Today's Burlington Free Press Editorial on Ski Rescues

[thetrailboss]

http://www.burlingtonfreepress.com/bfpnews/editorial/1000h.htm

Your thoughts?

 

[Vortex]

I think when they do rescue missions on Mt. Washington on summer hikes they charge as well. I don't ski out of bounds, not my property. I do see the potential excitement. I can find fun on the marked trails. Someone ends up paying, the tax payer should not be the one in my opinion.... Not to mention the risk of life trying to save a life.

 

[Greg]

I concur with basically exactly what Bob R said.

 

[RossiSkier]

18-34

If the weather doesn't kill them, them bill them.

 

[dmc]

mmm.... OB.... mmmm... Have fun - but you should pay for your mistakes...

On a good year - I spend about 80% on my time off the mountain and in the back country..

...Three's in the trees(always have three people)...
...know the terrain....
...Carry rescue equipment...
...Carry communication equipment...
...Always let someone know where I'm going and when to expect me back...
...Out west - I always use a transceiver and carry shovel/probe... Turn the transciever on in the parking lot and turn it off in the bar in the evening...

I've helped carry liters down the little headwall at Tucks before... Give $$$ to the snow rangers every year... But I know whats involved... And I know that I may have to pay for rescue. Just hoping my knowledge will pull me through...

Had a half day slog out of a ravine trap in Utah last year... It's wasnt fun but it's the price you pay for making a wrong turn...

 

[ctenidae]

No argument here. You pays your money, you takes your chances.
Rather, you takes your chances, be prepared to pays your money.

 

[JimG.]

I like to ski in the woods, OB if necessary. But I've learned to go there in unfamiliar areas only when I'm with someone who is a local and knows the goods well. I learned that lesson the hard way when I went in the woods a few years ago and got hurt pretty bad because I didn't know the terrain and made a poor line choice. Since I was not OB, I was tended to by ski patrol.

If I made a poor choice and got lost and needed rescue, I would expect to pay for it.

However, where do you draw the line here? If we're going to charge skiers for OB rescues, how about boaters who go out when storms are approaching and need the coast guard to recue them? How about that hiker who had only one leg who needed rescue from Katahdin trying to complete the AT? Or hikers who go into the Grand Canyon and get trapped at the bottom by the heat?

All these situations involve folks who were aware of the danger and went anyway.

 

[dmc]

I have a feeling that if your an unprepared "gaper" your more likely to get charged for rescue then if you were a seasoned - fully equiped - back country enthusiest...

 

[Vortex]

I think DMC had 2 excellent points. Be prepared and go in groups. He obviously has a understaning of the risks and preperation needed to attempt a road less traveled by. There also can be a difference from back country and out of bounds. If they don't want you in a spot don't go.

 

[ctenidae]

Good point, JimG- where do you draw the line? The Coast Guard has the option of charging for rescues, if they see fit, which is good- the CG's been pretty good about deciding who had bad luck, and who was a moron.
Don't know much about the one-legged hiker. Seems to me, if he was properly prepared (except for the whole missing leg thing), he'd get a freebie. If his "training" consisted of sitting on the ouch opening bags of potato chips, well, that's a different story. Same thing with Grand Canyon, or any other situation, I think. You take risks- that's what the outdoors is for- but you do so prepared. If you don't, you need to learn a lesson. Better it be with your wallet than with your life. Skiing OB at a resort is just wrong, though- lazy, really. Put forth the extra effort, prepare properly, and go to the backcountry. Don't take the lift up so you can act cool and ski OB.

 

[dmc]

Skiing OB at a resort is just wrong, though- lazy, really. Put forth the extra effort, prepare properly, and go to the backcountry. Don't take the lift up so you can act cool and ski OB.

WHAAAT?? Are you serious...???

So if I'm at a place like Kicking Horse or Jackson Hole and they have OB gates... It's lazy for me to access BC by using them??? I put in the extra effort... I have the tools and skills to do it safely...

Thats just ridiculous... I would've missed some of THE best runs I ever took if I subscribed to that... Backside ABasin... OB gates in Jackson to Rock Springs.. Fernies BC Gates to the Fishbowl... I could go on and on...

Besides - I don't judge my coolness by what anybody else thinks... I do what feels good and what I feel I can safely accomplish... So what if I use BC restort gates???? I also spend days hiking off resorts too witht the splitboard...

wow...

