New Boots - HELP!

[TPL]

Hi,

Just joined the forum. Have been enjoying reading the posts - alot of good info and feedback. Thought I would seek some advice on a equipment issue.

I just got a new pair of boots and used them for the first time Sunday @ Ragged Mtn. To make a long story short I feel like I went from a pretty solid advanced skier down to an intermediate in ability. Not sure I can explain the problem but it feels like I am leaning too far forward in the boots. After 2 runs my quads were burning. I felt like I did not have control of the skis like I have had in the past! Using my old boots last week I had no problems at all. Even just standing still on the skis my stance seemed off and my legs were sore.
Any thoughts on what could be wrong? Same skis but they had been stone ground and waxed/tuned since my last outing on the old boots. Could this be a factor?

Thanks in advance for your input.

TPL

 

[dmc]

It may be an ability thing...
Boots for different abilities ski different....

Maybe you could post the model names - that may help...

 

[skidbump]

quads burning is a leaning back thing...not a to far forward thing

 

[thetrailboss]

Hi,

Just joined the forum. Have been enjoying reading the posts - alot of good info and feedback. Thought I would seek some advice on a equipment issue.

I just got a new pair of boots and used them for the first time Sunday @ Ragged Mtn. To make a long story short I feel like I went from a pretty solid advanced skier down to an intermediate in ability. Not sure I can explain the problem but it feels like I am leaning too far forward in the boots. After 2 runs my quads were burning. I felt like I did not have control of the skis like I have had in the past! Using my old boots last week I had no problems at all. Even just standing still on the skis my stance seemed off and my legs were sore.
Any thoughts on what could be wrong? Same skis but they had been stone ground and waxed/tuned since my last outing on the old boots. Could this be a factor?

Thanks in advance for your input.

TPL

Yes, as stated above, you're a bit nervous and leaning too far back, hence the loss of control on the skis and your burning quads. Boots take time to break in...I'm up to 23 days in mine and they are just breaking in now. If you lean back too far back on any pair of skis you won't have control and the skis will come out from underneath you.

My advice: lean FORWARD and engage the skis. Also give the boots some time...if they still aren't working, adjust the cant angle and other adjustments to get your desired fit. Good luck and welcome to the forum! :wink:

 

[bigbog]

T....
If your boot's forward lean is more than your dorsiflexion(...~range of ankle flex) can deal with, in order to keep from pressuring the back of your boot...one might have to get wayyyy too far forward, stretchin' your achilles out too......particularly on steep pitched terrain. With some of today's deeper sidecuts there are numerous boots with higher degrees of forward lean around....to get you lower & more forward. IMO....some of it's pretty faddish, the low & rotary turns....scraping the snow with the one hand thing.........it's a little much.
They're fine for chicken legs... :evil: , but for some of us...they're just too much lean. I think there are some fine skiers donning Salomon XWave 10s these days, they're as straight up as you can get...for an advanced boot....take a look at the difference in forward lean T, maybe not the 10s, but the 9's & 8's have the same upright forward lean. It's just anatomy....but then if it IS a matter of just getting used to not being in the backseat....give them a little slack... :lol: Take a lesson or two for some short radius turns on steeper pitched trails...
Which boot is it that you're using...?

 

[skidon]

Hey, TPL. Welcome. I have a few questions. What is the make, model, year and size of your old boots? Ditto for the new ones? What is the Boot Sole Length of each? Did you have any custom fitting done with either pair? What is your foot size, width, and arch length? How tall and heavy are you? What is your inseam? What is your gender? Would you call yourself a cautious, moderate or aggressive skier? This is preliminary and simplistic, but it sounds like you have a problem with either the fit, flex or stance setup of your new boots. (People who know boots just said "Duh!") Or a combination of those factors. Give me some answers (just do the best you can), and I might be able to help you out.

 

[tekweezle]

does your boots have something like a Walk switch or a Ski Hard or Soft position? one of my friends had been sking for about 2 years with it in the walk position without even knowing what it was for. she was always in the back seat. when she flipped it into the Ski posiion, the difference was night and day!

are you experiencing foot pain that might make you over compensate in any way?

maybe it was the tune on your skis? you did say you got them serviced recently. too many new variables-if you still have your old boots, maybe you should try them to see if you could get that feeling of control back.

