Honda CRV v. Toyota Rav4 v. Subaru Forester

[campgottagopee]

Subaru made a great business decision capitalizing on the SUV/CUV market. Won't be long until their logo starts morphing into a Toyota symbol. Not expecting them to count their one loss with me (and other like minded folks) as any big loss compared to their huge gains with the soccer mom crowd. They are now "what makes a Subaru a Subaru." And I'm okay with that, won't see me in one though.

They really did. Back in 1995 Subie decided to drop their FWD cars and produce AWD only, that took brains and even more balls, look where they are now. Guess it really pays to concentrate on one thing and do it well. They'll never be a BIG car company but they sure are a good one.

Wise men realize that snow tires are more important than AWD and you can live in snow country year round without AWD and never have problems with good snows.

Like DHS, just messin'

80% of the time I'd agree with you. I'm tellin' ya you come over to my house during a snow storm and you'll be walkin your FWD ass up my driveway :razz:. Without AWD/4WD and some ground clearance you wont make it, really. You'll also be walkin' back into deer camp, and that REALLY sucks. So all you FWD band wagon jumpers come on over, I'll be waiting inside sipping a cold one :beer:

 

[riverc0il]

80% of the time I'd agree with you. I'm tellin' ya you come over to my house during a snow storm and you'll be walkin your FWD ass up my driveway :razz:. Without AWD/4WD and some ground clearance you wont make it, really. You'll also be walkin' back into deer camp, and that REALLY sucks. So all you FWD band wagon jumpers come on over, I'll be waiting inside sipping a cold one :beer:

There are totally times when AWD pays. If you have a really steep hill for a driveway or are truly going off roading in the snow, you need AWD. For 99% of skiers, even those of us that storm chase, its a luxury item only and not needed. I've been storm chasing for a while. The ONLY time I've had difficult drives or difficulty extracting my car were before I had snows. Otherwise, I have to do something pretty dumb with my car to think "I might have had a chance with AWD". Subbie's success has a lot to do with people's perceptions of what they "need" when they really don't. Some people do and that's cool. But Subbie would never have succeeded if only people that really needed AWD bought Subbie.

 

[campgottagopee]

There are totally times when AWD pays. If you have a really steep hill for a driveway or are truly going off roading in the snow, you need AWD. For 99% of skiers, even those of us that storm chase, its a luxury item only and not needed. I've been storm chasing for a while. The ONLY time I've had difficult drives or difficulty extracting my car were before I had snows. Otherwise, I have to do something pretty dumb with my car to think "I might have had a chance with AWD". Subbie's success has a lot to do with people's perceptions of what they "need" when they really don't. Some people do and that's cool. But Subbie would never have succeeded if only people that really needed AWD bought Subbie.

I hear ya, but Subies success is due to the fact the the cars they build are solid. 5 star crash rating across the board, ALG residule awards up the wazoo, back to back Motor Trend's SUV of the year awards (never done by ANY manufaturer be4), and so on. So I think it's a little more than perception:wink:

 

[hammer]

FWIW I don't see a disproportionate share of AWD cars in Park City...

That said, I have owned AWD cars for many years and will continue to do so. I've had enough situations on commutes where having all wheels available made a difference. I'm normally too lazy/cheap to get a separate set of wheels and snows and if I do decide to get them then I'll be all the better for it.

 

[mlctvt]

The best combination is AWD and Snow tires! That's what we run on our two Subaru wagons. I'm sure tomorrow's drive north we'll be happy to have both.

Many storms when its snowing we're in the left lane driviing 55+ . Anyone with all seasons is stuck in the right lane at a measly 35 MPH or so and the few that try to drive 55 usually end up in a ditch. This includes the SUV drivers on crappy tires. I can't count how many drivers we've seen slide off the left lane into the Jersey barriers or median.
I agree with Riv though it's definatley more the tires than AWD in most cases.

 

[tjf67]

I hear ya, but Subies success is due to the fact the the cars they build are solid. 5 star crash rating across the board, ALG residule awards up the wazoo, back to back Motor Trend's SUV of the year awards (never done by ANY manufaturer be4), and so on. So I think it's a little more than perception:wink:

Don't forget the increase in the dike population. Do you smerk when thet come in?

 

[tjf67]

The best combination is AWD and Snow tires! That's what we run on our two Subaru wagons. I'm sure tomorrow's drive north we'll be happy to have both.

Many storms when its snowing we're in the left lane driviing 55+ . Anyone with all seasons is stuck in the right lane at a measly 35 MPH or so and the few that try to drive 55 usually end up in a ditch. This includes the SUV drivers on crappy tires. I can't count how many drivers we've seen slide off the left lane into the Jersey barriers or median.
I agree with Riv though it's definatley more the tires than AWD in most cases.

I would say its the driver 100% of the time. Know what your car can do and stay within its means.

