Is Addiction a Choice?

[hammer]

had a friend that was told to quit drinking coffee by his doctor, had horrible headaches for a week coming off coffee.might not have been as intense as the muscle pains coming off herion but a physical pain all the same

Surprised that the doctor would recommend going cold turkey...if I had to give it up I'd gradually cut back.

 

[andyzee]

I notice a while ago that coffee gave me anxiety so now i mostly drink black tea still has good amount of caffeine and if its a sleepless day then I might have a small coffee. Plus working in my town a crappy small cup of coffee cost usually 2 dollars and change a good lg cup of coffee could daily coffee person like near 10$, tea cost me set up of five dollars for glass measure cup, then maybe five dollars for box of twenty i like the varietys they have.

Coffee $2, WOW that's a deal. Funny thing, in this day and age that's the truth.

 

[andyzee]

Surprised that the doctor would recommend going cold turkey...if I had to give it up I'd gradually cut back.

Cold turkey is the way to go, otherwise you're just playing with yourself. I know people that quit smoking, they would go for let's say a week, two weeks. I'd ask how they're doing, answer good, only had one smoke to get through. My response, you just started smoking again.

 

[kingdom-tele]

I would highly recommend reading this, "The Compass of Pleasure: How our brains make fatty foods, orgasm,exercise,marijuana, generosity, vodka, learning, and gambling feel so good." - David J. Linden

he has another book, "The Accidental Mind" which is also quite interesting with regards to the evolution and function of our brains.

may not change anyone's opinion but certainly will enlighten to how complex and associative our brains really are.

 

[riverc0il]

I haven't read thru this thread, but my take on the original question is that I don't think anyone ever choices to be addicted. But.......

They do make that first decision to try ____________ knowing that the very likely consequences are addiction when they first try it, whatever "it" is.

So while they may not choose to get addicted, they do choose to do everything that causes them to get addicted.

This might be a sound argument coming from someone that is completely 100% straight edge. But I assume everyone in this thread has tried alcohol? It is easy to blame and vilify the victim when you're not in the glass house yourself. We all choose to do things that we know are not completely 100% healthy. By this reasoning, no one should ever try anything addictive for fear of getting addicted. I think a Bill Hicks quote popularized by Tool might fit in well right about here...

Essentially, this thread veers dangerously off topic when we start examining initial decisions to do things. That seems to get into more of a morality argument. The whole point of addiction is that people start losing their choice that they once had. And as previously noted, prescription drugs for extreme pain can be addicting and there isn't much choice there...

 

[Hawkshot99]

And as previously noted, prescription drugs for extreme pain can be addicting and there isn't much choice there...

When I had my wisdom teeth out and my ACL redone I was given a big bottle or percs. I took the once or twice for the knee and then never again, because I hated the feeling the gave me. I would much rather deal with the pain than the horrible feeling the pills gave me.

 

[Warp Daddy]

When i had OPEN HEART surgery/ triple bypass 2 and half years ago they initially had me on a drip line in the cardiac intensive care unit for 2 days after the surgery. I was not in control of THAT decision

Then on day 2.5 i was moved to a regular room they then offered me pain pills IF i wanted them . They ranged in strength form serious heavy duty stuff to very low level tylenol . I never took anything but the lowest level of tylenol. During the week i spent there in recovery i think i took only 2 tylenols .

Made a decision that i could "make it " without . I 'm a firm believer in palliative care when the situation warrants it , but in my personal case i was willing and physically ABLE to mentally endure . Is it the Right way -- who knows ?? For me it was. I made a decision to shift gears mentally realizing that i could piss and moan and feel woe begotten or i could treat this situation as a grateful survivor and an adventure rather than a drudgery .

I find it hard to believe anyone who choose addiction but realize that initial experimenting is a threshold to that being a possibility. Like you i have seen some real heartaches endured by families who must deal with this fallout and also seen is some cases the triumph of the spirit when someone actually rehabs successfully ---

 

[SkiDork]

Andy, its a disease of the mind not the body, When people think about disease they think cancer etc. But its more like scizophrenia or bi polar or ADHD then it is cancer.

 

[andyzee]

Andy, its a disease of the mind not the body, When people think about disease they think cancer etc. But its more like scizophrenia or bi polar or ADHD then it is cancer.

I understand this, but in my opinion this way of thinking can also be considered enabling. I have lost friends and relatives to addiction and enabling was one of the worst culprits. I have seen it in the past, I still see it now. Enabling plays right into an addicts game.

 

[deadheadskier]

I understand this, but in my opinion this way of thinking can also be considered enabling. I have lost friends and relatives to addiction and enabling was one of the worst culprits. I have seen it in the past, I still see it now. Enabling plays right into an addicts game.

Expand on this. So, if you agree that addiction is in part a mental disease, do you also feel that a doctor diagnosing someone with bipolar is also a form of enabling?

Speaking of the comparison, often drug abuse / addiction coincides with deeper mental issues. It's often the result of depression that people turn to drugs to artificially elevate serotonin levels.

