go for the summit lift instead.
 

Glenn

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That's pretty cool. I think it'll be a good thing for the Valley area.
 

drjeff

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I'm guesing based on the article, there will be a lot of comp'd day passes for perspective buyers and not a ton of sell out days for the 250 day tickets that they're maximally allowed to sell to Wilmington residents.

I'll probably on a nice day one weekend, do the perspective buyer thing and check it out. A couple of hours off the mid mountain access that will be available would seem about right.
 

WJenness

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I'm guesing based on the article, there will be a lot of comp'd day passes for perspective buyers and not a ton of sell out days for the 250 day tickets that they're maximally allowed to sell to Wilmington residents.

I'll probably on a nice day one weekend, do the perspective buyer thing and check it out. A couple of hours off the mid mountain access that will be available would seem about right.

Might actually be kinda fun on a low total (i.e 4-8") powder day on a busy Saturday (at Mt. Snow)... yeah, not a whole lot to ski, but no real competition either.... I'm guessing the lower portion of haystack isn't steep enough to support really deep powder?

-w
 

ComeBackMudPuddles

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is it right that the mountain will only be skiable by property owners? permanently?

if so, this "opening" has got to be a ploy to boost sagging real estate values. i tend to think that as soon as the developer makes a decent return, you'll see haystack slowly fade and, eventually, close again, leaving the owners high and dry.


(if this has already been debated at length, sorry. didn't bother to look for other threads on the topic.)
 

jaytrem

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is it right that the mountain will only be skiable by property owners? permanently?
(if this has already been debated at length, sorry. didn't bother to look for other threads on the topic.)

That's the supposed plan. But I believe 10 years after the closing date they're allowed to reopen to the public. So we'll see what happens. I was kinda hoping they might be shortening that in exchange for the extra snowmaking water Haystack has been allowing MS to have. But guess not.

The lower mountain (or lower part of the upper mountain in this case) has some descent pitch to it. If they could get the Witches chair going next that would be nice. I can understand not putting any money into the summit lift if they really do plan on replacing it.
 

drjeff

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Might actually be kinda fun on a low total (i.e 4-8") powder day on a busy Saturday (at Mt. Snow)... yeah, not a whole lot to ski, but no real competition either.... I'm guessing the lower portion of haystack isn't steep enough to support really deep powder?

-w

The lower Mtn has some potential as Jaytrem said. Basically you have to negotiate a flat for maybe 100-150 yards for most of the terrain right at the top of the chair, then some decent pitch to the base. If you take the trails right off the lift that start off with some pitch(to your right when you get off the chair), then you get basically an equivalent flat run out at the base to get back to the lift.
 
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drjeff

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is it right that the mountain will only be skiable by property owners? permanently?

if so, this "opening" has got to be a ploy to boost sagging real estate values. i tend to think that as soon as the developer makes a decent return, you'll see haystack slowly fade and, eventually, close again, leaving the owners high and dry.


(if this has already been debated at length, sorry. didn't bother to look for other threads on the topic.)

The agreement that Haystack has is two fold. 1) To keep Wilmington happy, they can sell upto 250 tickets a day to residents of Wilmington 2) All other lift access for a period of 10 years post sale will be to members of the "club" and their guests or others that the owners deem acceptable (read as comp'd tickets for perspective club/real estate members.

In theory based on the original plans, you can buy a membership to The Haystack Club without being a property owner there.
 
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jaytrem

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2) All other lift access for a period of 10 years post sale will be to members of the "club" and their guests or others that the owners deem acceptable (read as comp'd tickets for perspective club/real estate members.

Jeff, do remember what year it was sold? I'm lousy at remembering dates/years.
 

drjeff

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Jeff, do remember what year it was sold? I'm lousy at remembering dates/years.

Yup, back in '05. Only way I remember that is that last time I skied Haystack when it was open was MLK day just after my daughter's 1st birthday.
 

jaytrem

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Yup, back in '05. Only way I remember that is that last time I skied Haystack when it was open was MLK day just after my daughter's 1st birthday.

Thanks, still a ways to go before 10. I do miss heading over there on crowded weekends.
 

Glenn

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Thanks, still a ways to go before 10. I do miss heading over there on crowded weekends.

I agree...still a bit of a wait. But also some time to get their ducks in a row.

If you ever take the Handle road short cut to route 9, you can really see all the condos they built. A lot of them look rather nice.
 

drjeff

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I agree...still a bit of a wait. But also some time to get their ducks in a row.

If you ever take the Handle road short cut to route 9, you can really see all the condos they built. A lot of them look rather nice.

The ones (or one is the more apppropriate term) that these developers put up is located maybe 75 yards from the Haystack base lodge. There's 1 building with 4 units in it that has been completed and a foundation for building #2 was poured next to it. The 4 units when orginally listed a few years ago were in the 850-900k price range for the larger end units and 700-750k range for the slightly smaller middle units. None sold at that time. The price for them was running almost 100k more than similarly sized/appointed new contstruction located in the general Mount Snow base area, although the Haystack one's did include membership and initiation fee into The Haystack club.

If you're thinking about the slate blue one's(maybe 30 units total) located on the lower part of the access road to Haystack, those are the Powderhorn Townhomes which are 15 to 20 years old, not bad at all inside, and not part of the Haystack Club.
 

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I'm thinking of the ones right off of Handle...near the golf course. I couldn't even guess the names. :lol:
 

drjeff

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These?...

http://www.haystackhighlands.com/

They're not associated with Haystack Club/Mountain.

Yup, those were quite nice inside (my wife and I actually looked at one a few years ago) - and at that time they were running between the low 400's to mid 500's based on end vs middle unit and the level of finish. They still seem to be selling ok also as at a slow, steady pace, new foundations keep going in there
 

Glenn

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I'm not sure. They're on the road that you take a right of of Handle to access. I can't remember the name. We took that way back 6,000 times last year and I don't know any street names. :razz:
 

jaytrem

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I'm not sure. They're on the road that you take a right of of Handle to access. I can't remember the name. We took that way back 6,000 times last year and I don't know any street names. :razz:

Yeah, that's gotta be them. They're built by John Redd, he's a former vice president of Mount Snow.
 

Glenn

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It always amazed me at how there will still occupied condos there. But I keep forgetting about the golf course.
 
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