jerryg
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I own a small plot of land less than a mile from there. You're welcome to pitch a tent! Heck, I've thought about it. :idea:
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Sugarloaf Announces Terrain Expansion to Burnt Mountain and 10-year Development Plan
- Thread starter Greg
- Start date
I own a small plot of land less than a mile from there. You're welcome to pitch a tent! Heck, I've thought about it. :idea:
It's a 20 min drive to the mtn from there. I know some folks who always stay at the Herbert when they are there.
gmcunni
Active member
cool, 20 minutes ain't bad at all.
Is the Herbett that much cheaper than the Carrabassett Inn?
I feel like it's going to be an awesome year at the loaf. This is based on nothing but my own hope really but it is definately calling my name. It's probably one of the only mountain that impresses me after skiing in the west for so long, it just feels big and now it will be even better! Admit if you were coming from the rockies for one year it would just make sense. We need consistently deep snow!
+1
I'd also love to know what midweek rates run approx. I have passed plenty of times, like the location actually (more than Stratton anyways).
billski
Active member
Herbett If you look at the posted rates online, you'll see that the bottom price for a weekend or midweek room is 119 in Jan/Feb. It's only cheaper in the summer
http://www.herbertgrandhotel.com/
http://www.carrabassettinn.com/lodging.html
With most lodging, you'll get a more competitive rate it you call.
I think it's a nicer place than the discount spots. So the price is going to be a little higher.
But do they have strippers there?
Edd
Well-known member
Important question.
jerryg
Member
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I actually think Stratton is a great option. On closing weekend of the year, a bunch of folks I ski with all stay at the Mountain View Motel, which is on the southern end of Stratton. They only have eight rooms and we typically take them all. I think midweek rates during the year are $55-60 per night and sleep 3 people. That have kitchens, fridges, wifi, and the rooms are really clean. The owners are super-nice and we love giving them business. It's less than 10 minutes to the mountain and about a mile from downtown Stratton.
snowmonster
New member
^ Second the reco on the Mountain View. I actually feel a little bad about giving away a "secret" but I think the owners will appreciate the business.
Back to the topic at hand..."Sugarloaf makes me happy."
:wink:
Agreed. It should be on every page of the thread, at least once.
snowmonster
New member
I approve this message.
billski
Active member
Where is Sugarloaf?
J.Spin
New member
I was reading up on the exciting new Sugarloaf expansion and was surprised to run into all the snowfall talk here, but since the snowfall data I collected from the past few seasons came up, and I was heavily involved in the FTO discussion that rivercOil mentioned, I figured I’d reply to a few comments.
For those that want the details on how the plot was made from Tony’s data, I’ve added the plot and some explanation at the end of the FTO thread on eastern snowfall density.
Sorry to linger off topic, but the thread seems to be slow and not quite focused on Sugarloaf anyway right now, so I figured some people might find this information interesting.
Thanks to Tony Crocker’s discussions with Fred Lavenberg, who is actually involved in the measurements taken at the Mt. Mansfield stake, I think that we’ve got a decent handle on why the snowfall measured there is low relative to what people are actually encountering on the mountain. The discrepancy appears to arise from a combination of late day measurements, the use of a 24-hour interval for readings, and catching snow in an enclosed cylinder instead of atop an exposed surface like a snowboard. Folks that are intrigued by the details should certainly check out the FTO discussion in the linked text above, because Powderfreak was also able to comment from his perspective of actually being involved in the day to day snow measurement at Stowe Mountain Resort.
While Mt. Mansfield and other parts of the Northern Greens are not picking up quite the quantity of powder that one is going to see in Utah’s Cottonwood Canyons, the quality (if one chooses to associate lower snow density with higher snow quality) can be extremely high. Compared to the higher elevations of the Rockies, the Northeast certainly has more volatility in the weather as rivercOil mentioned, but when the dry upslope snow does come to places like Mansfield, it is often extremely dry. From firsthand experience many of us knew that the snow around here was generally quite dry (this is in part where the Champlain Powder™ expression comes from), but it wasn’t until Tony Crocker’s data that we could really see how it compared to a place like Alta in Utah, which is probably as good a gold standard for powder quality as anywhere. It turns out that the peak density of snow that falls on Mt. Mansfield (~7% H2O) is actually very close to the peak snow density at Alta (~6% H2O), and surprisingly, Mt. Mansfield receives a notably higher percentage of snowfall in the ultra light (less than 5% H2O) category than even Alta does. The numbers in Tony’s revised FTO table tell the story, but for an easier visualization of his data, I created a plot:
For those that want the details on how the plot was made from Tony’s data, I’ve added the plot and some explanation at the end of the FTO thread on eastern snowfall density.
I think it’s hard to really put a number of that sort on such a big region like the Western U.S. Even before seeing Tony’s data, I would have said that the typical snow in Vermont was much drier than what I’d experienced in the Cascades or the Sierra. It’s a generalization of course, and plenty of lighter snow can fall in the coast ranges of the Western U.S., but there’s a reason that terms like “Sierra Cement” and “Cascade Concrete” developed. I think Tony’s data from Mammoth speak to that clearly, in that even if one were to assume a density of 10% H2O that is often used by the National Weather Service and other forecasters for typical synoptic storms in the Northeastern U.S., it’s still drier than the ~11% H2O peak that is seen in the Mammoth snowfall data. Also, Mammoth Mountain is a rather high elevation, rain-proof resort compared to many in the Sierra/Cascades, so if anything, the lower elevation ski areas may have peak densities for snowfall above 11% H2O due to where they sit relative to freezing levels. As far as the 10% H2O average that is commonly used for snow density in the Northeastern U.S., I suspect I would have assumed that to be our peak of snow density a few years back (as evidenced by my comments in the Champlain Powder™ link above from 2004). But now, having lived in the Green Mountain upslope region and monitored snow density for a few years, I realize that it is often much drier than 10% H2O along the spine of the Greens. The typical 10% H2O number for snow density seems to hold up pretty well for big synoptic storms like Nor’easters (or at least the synoptic portions of those storms), but once you get into the mesoscale upslope events, the upslope that polishes off synoptic storms, or lake effect snowfalls, that number goes out the window. Looking at Tony’s data for Mt. Mansfield, one can see that more than half the snowfall is at a density of 8% H2O or below, and one seventh of the snowfall is even at a density below 5% H2O. Anything below 5% H2O is serious blower. Even down at our house at an elevation of roughly 500 feet, we’ll get snow so light and dry that if you close your eyes and walk through it you wouldn’t even know it was there. I’ve certainly spent more time in the Northeastern U.S. than out in the Rockies, but even after all my years of living and skiing in Montana, which is supposedly famous for its “cold smoke” powder, I’ve never experienced snow as dry and airy as we sometimes get here in Northern Vermont. Just like Tony’s data show for Alta, I found the snow to be more consistent in density in Montana, but we didn’t seem to get the extremely dry powder at the low end of the spectrum that I’ve seen around here. Unfortunately, a foot of 2-3% H2O Champlain Powder™ doesn’t do much for resurfacing or keeping one off the subsurface if it comes after the base snow has hardened from a thaw, but when the synoptic snow from a Nor’easter is topped with a foot of that fluff, you get the kind of conditions that people dream about.
Sorry to linger off topic, but the thread seems to be slow and not quite focused on Sugarloaf anyway right now, so I figured some people might find this information interesting.
wow
fantastic post J.Spin
fantastic post J.Spin
J.Spin
New member
Thanks, I'm glad you found it useful!
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