 

[TPL]

skidon,

Here is a shot at answering your questions. I am male. I am a big guy (ex colege O- linemen) @ 6' 1" and 325LBS. Inseam is a 29". My old boots are Nordica 955 Rear-entry. Have had them so long I can't remember the age. I had been out of skiing for about 10 years and took it up 2 years ago when my 5 year old daughter started taking lessons as well as my wife.

I have large calves, high instep and a size 12.5 to 13 foot. I measure about an E in width. My old boots are not overly comfortable - way to tight around calves. I had no luck finding boots at a shop that fit correctly. Purchased boots from Daleboot USA in Utah. In fairness to the boots they fit like a glove. They do have adjustable flex. I have the flex set high (stiff) currently.

Old boots are 11.5. New ones I am not sure since they were custom fitted based on measurements of my foot, ankle and leg. Holding boots up to each other new sole is approx. 1 inch longer than old boot sole.

I consider myself a moderate skier in terms of aggressiveness. I felt very comfortable with the old boots and my skis (Salomon X-Scream @ 193cm). Could not believe the difference of a shaped ski when I started back 2 years ago!

Any advice you can give would be appreciated. I was excited to find a pair of boots that fit great but once I started skiing became very frustrated at my seeming lack of ability.

 

[tekweezle]

TPL,

I have large calfs too so my boot choices are also limited. I am currently on a pair of Salomon Xwave 7.0. I beleive the consesus is that Nordica and Saloman usually have the widest amount of volume in their boots.

if you say your quads are burning, it would indicate that you are more in the "backseat" rather than leaning too far forward. i don;t know what your abilities are but if you said you were on an old pair of rear entry boots, i would hazard to guess that perhaps you still ski with a more "straight ski technique" in spite of your new Salomon xscream skis. what i mean by that is that perhaps you are doing more "heel skidding" rather tha carving as sort of a "security blanket" until you get the feel for your boots. that will kill your thighs too. i beleive that rear entry boots don;t usually promote the "forward lean" that contemporary boots do today.

if your new boots do have you in the forward lean position, i suggest in case you are not doing it already to pickup your upper torso a little so you are not hunched over. you want to have your chest over knees over toes but not much more forward than that. in that position, you should have not as much weight on the thighs and you should be able to stand comfortably.

goodluck!

 

[awf170]

maybe it is just switchin from rear entry, i know someone who got nice new boots and used to have rear entry. First day out he felt horrible on them and could only do like 4 runs but after a few days of skiing he got used to them and now skis way better.

 

[Brettski]

I'd like to ask you want you mean by Solid Advanced skiier?

Don't know too many of those in rear entry boots.

How is Ragged btw...looked at their website the other day...man have things changed there...Ragged's lodge used to be...well ragged...

Looks like a serious boot

http://www.dalebootusa.com/index.html

Did you get the standard or the racing boot? The racing boot will be far more stiff and hard to flex (the leaning forward part), but with your frame, I'd find it hard to believe that youcouldn't drive the boot.

I buy the tail sliding thing.

When's the last time you had a lesson? That's not meant to be condesending...I make sure I take lessons every year..great way to beat the lift lines on a crowded afternoon as well...

 

[skidon]

Thanks for the thorough answers. Here's what I'm thinking. You're coming out of rear entries, which basically have no forward lean (especially if you have wide calves). Therefore it's a fair guess that you're used to skiing in a fairly upright stance. Your new boots have probably 14-18 degrees of fixed forward lean, meaning that they will push your lower legs into a more forward position. That alone can cause fatigue in the quads if you're not used to it. I don't think that the stiff flex of your new boots is causing the problem, because you're such a big guy. (Sometimes too stiff of a boot "locks in" the ankles, not allowing the skier to balance efficiently and causing rapid quad fatigue as well.) This kinda fits with what you're saying is wrong - the feeling of being forward, fatigue in the quads, and the sensation that the stance is different. The good news is, your new boots have the potential to help you become a better skier. The bad news is, if i'm right, you have a little learnin' to do. When you're skiing, don't fight the forward-ness. You should be lightly pressing forward into the upper cuff most of the time, and roughly 60% of your weight should be on the balls of your feet. Try to sense this on some easy runs, and see how it feels. If you find that your weight is more on your heels most of the time, have some heel lifts put into the boot (yes, that's to help you get forward more). You can also reduce the forward lean adjustment to its least-forward setting. Basically, you want your hands out front, more weight forward and on the front of your feet, and to have the sense of projecting forward slightly. (Not that different from the position of a linebacker just before the ball is snapped.)This shouldn't be uncomfortable, but it may be an acquired taste for you. If this IS the problem, once you get used to skiing with those new boots you'll have much better control.