 

[snoseek]

When I was a 15 I sniffed a line of Coke. I really really liked it. The two years that followed all hell broke loose. At 17 I managed to muster the will power to stop and realized I could never ever do blow again, not even once, I am wired towards stimulants. At 18 I joined the military to assure that I would be away from this scene. I have two dead friends from that crowd and one that is 38 and hanging on to dear life with a NASTY crack habit. I don't consider myself any better than these guys, just had better guidance and a whole lot of luck.

At the same time I've been on pain killers before and completely hate them, they make me nothing but sick. I have smoked a little opium back in the day, same thing. It would not be possible for me to be addicted to any kind of opiate. I consider myself lucky that I'm not wired towards painkillers, almost everyone has to take them at some point, recovering addict or not. Time for modern science to find a better alternative to pain mgmt.

You guys realize that lots of addicts made dumb decisions before they were fully matured adults right? You also realize they didn't all have the benefit of growing up in a sanitized suburban environment with good parent role models and friends?

Ultimately yes each person makes that decision but a variety of factors can speed things right along...
Addiction sucks...

 

[andyzee]

Expand on this. So, if you agree that addiction is in part a mental disease, do you also feel that a doctor diagnosing someone with bipolar is also a form of enabling?

Speaking of the comparison, often drug abuse / addiction coincides with deeper mental issues. It's often the result of depression that people turn to drugs to artificially elevate serotonin levels.

Sorry, have to backtrack on that one. I was simply agreeing with Dork that is a mental issue as opposed to a physical one. If pushed for my thought on it, I will say it's a mental weakness not a disease. To call it a disease, in my opinion is just enabling. i.e. Poor Johnny has no control. BS, we all have control.

 

[snoseek]

Sorry, have to backtrack on that one. I was simply agreeing with Dork that is a mental issue as opposed to a physical one. If pushed for my thought on it, I will say it's a mental weakness not a disease. To call it a disease, in my opinion is just enabling. i.e. Poor Johnny has no control. BS, we all have control.

Yeah but all those people that die every day, would you consider them to have control? Do they all just want to die?

You know that if the drug is more powerful than the natural survival instinct then control is out the window. These are not all bad/stupid/unintelligient people, it happens all the time.

 

[SkiDork]

Sorry, have to backtrack on that one. I was simply agreeing with Dork that is a mental issue as opposed to a physical one. If pushed for my thought on it, I will say it's a mental weakness not a disease. To call it a disease, in my opinion is just enabling. i.e. Poor Johnny has no control. BS, we all have control.

does an epileptic have control over a seizure? (Maybe thats a bad analogy)

does a turettes sufferer have control over yelling out an expletive?

 

[kingdom-tele]

Sorry, have to backtrack on that one. I was simply agreeing with Dork that is a mental issue as opposed to a physical one. If pushed for my thought on it, I will say it's a mental weakness not a disease. To call it a disease, in my opinion is just enabling. i.e. Poor Johnny has no control. BS, we all have control.

so where is the dividing line between mental and physical.

if there are measureable neurochemical events occuring in the brain, is the brain not part of the body?

 

[ctenidae]

You know that if the drug is more powerful than the natural survival instinct then control is out the window. These are not all bad/stupid/unintelligient people, it happens all the time.

Exactly- the desire to quit is weaker than the desire to continue.

 

[andyzee]

These days we explain away every little behaviour issue as a disease, mental disorder, weakness, etc.. When did we stop making people responsible for their actions? Literrally, going by some of the arguments I see here, we can explain away why people kill, rape, and rob. Do we at any point stop making them responsible?

In the case of addiction, this does amount to enabling, seen it many times, not a pretty thing

 

[ScottySkis]

Expand on this. So, if you agree that addiction is in part a mental disease, do you also feel that a doctor diagnosing someone with bipolar is also a form of enabling?

Speaking of the comparison, often drug abuse / addiction coincides with deeper mental issues. It's often the result of depression that people turn to drugs to artificially elevate serotonin levels.[/QUOTE Yes I agree DHS with out talking about my self to much yes, I know that mental illness for certain plays a role in why I and many people have tried drugs, illegal ones and legal ones and i been on a lot, and for me the best anxiety, depression has been MJ and i stopped when i was under drs orders several times, nothing dr ever gave me worked or works as good as MJ.

 

[Abubob]

I think some people here are confused about the term disease.

Disease is defined as: a disordered or incorrectly functioning organ, part, structure, or system of the body resulting from the effect of genetic or developmental errors, infection, poisons, nutritional deficiency or imbalance, toxicity, or unfavorable environmental factors.
(source: http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/disease)

A disease CAN be a choice but it also doesn't have to be. One doesn't become an alcoholic just by walking near a bar and catching a whiff of beer. One doesn't "catch" an addiction. Walking in and getting a drink is a choice. (Abuse issues aside.)

Getting cancer or a viral infection is not a choice. Sure, you can avoid certain things you know cause colds or certain cancers but its much more a being in the wrong place at the wrong time sort type of thing. Developing a disorder of the mind can be environmental or genetic and again isn't a choice.

Drinking enough or smoking enough or injecting enough to do bodily damage (to the brain or other bodily system) started with an initial choice and a chain of choices to continue.

Besides if addiction were not a choice 12 step programs would NEVER work.