Belleayre and NYS Budget Cuts

[edgeworker]

from the DEC website:

The 29th Annual Belleayre Fall Festival will be held this coming Columbus Day weekend, but at a new location thanks to a partnership announced today by the New York State Department of Environmental Conservation (DEC) and the Delaware and Ulster Railroad. The festival will take place on Oct. 11-12 at the Delaware and Ulster Railroad on Route 28 in Arkville, Delaware County.

The Delaware and Ulster Railroad is an excursion train that combines railroad nostalgia with scenic rides through New York's legendary Catskill Mountains. Trains take visitors through quaint villages, rolling fields, majestic mountains, pastoral farms and near the East Branch of the Delaware River.

Normally held at DEC's Belleayre Mountain ski area about five miles away, the Railroad has worked with DEC to supply support for the festival. Belleayre Mountain representatives will also be on-site to provide information about tickets for the upcoming ski season. Belleayre will operate seven-days-a-week this season.

This year's festival will offer train rides, a huge ski and winter apparel sale, live music, great food, dozens of craft vendors, a kid's crafts tent, face painting, and much more - all at the peak of fall color in the Catskill Mountains.

 

[thinnmann]

two new ones today

Daily Freeman #1:

snip-->>

HIGHMOUNT - Locals involved with the Belleayre Mountain Ski Center's annual October festival say plans to hold the event in Arkville this year are unacceptable and that state officials have yet to adequately explain the move or why they first attempted to cancel the event.​

Daily Freeman #2:

snip--->>

WASHINGTON - U.S. Sen. Charles Schumer on Tuesday called on the state Department of Environmental Conservation to guarantee a full ski season this winter at the Belleayre Mountain Ski Center in the Ulster County town of Shandaken.​

 

[skidbump]

Ok got 2 emails from someone in Phoenicia,
first one was he spoke to Judith Enck at DEC and she stated that fall festival was canceled to ease the budget cuts "6-7% "that have been mandated across all government agency's and he was assured that mt would be in full operation but cuts may affect staffing"minimally".
Second email stated info out belleayre is that its looking as bad as 2 lifts 5 trails.

 

[dmc]

I'm hearing some Belleayre instructors are coming to Hunter...

 

[ed-drum]

No matter what, this Belleayre debacle is going to be a disaster for ALL of the ski areas here. You can only fill a gallon jug with a gallon of liquid, then it will overflow. In other words, Hunter, Windham and Plattekill will suffer for they can only handle so many skiers. Belleayre pays better than Hunter, so the instructors will suffer. But now that Hunter has fired their long time heads of their ski school, maybe things will change for the better. So, will Hunter let go of their lesser instructors to get the better instructors from Belleayre? I've heard that Belleayre has a good ski school. Does anyone out there have a lot of money to develop Bearpen?

 

[Geoff]

No matter what, this Belleayre debacle is going to be a disaster for ALL of the ski areas here. You can only fill a gallon jug with a gallon of liquid, then it will overflow. In other words, Hunter, Windham and Plattekill will suffer for they can only handle so many skiers. Belleayre pays better than Hunter, so the instructors will suffer. But now that Hunter has fired their long time heads of their ski school, maybe things will change for the better. So, will Hunter let go of their lesser instructors to get the better instructors from Belleayre? I've heard that Belleayre has a good ski school. Does anyone out there have a lot of money to develop Bearpen?

If I were running Hunter, Windham, or Plattekill, I think I'd have a very different opinion. Those three ski areas have to make it on their own. If the state pays Belleayre employees above the market rate, the other three ski areas either have to match the rate or get less desirable employees.

I think this is all nonsense. New York should lease the ski area to another operator rather than run it poorly and at a loss themselves. Only 100-ish miles away, you have New Hampshire leasing Sunapee to the Muellers. The ski area is booming. The biggest problem is keeping a leash on the Muellers since they want to expand and develop real estate. I haven't heard anyone complain about the quality of the skiing product there. It's not for me since it's so intermediate but you need drive-to intermediate areas as feeders to the sport.

 

[ed-drum]

Maybe people should live in the area that's being affected before saying this is nonsense. It is going to kill the economy here. Then they would hear the people at Belleayre who don't go to the other Catskill areas state the reasons why they no longer ski at Windham or Hunter. A lot of people at last Saturday's meeting in the Belleayre lodge expressed concerns about the economy. We will have to change the New York State constitution to get Belleayre run by a private company.Plattekill is spoken highly of by the locals, but the parking lot is too small to accommodate any more skiers. This is more than a ski area that we are worried about. Ulster County was pretty arrogant about it's job base and security until IBM tanked and left empty buildings and people without a way to pay their bills. Maybe some people should see all of the closed businesses around the towns of Hunter and Tannersville.

