Global warming.....& New England skiing

[smootharc]

Any of you scientists (non-government) out there want to hazard a guess as to the possible effect of increased global warming / gulfstream changes on New England's winter temperatures and snowfall ? Next 5 years ? Ten years ? Beyond ?

It just seems that we're going there, climate-wise, whether we like it or not. And, selfishly, I'm curious as to how the little slices of planet earth I spend the most time in might be changed.

Feel free to focus on a 10 mile stretch of the Green Mountain crest from Lincoln Gap heading North, if you are a super-duper scientist....

 

[awf170]

this is just what i heard, but because of global warming the weather in NE could get snowier and colder(really wish i could remember what show i saw this on) But global warming would some move the gulf stream out further away from us causing colder air to move in and more snow. Im not saying i truley believe this or i want to figure it out, it is just what i heard. Something that kinda supports this is that i think out of Bostons top 10 snowiest winters like 5 or 6 or something like that have been since 1990....... let me go try to find a chart or something..

heres something i found, here is the top 5 snowiest winters in boston since i think 1920, and if we add this year which was like 80 inches right???
that makes 4 out 6 of the snowiest years in the past 12 years

107.6" 1995-96
96.3" 1993-94
89.2" 1947-48
85.1" 1977-78
83.9" 1992-93

 

[ctenidae]

I'd hazard a guess that no one can predict what effect any aspect of claimate change will actually have. I think the current thinking is wider swings in temperature (hotter summers, colder winters). If the Gulf Stream moves further north, we'd see a lot more moisture available, but the jet stream may fight with it, causing more storms.

 

[JimG.]

The Gulf Stream is a conveyor belt of sorts that moves warm water from the tropics up to the more temperate areas like the Northeast. This conveyor is based on the salinity of the sea water in the Atlantic, and the Atlantic is the saltiest of Earth's oceans.

The theory is that as the Earth warms and the fresh water in the ice caps melts out that the Atlantic will become less salty and that it will reach a point where the water becomes too fresh and the conveyor shuts down. Debate rages over whether this will be sudden (like a switch) or gradual.

The last time the Atlantic became too "fresh" was during the last ice age. So, if this happens as predicted the Northeast would get noticeaby colder (but not get plunged into a deep freeze and covered with glaciers overnight like in the movies). Expect longer winters and more snowfall.

This is strangely appealing to me :beer: .

 

[awf170]

This is strangely appealing to me :beer: .

Time to go buy a hummer H1 :wink: , still dont wanna try and figure out if this is true.

 

[bvibert]

The last time the Atlantic became too "fresh" was during the last ice age. So, if this happens as predicted the Northeast would get noticeaby colder (but not get plunged into a deep freeze and covered with glaciers overnight like in the movies). Expect longer winters and more snowfall.

This is strangely appealing to me :beer: .

Woohoo, best news I've heard all day! :beer:

 

[blacknblue]

The last time the Atlantic became too "fresh" was during the last ice age. So, if this happens as predicted the Northeast would get noticeaby colder (but not get plunged into a deep freeze and covered with glaciers overnight like in the movies). Expect longer winters and more snowfall.

This is strangely appealing to me :beer: .

Woohoo, best news I've heard all day! :beer:

And yet, somehow, I'm still not ready to concede the fight against environmental destruction... :roll:
I know this is a somewhat facetious thread, but there are people who believe an increased greenhouse will be favorable--climatically and otherwise. While the more snowy and cold winters would make me happy, there are obvious side-effects that are unfavorable. (We all know this, right?) Sorry to be 'that guy.'

 

[JimG.]

And yet, somehow, I'm still not ready to concede the fight against environmental destruction... :roll:
I know this is a somewhat facetious thread, but there are people who believe an increased greenhouse will be favorable--climatically and otherwise. While the more snowy and cold winters would make me happy, there are obvious side-effects that are unfavorable. (We all know this, right?) Sorry to be 'that guy.'

You are quite right! Imagine NYC having to remove a foot of snow every week, or even every month. What if all that snow was in the mountains and you couldn't get to it because the roads were blocked?
Arrrrrrggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!

On another note, are you convinced that this warming is due to humans changing the climate? I'm not. We may be speeding the process somewhat, but climactic fluctuations like these have happened frequently in Earth's past, going back long before humans were around. We may have no choice.

 

[dmc]

What if all that snow was in the mountains and you couldn't get to it because the roads were blocked?

Come stay at my house...
Bring beer, food and firewood...

 

[JimG.]

What if all that snow was in the mountains and you couldn't get to it because the roads were blocked?

Come stay at my house...
Bring beer, food and firewood...

