Views wanted on marriage/monogamy/infidelity

[severine]

Before I start, let me just say this is a genuine interest that I'm curious what others' views are on this topic. Granted, I may not have come up with this topic 2 months ago on my own. But right now, I've been doing a lot of reading on it and so it's ignited a curiosity in me to see what others think.

So I quote from the Top AZer you've had intimate relations with thread:

Attitudes definitely change. Infidelity is probably no more rampant now than it was 30 years ago. It's just that 30 years ago, people didn't divorce over it... whereas I read a stat this morning that at least 50% of divorces these days are due to infidelity.

Makes you wonder.... are we really meant anthropologically to stay monogamous to one partner for a lifetime? Or do you think that longer life expectancies have led to an increase in divorces because people realize they'll have to spend a longer life with a partner? Or is it maybe that people today are just plain selfish and only care about #1 instead of giving and taking like you would in a mature relationship?

I'm really interested in views on this... maybe I should make a new thread?

And these were some articles I had posted in that thread (plus a couple more with great info):

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17951664/

http://ezinearticles.com/?Who-Cheats-More:-Men-or-Women&id=440585

http://divorcesupport.about.com/od/infidelity/qt/whymencheat.htm

http://ezinearticles.com/?Why-Men-Cheat-vs-Why-Women-Cheat&id=779596

http://www.webmd.com/sex-relationships/guide/nip-infidelity-in-bud

http://women.webmd.com/guide/why-we-cheat

 

[severine]

BTW, I'm not looking to turn this into a heated argument. Again, this is not a personal discussion. I'm just curious about others' opinions on this. I have some myself but I'll save them until later so as not to color this thread (and you may be surprised by what I have to say).

 

[GrilledSteezeSandwich]

I'm not an expert on the subject but I've been in several relationships..one over 3 years so here's my take. First of all..you can't have love without trust. If somebody lies and cheats..the relationship will never be good again..Once a cheater always a cheater. Marriage is a partnership...and both parties should do equal amounts of work....If the husband works 50 hours a week and the wife is a stay at home Mom..the time the wife is home with the kids is considered work just the same. Each guys night out should equal a girls night out..it's only fair.


Life is too short to stay with someone you can't trust..there are alot of good men and women out there..and the controlling, manipulative, cheaters..can find each other. Water seeks it's own level..i'm a nice guy..so I expect to one day find a nice girl..I'm not going too settle for a bitch.

Some people get married just because of their age..that's dumb..My cousin was 29 and still single..she dated an O.K. dude..less of an asshole than the last guy and since she was 29..she expected to be married at 30 and have a kid at 31 and it happened. If she was dating the same guy in college..she would have never marriedd him. Divorce lawyers make a ton of money..marriages end due to finances, cheating, lack of attraction, and inattentiveness. Not everybody has the ability to put themselves in others shoes. With a divorce rate at over 50%..you should see all the tombstones in the junk pile at work from married couples who prebought tombstones and got a divorce..lol..

 

[deadheadskier]

Statistically the divorce rate today is the lowest since 1970. There are also fewer marriages though.

I personally think that age is the biggest factor. For the vast majority of people, I think that a man shouldn't be getting married until he is at least 30 and a woman, perhaps 27-28. As with everything there are exceptions for some, but I really don't think its a good idea getting married earlier than that. I just feel that there are so many things working against people in their 20's. Finishing up an education, figuring out where they want their career to go, having greater money stresses and social factors. With all of those things going on, I think for most it's difficult to give a relationship the attention it deserves.

As for infidelity, I would think the stats are pretty equal for both genders. I know I have been cheated on far more than I've cheated and the one girl I cheated on, she had strayed first and trust was broken. I might not have had that not occurred. I also know that I probably deserved having women wander from me in the past. I didn't realize it at the time, but I was emotionally neglectful.

Up until about age 25, nearly all of my interests consisted of partying with friends; whether doing the ski bum thing or seeing vast amounts of concerts. I was literally out involved in some sort of social engagement until 1 in the morning five days a week at minimum. If the women I were dating, weren't interested in doing that, tough luck because Gov't Mule is in town and they only come to town three days a year or today's a powder that I can't miss. Of course there were many many Gov't Mule's and powder days in my life at the time. From 25 to 30, I was a workaholic putting in 65-80 hours a week to try and get ahead in my field and make up for lost time from when I was partying when younger. I was far too wiped out when I did have free time to give anything towards a relationship.

Now my life has far more balance. I don't party so much. I go out maybe three days a month instead of five days a week; I ski one to two days a week instead of five...though I'd like to change that . I also work a more sensible 45 - 60 hours a week and have fare less financial stress as I've progressed enough in my career where my compensation now allows for a much more comfortable lifestyle. It just so happens that I've also been in the best relationship I've ever been in for the past two years. Seriously, we've never 'fought' once and I can count the serious arguements we've had on one hand. Coincidence....I think not. I'd like to think our relationship would be equally as successful had we met six to ten years ago, but I know it wouldn't have been. I wasn't ready.