 

[Glenn]

Just a really random note here. In all my driving this winter, I didn't see any AWD or 4x4's stuck. The most common stuck vehicles; fwd minivans and fwd asian imports stuck on hills...or stuck getting into/out of an unplowed street.

 

[campgottagopee]

Don't forget the increase in the dike population. Do you smerk when thet come in?

That was good, damn. You're on top of your game today, TJ.

To answer your question, yes.

 

[wa-loaf]

Hey Camp,

What does a 90k service run at your dealership? 05 2.5 Outback.

 

[campgottagopee]

Hey Camp,

What does a 90k service run at your dealership? 05 2.5 Outback.

We don't offer a 90k.

60k is 704.99
75k is 404.48
105k is 857.20

we can get you in anytime and if you need a loaner just let me know 8)

 

[wa-loaf]

We don't offer a 90k.

60k is 704.99
75k is 404.48
105k is 857.20

we can get you in anytime and if you need a loaner just let me know 8)

Ha, well you're a little far for me. Just curious. My dealer wants me to come in for a 90k and it's gonna be around $500. Maybe I should just get the oil changed and have it looked over. Save my money for the 105k ... had the 60 and 75 done.

 

[campgottagopee]

Ha, well you're a little far for me. Just curious. My dealer wants me to come in for a 90k and it's gonna be around $500. Maybe I should just get the oil changed and have it looked over. Save my money for the 105k ... had the 60 and 75 done.

With having the 60 and 75 already done you're good till 105k for sure.

 

[wa-loaf]

With having the 60 and 75 already done you're good till 105k for sure.

Sweet, maybe I'll buy some skis instead. :idea:

 

[campgottagopee]

Sweet, maybe I'll buy some skis instead. :idea:

I like the way you think :beer:

 

[bigbog]

90k...HA!, it's still an infant....... Do the preventive maintenance pro-actively and it'll go a long way.
Looks nice....

 

[hammer]

Ha, well you're a little far for me. Just curious. My dealer wants me to come in for a 90k and it's gonna be around $500. Maybe I should just get the oil changed and have it looked over. Save my money for the 105k ... had the 60 and 75 done.

Does the car have a timing belt? For many cars those usually need to be replaced at around 90K or so. Not something you want to put off...

 

[campgottagopee]

Does the car have a timing belt? For many cars those usually need to be replaced at around 90K or so. Not something you want to put off...

T-belt change is part of the 105k

 

[wa-loaf]

Does the car have a timing belt? For many cars those usually need to be replaced at around 90K or so. Not something you want to put off...

T-belt change is part of the 105k

Mine was actually changed at 60k. They had it open for a small oil leak and saw it was slightly frayed. So got that and a few things fixed under warranty. Timing belt is good to 160k now.

 

[skijay]

I have had my 2009 Forester for just about 2 yrs and 28,000 miles and have had zero issues with it. I do have another car that is my daily driver for my long, long 12 mile commute each way to work. The other is a car and gets between 35 and 40 mpg on my 10 mile highway and the final 2 miles @ 45mph. The Forester is used mostly for Friday – Sunday or when we have inclement weather.

Do I regret my purchase? No
If I had to replace it would I buy another Forester? Yes

What I do not like about the 09-10 is:
1. 30K tune up for the EJ25 (new plugs, brake flush, etc) and the timing belt
2. Passenger seat is uncomfortable for tall drivers
3. The 4 speed automatic is the worst transmission I have ever experienced. It searches too much for the correct gear. It does to much up, down, up, down shifting. I drive in the manual shift mode most of the time. That is the saving grace for this dated 4 speed autobox.

What I love.
1. Inexpensive to buy
2. Cheaper to insure than the 2003 Saturn VUE it replaced
3. Super easy DIY oil changes. I even made it easier by using a K&N oil filter.
4. Reliable. Isn’t that one of the reasons people buy these????
5. Great all around handling. There is something to be said about the flat4 as it does make it fun to drive and it does stay firmly planted to the road.
6. This has AWD. Even though I drive it like I drive my FWD car without snow tires. In other words I do not have the, "I have AWD and I own the road attitude", as some owners of AWD / 4WD vehicles tend to have. I was so thankful NOT having to be towed out of Carinthia’s lot in April during mud season.
7. Well put together.
8. Fuel economy is decent. I do get between 23 to 28 mpg. The Saturn VUE did return the same fuel economy. The VUE was also FWD with a 5 speed manual, a smaller 2.2 displacement motor with about 20 less hp and was at least 300 lbs lighter than the Forester it replaced.
9. Longevity. I’ve seen many mid 1990’s Legacy models in VT running around up there. They may look a little beat up but they seem to be built to take the salt belt rather well. That was another reason to purchase a Subaru.


I am considering the purchase of the Subaru Gold plus warranty before the 3/36 expires. I have been pricing them online. If anybody knows where I can get a deal on one, PM me.