On the other hand I may be all wrong. Please let me know how you make out.

 

[bigbog]

make some time on those easier trails...to retrain that muscle-memory TPL.

...so much for my earlier boot bashin' :lol: :lol:

 

[tekweezle]

Take a lesson or two for some short radius turns on steeper pitched trails...

this is great advice! nothing wrong with being introduced to some new techniques to go along with the new equipment

 

[TPL]

Thanks for all the advice. I sorta figured it was not the boots but my technique. Being out of skiing for 10 years I am not surprised. Part of my problem is that I have always been able to muscle my skis around. It allows me to get down most terrain without a problem but I probalbly don't look to graceful. Probably resemble a bull on skis!

I am heading up to Waterville this week to ski with my 4 and 7 year olds so I should get to spend a good amount of time on the greens. I will work on the techniques you have all suggested.

Brettski - I did not mean to overstate my abilities as a "Solid Advanced" skier. As I said earlier I have always felt in control on the blues and single blacks. I avoid the bumps - I tend to flatten them rather than ski them.

Your suggestion of a lesson is spot on. I will try to get one in this week. It should be a big help since I have some new techniques to grasp. Hard to teach an old dog new tricks!

I did not get the racing version of the boot - went with the standard version. Boot fits great.

I liked Ragged - sorta in the middle of nowhere. The mountain was empty - no lift lines at all. Weather was great on Sunday. Trails a little icy on top.

Thanks again everyone for the solid advice.

TPL

 

[tekweezle]

let us know how you do with the lessons. those boots you bought look awesome. i may have to consider going that route because I still have issues with my boots.

i definitely know where you are coming from because i used to be the same way. I was athletic enough to muscle my skis around and endure most steep non bump trails though a combo of slip sliding, traversing and "christy" skiing. i thought i was pretty good.

i realized I needed help after a real bad day at Stowe. the trails were too steep and icy that day and i was stopping every 10-15 feet because my legs couldn;t handle it. and i was generally fatigued. one of the guys i was skiing with showed me some techinqiues that were foreign to me at the time but now i get today/. this guy was something like 5 foot 2 and skiing on 210cm skis. and he was able to ski straight down the fall line with ease while i was busy traversing the hill. just awesome. now I have taken 20 plus days of lessons since and it;s helped me in every way.

goodluck!

 

[bigbog]

You're not alone tek. Maybe my feet may be trying to tell me something, but I've NEVER felt as cold as this season in my cold 2000 Atomics... :lol: 45min....and bang, I have to head back in somewhere to thaw the toes out......am really looking forward to the next boot purchase....

 

[skidon]

Good idea to take a lesson, but it'd be extra money well-spent to take a private one. If you're going to Waterville Valley, I can recommend Dave Simoneau, Rodney Wilson or Pam Gould as instructors - if they're avaiable. (Dave was mentioned as one of New England's best instructors in on of the big ski mag's a few years back.) Also, not to overload you, but think about demo-ing a pair of the newer, shorter shaped skis. Even a guy your size can get on a ski less than 180cm long, and they make life all that much easier. Good Luck!

 

[tekweezle]

I have to head back in somewhere to thaw the toes out......am really looking forward to the next boot purchase....

i used to have that problem with my old Nodicas. i used to ski for a little and have to go into the lodge and take off my boots completely to get the feeling back in my toes.

the problem turned out to be a toe buckle that i thought was unadjustable. it was a notch too tight and everytime i closed it, it would pinch my little toe. being a beginner, i just lived with it. I found out afterwards that i could open it up. but i bought new boots anyway.

my current boots fit okay. i do have occasional problems with the points in my anklebones though.

 

[Brettski]

Hey waterville is great...if a long way off 93...they have a great kids ski school...so I would imagine the group lessons are great as well...

It's been a couple of years...but the top was always blown off from the wind...it's like they added to the lift to get to the peak to add unskiable vertical

But it's alway been that way as long as I can remember...since the early 90's in any event...

have a GREAT Time...

btw...Gunstock is great too, and their instructors are great as well...

Hey , that would make a good poll...