 

[jamesdeluxe]

We will have to change the New York State constitution to get Belleayre run by a private company.

Geoff: this ^^^^ is the part of the Mueller-style plan that would take a wee bit of work.

 

[dmc]

If I were running Hunter, Windham, or Plattekill, I think I'd have a very different opinion. Those three ski areas have to make it on their own. If the state pays Belleayre employees above the market rate, the other three ski areas either have to match the rate or get less desirable employees..

to make matters worse - Belleayre is exempt from labor laws that are enforced at private areas... Meaning they can hire "volunteers" like ambassadors and pay them with a season pass... Hunter hasn't been able to do that for a long time... The state came in and told them everyone had to be on a w2.

It's also expempt from 4 hour minimum pay per day... So if someone works an hour the mountain pays them for an hour... not 4... Like the rest... Seem fair... But what if you got a couple hundred part time instructors on a rainy day... No $ coming in... Because of the weather and all those people get paid for 4 hours... Thats a big cost....

 

[dmc]

Geoff: this ^^^^ is the part of the Mueller-style plan that would take a wee bit of work.

i say do it...

 

[Method9455]

I think ultimately a private company running the operation would be more stable for skiers/riders and more profitable for the area - IF the state allows them to make some expansions. Maybe in exchange for approving the resort it is time to sell it off to some private corporation.

I find it difficult to get worked up over this when the state of NJ is spending millions to help with building the new Giants/Jets stadium. Those teams could easily fund the whole thing they just fought for and got a few million. You could probably run Belleayre for decades on that money. I know it's a different state but this kind of crap happens all the time. And contrast the area around Giants stadium - within view of NYC - with the area around Belleayre/Hunter/Windham, and tell me which needs more economic stimulus?

 

[ed-drum]

Forget about Windham, Hunter and Plattekill. Even if they weren't here it is going to be a mess for the people who live around here. Belleayre installed a fixed, slow quad a few years ago then replaced it with a high speed detachable lift two years ago. What were they thinking? Talk about wasting tax dollars. The roads around here stink, the schools are being mismanaged and property taxes are skyrocketing. Who is footing the bill to rebuild Shea stadium, which is over 40 years old? The Beatles played there. Isn't it being subsidized by tax dollars? Lets close Shea stadium and dissolve the Mets. The inmates here in New York are running the asylum. As I have stated before, I know people who work at all of the ski areas here and they are concerned as well as the people who work at bars, restaurants, hotels, etc. What about the ski shops such as Potter Bros. who cater to Belleayre skiers almost exclusively? Let's close Belleayre totally, for it has concerts in the summer and a beach. Let's close Jones beach too. Shut down New York state while we're at it.

 

[thinnmann]

I haven't told my nine year old daughter she may not have a ski team this year. I have no idea how to have that conversation...

Did you know our kids might ski together?...

From an email received today from one of the coaches:

There will be a race program at Bellearye this season, according to Tony.
We will train every weekend on whatever trails are available. There will be
limited gate training. But there will be NO races at Bellearye. No high school,
no NASTAR , no USSA,no MWC.

So, if your daughter wants to race this year, you should sign her up for USSA/NYSSRA.
She will then be able to compete in the Rip Van Winkle series. The
races will no doubt be at Hunter, Windham, and Holiday.

Come to the dry land training on October 25/26 at Belleayre. By then we will
know much more about how the season is shaping up.​

 

[Brettski]

Didn't read the whole thing...BUT

Who is in charge to get some real answers?

 

[jamesdeluxe]

Double posted link, sorry.

 

[thinnmann]

Didn't read the whole thing...BUT

Who is in charge to get some real answers?

Looks like we might get a name tomorrow from Daily Freeman:

The man who has the final say over the budget of state-owned Belleayre Mountain Ski Center has been invited to visit the facility next month for a quick lesson on its importance to the local economy.​

...but it does not say who that is...

The Daily Freeman weighs in:
http://www.dailyfreeman.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=20110578&BRD=1769&PAG=461&dept_id=82701&rfi=6

Old news, Sep. 10, and covered in ths thread here. I know how tough it is to read this entire thread....