:lol: :lol: :beer: :beer:

 

[loafer89]

I am just getting around to reading this new topic, this is something that I had proposed to Greg about two months ago but never got around to posting on it.

I am fascinated with the study of the cryosphere (frozen aspects of our planet) and all of the data that indicate a warming climate.

Here are some of the websites that have data on global warming, especially more related to skiing and New England:

Global warming effects on New England Skiing:

www.cleanair-coolplanet.org/information/pdf/ski-factsheet.pdf.

Global warming effects on skiing:

www.pistehors.com/articles/global.htm

New England Regional Climate Variability And Change Assesment:

www.necci.sr.unh.edu

There is also lake ice out data for New England going back to the mid 19th century that show lake ice out to be 9 days earlier in northern New England and 16 days shorter in southern New England.

Temperature increases in New England (1895-1999) by state:

ME - 0.4 (negative)
NH + 1.8
VT + 1.6
MA + 1.0
CT + 1.4
RI + 2.3
NY + 1.0

I am not ready to completly join in on the bandwagon that mankind is causing global warming, but I do not think that we are helping things either.

 

[pizza]

I think that our tendencies as cold-weather freaks with experience of no more than a few decades is to mistake short-term climate swings, which can last many decades, with global climate changes which can last many millenia. I also think that the social programming that goes on every day in media leads us to believe that we're the cause of these changes, where climate changes, both short and long term, have been going on forever. In other words, if there is a change in the overall warmth of the planet, it might be happening with or without us.

But I'm just a skeptic. I could be wrong.

 

[bvibert]

What if all that snow was in the mountains and you couldn't get to it because the roads were blocked?
Arrrrrrggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!

Just get yourself a big honkin SUV with some MATTRACKS on it and you'll be good to go!

 

[ctenidae]

I've always thought the "Save the Planet" mantra was a load of malarky. Earth will do just fine, with or without us. There is nothing we can do to destroy it. Ourselves, yes. The Earth? Not so much. Environmentalists should change the cry to "Save the Humans." Probably be more effective that way.

 

[JimG.]

What if all that snow was in the mountains and you couldn't get to it because the roads were blocked?
Arrrrrrggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!

Just get yourself a big honkin SUV with some MATTRACKS on it and you'll be good to go!

Oh yeah, I NEED one of those right away!

 

[Zand]

The fact is that due to the melting of the icecaps of the North Pole, they are creating new ocean currents which are headed from north to south. This is messing with the Gulf Stream which could actually cool New England. However, it probably wouldn't cool anyone outside of 100 miles within the ocean.

 

[loafer89]

Global climate change was once thought to occur gradually, but new evidence supports the theory that it can occur rapidly and within one's lifetime.

The Little Ice Age (1450 - 1850) ended in a period of only 6 years (1844 - 1850) This fact is clearly shown by ice core samples taken from Upper Fremont Glacier in Wyoming. These ice core samples show an abrupt climate change during this time period.

The Northern Hemisphere as a whole has yet to fully recover from this ice age even more than 150 years later. The climate is still colder and more choked with ice/snow than it was at the end of the 13th century.

Forcing (both natural and manmade) can cause climate change. Mount Tambora erupted in April 1815 in Indonesia and the airborn volcanic ash caused a tremendous reduction in sunlight/solar warmth to reach the surface of the earth. The summer of 1816 was known as the year without summer in New England with widespread frost/snow in New England in June, July and August.

The modern day increase in carbon dioxide is causing the modern climate to warm rapidly. The greatest threat to skiing in New England in my opinion would be the fact that global warming increases the nightime temperatures and would inhibit snowmaking in the early season.


Also the great white north is not so cold and snow covered as it was even 30 years ago. Some predictions are that by 2050 the North Pole could be FREE of summertime icepack. Permafrost is melting at an alarming rate in Alaska and the Yukon of Canada. Less snow and ice means less intense cold air supply from the north.

 

[loafer89]

Recent study is showing indications that North Eastern Europe (Northern Norway, Finland and Sweden) are starting to experience colder winters. Permafrost is also starting to build southward in Western Siberia. At the same time Eastern Siberia and Russia are experiencing much warmer winters.

Could this be the first indications of the breakdown of the Gulf Stream?

 

[loafer89]

The Mount Washington Observatory just recorded the highest average mean temperature for June EVER at 51.5F which is 7.1F warmer than average.

What is more amazing is that no daily record temperatures were broken.

 

[skibum1321]

Granted there is no definitive evidence that humans are warming the environment but it is pretty convincing (and scary evidence). Imagine a winter that is 6 degrees warmer....Say goodbye to good skiing if that actually happens.