 

[JD]

It's not like the rescuers are being forced to go out and do their job. Stowe HT team is all volenteer and dosen't charge, but the Mtn. Company (AIG) charges up to 10 G as a deterrent. State police and people on Hazardous Terrain teams are looking for exitement too, I know alot of them and they are excited about calls. Or they are excited about helping people because that's what they like to do. Getting hurt and needing a rescue dosen't put anyone in harms way that isn't making a decision to go into a "Dangerous" situation. It's not like innocent bystanders are going to die if you dilocate something while skiing of piste. I do see SOME $$$ being associated with a rescue like fuel and lost equipment, but to charge for labor cost does not make scense to me. I.E. manhours should not be considered in the bill.

 

[ctenidae]

dmc-
Include the "dont' take the lift up so you can act cool" bit in your assessment of what I wrote. If your idea of skiing backcountry is going out past the line at Killington, well, that' s just pathetic. If the best way to get to serious backcountry, as in, not on the resort's property, is using actual BC gates (there for the purpose of allowing easy access), and you're equipped and know what you're doing, well, that's just using all the tools available to you.

There's a difference.

 

[dmc]

It's not like the rescuers are being forced to go out and do their job.

I helped carry a liter from at Tucks from the left gully down to Hojos once..
Was more then glad to help...

 

[dmc]

dmc-
Include the "dont' take the lift up so you can act cool" bit in your assessment of what I wrote. If your idea of skiing backcountry is going out past the line at Killington, well, that' s just pathetic. If the best way to get to serious backcountry, as in, not on the resort's property, is using actual BC gates (there for the purpose of allowing easy access), and you're equipped and know what you're doing, well, that's just using all the tools available to you.

There's a difference.

You actually come off as sounding like if you use the resort to access BC then your not cool...
I resent that - cause I know tons of people that use resort BC gates... They also - on good snow years - bag and ski shots around here without using lifts... As well as participate in hut to huts etc...

 

[ctenidae]

Rereading the post, yeah, I see that. Didn't mean to come across that way.

What I meant is, a lot of the people, I think, who end up needing rescuing didn't have any business being out there in the first place- under equipped, inexperienced, and just running out of bounds because someone told them they'd be cool and have lots of friends. These are the people I don't mind seing charged for their own rescue.

 

[dmc]

Rereading the post, yeah, I see that. Didn't mean to come across that way.

What I meant is, a lot of the people, I think, who end up needing rescuing didn't have any business being out there in the first place- under equipped, inexperienced, and just running out of bounds because someone told them they'd be cool and have lots of friends. These are the people I don't mind seing charged for their own rescue.

....agreed....

 

[JD]

that being said, I ski lift served Back country all the time...am I lame??? I hike the hill before it opens, and start many tours with a ride up the quad. I don't think it's lame, it a way to get a 2000 ft head start. Sking OB here at Stowe is the norm with locals...it's all state park anyway.

 

[riverc0il]

the notion that skiers should only stick to on piste skiing is ludicrous (which the article is strongly advocating). instead, NSAA should realize it's a growing trend and promote responsible and safe access to off piste trails and woods. responsible includes footing a big portion of the bill, imo. $7000 seems a bit rediculous, but paying for the man hours of the rescuers and helping to pay for a portion of the equipment used in the rescue is reasonable. if someone just saved my life in the BC, i'd certainly be willing to open up my wallet for the cause.

 

[riverc0il]

part of the problem here is a couple unprepared people going OB at places like K and J that are attracting lots of attention. hopefully the media coverage and on going discussion will ensure people are assessing OB properly and not getting over their heads. the unfortunate result of this could be (which i hope it won't be) is that skiers earning turns in legit backcountry experiences (which i consider little different than winter hiking or summer hiking with more risk and preparation) are going to suffer unreasonable fees meant to be "detriments" or have stigma attached after an unavoidable accident despite being prepared and knowing the terrain. hey, accidents happen.... and the earlier question on where to draw the line is important. should higher fees be assessed for those requiring resque that actted foolishly or were unprepared? and where do you draw the line between four not so smart guys skiing off the backside of K vs. die hard BC skiers loosing it on what normally would be an easy line and needing a litter? tough call.