 

[legalskier]

What is unique about Belleayre is that it has a protected status enshrined in the "forever wild" clause of the New York Constitution (article XIV, sec. 1). The citizens of the state have spoken, reaffirming its status several times. Thus, efforts to choke off funding for the facility effectively circumvent the will of the people. Beyond that bottom line status, Belleayre acts as an economic engine in a region that needs it, providing jobs at the facility itself, as well as feeding economic benefits to local businesses like restaurants, hotels, pubs, merchants, tradesmen, artists, craftsmen, real estate firms, healthcare workers, etc. State funding for Belleayre guarantees its permanency, so that it not go the way of other privately owned ski areas that failed in the Catskills (e.g. Cortina; Phoenicia; and Plattekill for a time). Additionally, Belleayre provides affordable and accessible winter activities to a segment of the state population that otherwise could not participate. At Belleayre many lower income folks have learned the joys of winter sports that the rest of us have enjoyed for so long. Denying funding denies these people. It would be sadly ironic if these people were effectively discriminated against under Governor Paterson's administration. I hope he does not turn his back on them. Belleayre also has made a commitment to providing services for adaptive skiing, again providing something that may not receive much priority at some profit-driven private areas. Finally, taking the "private v. public" argument to its logical extreme would mean the closure of numerous municipal swimming pools, state and county beachfront parks, municipal golf courses, county campgrounds--in short any and every public facility anywhere near privately owned "competitors." One could only imagine the kind of backlash that would engender. Some earlier posts have noted that lift ticket prices are affordable atBelleayre while the food is expensive. Perhaps this is because the food service is contracted out to a private company. Leasing the mountain to a private company would guarantee the same result for the rest of Belleayre.

 

[ComeBackMudPuddles]

What is unique about Belleayre is that it has a protected status enshrined in the "forever wild" clause of the New York Constitution (article XIV, sec. 1). The citizens of the state have spoken, reaffirming its status several times. Thus, efforts to choke off funding for the facility effectively circumvent the will of the people.

Can you explain this argument? I don't quite get what you're saying, but it could be 'cause I'm not familiar with the issues. If anything, wouldn't closing Belleayre and letting it go fallow fit better within the "forever wild" mandate?

 

[skidbump]

DEC head may visit Belleayre
By Jay Braman Jr., Correspondent
09/23/2008
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HIGHMOUNT - The man who has the final say over the budget of the state-owned Belleayre Mountain Ski Center has been invited to visit the facility next month for a quick lesson on its importance to the local economy.

State Sen. John Bonacic, R-Mount Hope, says he has invited Environmental Conservation Commissioner Pete Grannis to visit to see for himself what would happen if Belleayre Mountain is allowed to fail.

Yancey Roy, a department spokesman, said Monday that Grannis has been to Belleayre Mountain before and would gladly visit again.

Belleayre Mountain faces an uncertain future in the face of state budget-cutting measures in response to a substantial and growing state budget gap. While no specific figures have been released officially, staffers and local officials say they have heard 181 jobs will be eliminated and fewer trails and lifts will operate in the upcoming ski season. Amenities such as the ski school and the nursery, which is a form of day care for infants while moms and dads hit the slopes of the family-based facility, are also slated for closure or scaled-back operation.

Last week, Bonacic told the Belleayre Region Lodging and Tourism Association he is working to ensure Belleayre remains the "economic engine" of the state Route 28 corridor.

Bonacic said, "Commissioner Grannis is an avid outdoorsman and someone who cares a great deal about our environment. No cuts to his department are easy for him. I want to impress upon him, though, that when you are cutting Belleayre, you are truly, in an already weakened economy, hurting thousands of people."

The timeline for any decisions about the ski center's budget remain unclear, especially given the news that Gov. David Paterson is warning he may need to call the state Legislature back into session before Election Day to make further cuts to the state budget amid growing troubles on Wall Street. The governor is expected to make that decision by the end of this week.

Meanwhile Belleayre's plight has caught the attention of U.S. Sen. Charles Schumer, D-N.Y.

In a prepared statement, Schumer said the facility is too important to the Ulster County economy to be allowed to fall to the wayside.

"I hope that the DEC will heed the community's call and commit to a full ski season at Belleayre so that we can keep the jobs and revenue generated by the ski mountain," Schumer wrote. "It would be a severe blow to the region should the ski center not operate for a complete season ... The benefits that would be achieved by cutting operating costs at Belleayre Mountain would pale in comparison to the economic turmoil it would create in the region. I cannot overstate the significance that Belleayre Mountain Ski Center has on the local economy."

Members of the Belleayre Region Lodging Tourism Association said they need to swell their ranks to have a stronger voice in Albany whenever their livelihood is in peril.





©Daily Freeman 2008

 

[jamesdeluxe]

Some earlier posts have noted that lift ticket prices are affordable atBelleayre while the food is expensive. Perhaps this is because the food service is contracted out to a private company. Leasing the mountain to a private company would guarantee the same result for the rest of Belleayre.

Interestin'. I wasn't aware of that.