Vermont Senate Passes Ski Area Bailout

deadheadskier · Feb 26, 2016

BenedictGomez said:
Actually it's pretty conclusively proven fact in terms of long-term, chronic (no pun intended) users, with statistically significant data. Also proven to decreases language skills and has a memory impact. Again, this isn't casual once a month users, but frequent users.

Conclusively proven fact. Lol

Show me unbiased data; not a Pfizer sponsored study.

Does it affect some negatively in those ways? Absolutely. Same with alcohol. All depends on the individual. You can't have "conclusive proven facts" when the results vary by individual. Science doesn't work that way.

KustyTheKlown · Feb 26, 2016

The harmful effects compared to chronic alcohol use are benign. Bottom line, weed will never kill you or make you chronically ill, and it's connection to lung cancer is tenuous at best. And I suspect the studies you reference are dubiously funded by interested parties, and flies in the face of many peoples' personal experience.

BenedictGomez · Feb 26, 2016

deadheadskier said:
Show me unbiased data; not a Pfizer sponsored study.

I'm gathering you don't realize how incredibly easy this would be for me to do? It's not like I didn't used to do this for a living.

KustyTheKlown said:
The harmful effects compared to chronic alcohol use are benign.

But that's not what you said. It was a "comparison" statement.

You simply implied that all that.....bad stuff.... from long-term MJ use was merely a "stereotype" (your word).

deadheadskier · Feb 26, 2016

BenedictGomez said:
I'm gathering you don't realize how incredibly easy this would be for me to do? It's not like I didn't used to do this for a livin).

Then provide your sources.

C-Rex · Feb 26, 2016

My biggest problem with MJ legalization arguments is that they miss the point, and that is: We shouldn't need a million good reasons to legalize it. It shouldn't be ILLEGAL in the first place.

BenedictGomez · Feb 26, 2016

deadheadskier said:
Then provide your sources.

From what decade?

The 1970s?
American Journal of Psychiatry

RHEA L. DORNBUSH, MAX FINK, and ALFRED M. FREEDMANAbstract

The effect of high and low doses of marijuana on behavioral and physiological responses was studied in male medical school volunteers. Short-term memory, reaction time, EEG, and heart rate were significantly affected by the higher dose; time estimation and blood sugar were not differentially affected by either dose.

The 1980s?
Miller, Loren L.; Branconnier, Roland J.

ABSTRACT - The effects of cannabinoids on memory processes are similar to those found following administration of antimuscarinic drugs and in neurological patients suffering from deficits in limbic cholinergic functioning. Cannabinoids have been found to selectively act on the limbic system, modulating the activity of cholinergic neurons in the septal-hippocampal pathway.

The 1990s?
The Medical Journal of Australia
Nahas G , Latour C

ABSTRACT - The pathophysiological effects of marijuana smoke and its constituent cannabinoids were reported first from in-vitro and in-vivo experimental studies. Marijuana smoke is mutagenic in the Ames test and in tissue culture and cannabinoids inhibit biosynthesis of macromolecules. In animals, marijuana or delta 9-tetrahydrocannabinol (THC), the intoxicating material it contains, produces symptoms of neurobehavioural toxicity, disrupts all phases of gonadal or reproductive function, and is fetotoxic. Smoking marijuana can lead to symptoms of airway obstruction as well as squamous metaplasia. Clinical manifestations of pathophysiology due to marijuana smoking are now being reported. These include: long-term impairment of memory in adolescents; prolonged impairment of psychomotor performance; a sixfold increase in the incidence of schizophrenia; cancer of mouth, jaw, tongue and lung in 19-30 year olds; fetotoxicity; and non-lymphoblastic leukemia in children of marijuana-smoking mothers.

The 2000s?

Pharmacology Biochemistry and Behavior

Robert I Block [SUP]a[/SUP][SUP], [/SUP][SUP], [/SUP],
Daniel S O'Leary

Memory-related blood flow in marijuana users, relative to control subjects, showed decreases in prefrontal cortex, increases in memory-relevant regions of cerebellum, and altered lateralization in hippocampus. Marijuana users differed most in brain activity related to episodic memory encoding. In learning a word list to criterion over multiple trials, marijuana users, relative to control subjects, required means of 2.7 more presentations during initial learning and 3.1 more presentations during subsequent relearning. In single-trial recall, marijuana users appeared to rely more on short-term memory, recalling 23% more than control subjects from the end of a list, but 19% less from the middle. These findings indicate altered memory-related brain function in marijuana users.

How about this month? February 2016? Printed by the "Jesus and the children" zealots at far-right (sarcasm)Cambride University.

Psychological Medicine

T. Schoeler, J. Kambeitz, I. Behlke, R. Murray and S. Bhattacharyya

Results. We found that cannabis use was associated with significantly (p ≤ 0.05) impaired global (d = 0.27) and prospective memory (d = 0.61), verbal immediate (d = 0.40) and delayed (d = 0.36) recall as well as visual recognition (d = 0.41) in healthy individuals, but a better global memory (d = −0.11), visual immediate recall (d = −0.73) and recognition (d = −0.42) in patients. Lower depression scores and younger age appeared to attenuate the effects of cannabis on memory. Cannabis-using patients had lower levels of depression and were younger compared with non-using patients, whilst healthy cannabis-users had higher depression scores than age-matched non-users. Longer duration of abstinence from cannabis reduced the effects on memory in healthy and patient users.