Okay, I'll stop rambling before I kill the bandwith here on AZ. You asked for views, you got it :lol:

 

[GrilledSteezeSandwich]

US Divorce rates lowest since 1970!!!

http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D8P1MG601&show_article=1

Alot of bad marriages stick together strictly for financial reasons. One associate I know wants to divorce his wife but it would be too expensive since they have 3 kids and lots of assets...

 

[OldsnowboarderME]

Infidelity is the cruelest emotional pain you can inflict on your partner. The longer you have been in a committed relationship the more the pain from the act. For me, it is the ultimate betrayal of trust. Vows whether spoken or unspoken should never be broken. If your unhappy in relationship ..divorce first but don't take up with someone first to see if that will make you feel better.
When I was married, I was being tempted by a pretty young thing but I could never inflict that kind of emotional pain on someone who I loved just for some momentary pleasure. Imagine my surprise when my ex did it to me several years later. When i found out about it I was crushed, I never could believe I could be so heart broken. Then she moved out and moved in with her new boyfriend. The only thing that kept me from putting a bullet in them was my kids.
even during the divorce she and her lawyer still continued to screw me. She felt things were owed to her for having to take care of the children. Ok I doing much better now but the memories remain. The pain has faded through the years but I was always remember.
I don't know why or really care for the reason why people can be so self centered. I view it as a major character flaw. I was raised to do the right thing no matter what the personal cost might be... Divorce is too easy today.. people want instant gratification.. no one wants to put some effort into a relationship .. for better or worst remember that..When there are kids involved it is even worst..
leaving because of physical abuse is one thing but leaving because I want to be first just plain sucks .. I have no respect for anyone that would leave under those terms. When my ex asked if we could still be friends I said No I have high standards when it comes to who i want to be a friend. If i can't respect you i can't be your friend.
To some I will sound bitter.. no matter.
Oh if Canadian Geese can mate for life, you would think we might be able to manage the same feat...

 

[nelsapbm]

I agree with what the others are saying, I think age has a lot to do with it. I shudder at the thought of where I'd be right now if I had married any of the guys I dated when I was in my 20s. EEK! IMO people grow up the most in their 20s.....it's a decade of change for a lot of people - entering the "real world", magaging on your own, etc. I know I'm not the same person now at 34 than I was at 24 thats for sure!
I met Mr. Right at 29 and we just got married in December (5 years later)- we're both on the same page about money (another deal breaker in relationships IMO), family, and what we want out of life. We were in no rush to get married.
I didnt read through the links provided, but I wonder if there is a correlation to age of marriage vs. divorce rate?
And I agree with Steezy...once a cheater, always a cheater.

 

[Moe Ghoul]

I think each relationship is unique despite commonalities in all of them. Going in to a relationship with unrealistic expectations and standards set by culture and media is usually a recipe for disaster. That said, if Spouse A is paralyzed from the neck down, and Spouse B is healthy, is it a violation of the marriage if Spouse A allows/encourages Spouse B to find some intimacy with a 3rd party? Spouse B loves and is devoted to Spouse A and wants to stay committed to the marriage, for better and for worse. If you answer that with a No, its consensual, how broadly does that exception become? Where does one draw the line? Were human beings really designed to stay married and monogamous for 40,50, 60 years? I don't know. I do know as much as I love my wife and life, marriage is a lot like russian roulette. If you survive, the thrill isn't worth trying again, lol.

 

[thetrailboss]

As I learned last year, once a cheater, always a cheater. My ex, who some of you met, has been sleeping with her married boss for about a year now. He has four kids and has been married twice. I doubt that the wife knows it and someday she will.

That was the most painful thing I have had to endure. It was egregious. The lawyer in me tries to fathom the logic behind it, but there is none. We were happy, well I thought. But the whole thing is just twisted and I walked out. My friends and family were in disbelief.

As was said, there needs to be trust and once it is broken, it is over.

I spent the last year skiing, having fun, and getting back into dating. I am now with a pretty amazing woman who is a bit older than me, but is in med school and working her ass off. We have a pretty deep level of trust right now and have very similar backgrounds. We treat each other well.

I can say that from the terrible ordeal I appreciate myself and now my new relationship much more, and I have come to see how much someone can really appreciate me and our new relationship.

 

[deadheadskier]

leaving because of physical abuse is one thing but leaving because I want to be first just plain sucks ..

None of the girls I was with that strayed, did so because of physical abuse. They did so because of emotional neglect. I wasn't ready to give what is needed to be given to a relationship, but didn't realize it at that time and chalked them up to being whores. :lol: Looking back, I would've left me to. 99% of the time, it's the 'cheater' that gets villafied, when in fact much of the time the 'cheated's' behavior is the primary reason infidelity occurs. That said, I'm not condoning people to 'cheat' if their partners aren't holding up their end of the deal; it's always wrong.

However, I don't think it's wrong for someone's mind/heart to wander and consider whether someone else might fulfill them better. That's not being selfish, that's being human. Some people are willing to exhaust more effort than others in salvaging a relationship and working through problems. I don't necessarily view this as the 'right thing to do' nor do I view such people as better than those that aren't as willing to put in as much effort. Everyone is different.