This took less than 10 minutes. Net/net - drugs are bad. MMmmmkay....

BenedictGomez · Feb 26, 2016

We should debate what temperature h20 boils at next.

mbedle · Feb 26, 2016

I got a really nice contact high on the gondola this morning at Stowe!!!! lol

Edd · Feb 26, 2016

BenedictGomez said:
We should debate what temperature h20 boils at next.

Are you advocating for keeping it illegal? If the answer is yes, than I'm assuming you feel the same about booze.

KustyTheKlown · Feb 26, 2016

Seriously. It's grasping at straws. The harm is so inconsequential in a world that actively promotes alcohol and cigarette consumption.

deadheadskier · Feb 26, 2016

BenedictGomez said:
We should debate what temperature h20 boils at next.

Oh, I'm sure you're the world's foremost expert on water boiling.
We already know you are Rhodes Scholar on economics, finance, politics, weather, apparently drugs now too. How do we know? You tell us regularly.

All of the studies paint with too wide a brush. You can find countless studies showing the same conclusions on alcohol use. Kusty is right. The stereotypes are tired and inaccurate. I personally know plenty Doctors, lawyers, college professors, CEOs, people from all walks of life who participate regularly and exhibit none of your "conclusively proven facts."

Alcohol is a drug too. A legal one that's worse for society than marijuana.

Mmmmmkaayyyy.........

KustyTheKlown · Feb 26, 2016

Lawyer here. 15 year daily pot smoker.

BenedictGomez · Feb 26, 2016

mbedle said:
I got a really nice contact high on the gondola this morning at Stowe!!!! lol

That's crazy rude, and has happened to me before on several occasions too. Another, me, me, me, me, me, thing.

Edd said:
Are you advocating for keeping it illegal? If the answer is yes, than I'm assuming you feel the same about booze.

I think it should be illegal some places and legal other places (i.e. I think it should be a state's rights issue).

Jcb890 · Feb 26, 2016

Not sure if it has been mentioned, but I would have to imagine (no data for or against this) that a lot of the reason that marijuana is a gateway drug is that people need to go to someone who may dabble in more than just marijuana. When said dealer runs low/out of marijuana, they may offer something else, or even if it is just laying around at said person's house, said user may be curious. Making it legal and having people go to dispensaries removes this. You're not going to some shady guy who may try and sell you something else or may lace what you're buying with something, etc.

So, in my opinion, legalizing it and selling it under supervision, as in CO, makes it less of a gateway drug than it is now.

Of course, you'll still have those that progress from marijuana to other drugs like some do with alcohol (from crappy beer to pounding hard liquor), but I think it would be lessened overall.

KustyTheKlown · Feb 26, 2016

If a person wants to smoke on a chairlift or gondola, they should ask the other riders if they mind, and if they mind, the smoker shouldn't smoke. If someone lights up without asking, it's discourteous. If you just sat there stewing about it, you probably should have asked them politely to not smoke on the chair with you. Just be a human being about it.

"States right" sure, but it needs to be federally descheduled so that states truly have the green light to do as they please, and we can end this archaic prohibition against real medical research.

Jcb890 · Feb 26, 2016

BenedictGomez said:
That's crazy rude, and has happened to me before on several occasions too. Another, me, me, me, me, me, thing.

I think it should be illegal some places and legal other places (i.e. I think it should be a state's rights issue).

While I don't agree with your overall stance and opinion on some of this thread, these 2 comments are spot-on, IMO.

Smokers should not be smoking in an enclosed gondola with people they do not know without first asking if they are okay with it. I feel the same about cigarettes. Not much you can do if you get in a gondola that someone previously smoked in, but that's different. I agree it is rude to just light it up, regardless of those sharing a space (gondola) with you.

As far as different by states - this could work. Many different states have different laws for alcohol - some states have a limit on the ABV (alcohol %) in a beer or liquor. Something similar could probably be done for marijuana, but it would probably be more along the lines of it just being flat-out recreationally legal vs. illegal in some places, which would be OK too.

Jcb890 · Feb 26, 2016

KustyTheKlown said:
If a person wants to smoke on a chairlift or gondola, they should ask the other riders if they mind, and if they mind, the smoker shouldn't smoke. If someone lights up without asking, it's discourteous. If you just sat there stewing about it, you probably should have asked them politely to not smoke on the chair with you. Just be a human being about it.

"States right" sure, but it needs to be federally descheduled so that states truly have the green light to do as they please, and we can end this archaic prohibition against real medical research.

Yup.

I'm not a skier, but I'd enjoy sharing a chair/gondola with you some time.

KustyTheKlown · Feb 26, 2016

Again, it needs to be taken off the controlled substance list at a federal level before states can truly legitimately make the decision for themselves. Right now we have a sympathetic justice department. But if one of these right wing lunatics wins, that could change in a heartbeat

Edd · Feb 26, 2016

KustyTheKlown said:
But if one of these right wing lunatics wins, that could change in a heartbeat

Christie blew my mind when he was spouting off about going after legal weed. I was like "Why in the world would you waste your time....?" He sounded insane.

I wouldn't worry too hard about any of them winning. It's like watching a slow motion train wreck.

KustyTheKlown · Feb 26, 2016

Yep, feels good to be on the right side of history for EVERYTHING.

Vermont Senate Passes Ski Area Bailout

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