 

[thetrailboss]

99% of the time, it's the 'cheater' that gets villafied, when in fact much of the time the 'cheated's' behavior is the primary reason infidelity occurs. That said, I'm not condoning people to 'cheat' if their partners aren't holding up their end of the deal; it's always wrong.

Sorry, but I disagree. If someone is cheating, or thinking of it, they need to have the balls to come to terms with why and speak with their partner and try to resolve it if they value that person. If not, end it. Simply saying, "my needs are not met," should not be a free pass to do whatever the hell one wants and cheat on their partner.

 

[Moe Ghoul]

Oprah and Dr. Phil are on the phone.......they want to make a show about this thread.

 

[Hawkshot99]

Your vows are "Till death do us part" not till when we feel like ending it. If you can not make that commitment then do not get married.

Cheating is unacceptable as far as I am concerned.

 

[OldsnowboarderME]

None of the girls I was with that strayed, did so because of physical abuse. They did so because of emotional neglect. I wasn't ready to give what is needed to be given to a relationship, but didn't realize it at that time and chalked them up to being whores. :lol: Looking back, I would've left me to. 99% of the time, it's the 'cheater' that gets villafied, when in fact much of the time the 'cheated's' behavior is the primary reason infidelity occurs. That said, I'm not condoning people to 'cheat' if their partners aren't holding up their end of the deal; it's always wrong.

However, I don't think it's wrong for someone's mind/heart to wander and consider whether someone else might fulfill them better. That's not being selfish, that's being human. Some people are willing to exhaust more effort than others in salvaging a relationship and working through problems. I don't necessarily view this as the 'right thing to do' nor do I view such people as better than those that aren't as willing to put in as much effort. Everyone is different.

Thank You for making my case and point .. Sorry but you don't just get it do you and I doubt you ever will .. This line of thinking so f@#ked I can't even begin to speak on it.. it's like the same line of reasoning if you hadn't said that I wouldn't had to hit you ..

 

[OldsnowboarderME]

Thank You for making my case and point .. Sorry but you don't just get it do you and I doubt you ever will .. This line of thinking so f@#ked I can't even begin to speak on it.. it's like the same line of reasoning if you hadn't said that I wouldn't had to hit you ..

Oh just so you know I don't hate you deadhead ( which actually explains a lot) .. I will buy you a beer at Tenney next season ..

 

[GrilledSteezeSandwich]

Oprah and Dr. Phil are on the phone.......they want to make a show about this thread.

ahahahahahaha...

 

[Moe Ghoul]

Wrong thread, oops

 

[GrilledSteezeSandwich]

Your vows are "Till death do us part" not till when we feel like ending it. .

Yeah but some people stay in bad marriages..if a marriage is bad it should end in Divorce. My Aunt stayed with my uncle for 20 years and the last 10-15 were bad but they stayed together for the sake of the kids..and then when the youngest went to college..they divorced and now they're both in really good loving marriages. Both of my parents were in bad marriages before they met each other when they were in their early 20s..but it's a good thing they met each other back in 78 or I wouldn't be here..

 

[deadheadskier]

Sorry, but I disagree. If someone is cheating, or thinking of it, they need to have the balls to come to terms with why and speak with their partner and try to resolve it if they value that person. If not, end it. Simply saying, "my needs are not met," should not be a free pass to do whatever the hell one wants and cheat on their partner.

I said cheating was wrong. Maybe it didn't come across right, but if someone's in a relationship and they're unhappy and make every effort to try and get through that with their partner and their partner isn't willing to put the same effort back; then I think its human for that persons mind/heart to wander. The right thing to do would be to break up. Unfortunately, some people aren't mature enough to leave first before seeking the affection of another person.

And I completely disagree with the 'once a cheater or always a cheater' statement. I'm great friends with a girl who cheated on me. It took me three years to forgive her, but eventually I did. She's been completely committed to her husband for six years and is a great wife whom I know would never cheat on him. Why? Because it's the right relationship for her.....ours wasn't. What she did to me was very wrong, but we really shouldn't have been together in the first place.

Look divorces suck, but not all of them are bad. 90% of the people I've known that have gotten a divorce, I say to myself...saw that one coming. There are far too many people who put square pegs in round holes and get married to the wrong person for the wrong reason. Every relationship has that 'honeymoon' stage where for the first three to six months everything seems perfect when in reality people's minds are clouded by lust. Because that stage happens, some people think that they can talk their way back to that point, but the reality is once the lust settles, there's no real compatability there.

 

[deadheadskier]

Thank You for making my case and point .. Sorry but you don't just get it do you and I doubt you ever will .. This line of thinking so f@#ked I can't even begin to speak on it.. it's like the same line of reasoning if you hadn't said that I wouldn't had to hit you ..

Our views are different OSBM. Nothing more, nothing less. I think cheating is horribly wrong. I don't think divorce is though. The girls who cheated on me, shouldn't have. The all were right in leaving me though to find a partner who could fulfill them better. Square peg, round hole clouded by lust.