Skiings dirty little secret

[deadheadskier]

I wonder what Al gore has to say about this?

He's probably to busy idling in his SUV in front of his megawatt mansion in Tenessee to even care.


Don't get me wrong, I love Al Gore and the work he has put in towards the environment, but the man needs to practice what he preaches.

 

[jaywbigred]

I wonder what Al gore has to say about this?

Probably not that much, since as a member of the Board of Directors at Apple, he has repeatedly voted against corporate resolutions that would make Apple a more environmentally friendly company.

Causes are great when they win you Oscars and Nobel Prizes, but they become less important to Mr. Gore (nay, most politicians) when they effect your price of stock you own (who owns at least 1,000 shares of Apple and options on 59,000 more).

http://www.macworld.co.uk/business/news/index.cfm?newsid=20303

Just "another motherf*ckin politician, doin' nothin' but somethin' for his own ambition." - RHCP

http://newsblaze.com/story/20080125072738tsop.nb/newsblaze/TOPSTORY/Top-Stories.html

Does SkiDork get a demerit for bringing up a politician?

 

[SkiDork]

Does SkiDork get a demerit for bringing up a politician?

HILLARY!!!!!!!!

 

[severine]

Uh, oh! Don't go political!

 

[nycskier]

I feel like no one here even read my post or the links in it, because GSS posted his, umm, commentary directly thereafter...

Is the impact of
(Bus trip to Mountain)+(bus trip home from mountain)+(bus idling while at mountain) >,<, or = to the impact of
(25 or so cars/SUVs trips to Mountain)+(25 or so car/SUVs trips home from mountain) ????

Thank You! Finally a voice of reason

We should be encouraging more buses to go to ski resorts not trying to get politicians to scare them away.

Besides there already is a penalty imposed on idling buses. As I recall gas cost money. If Buses are willing to spend money to idle their buses all day they must be a reason for them to think it is worth spending their money to do it.

 

[ski_resort_observer]

In Burlington you can get a ticket for idling your car while parked. When it's cold I notice lots of people, mostly from out of state, who keep their car running while they are shopping at the local grocery store.

 

[deadheadskier]

Thank You! Finally a voice of reason

We should be encouraging more buses to go to ski resorts not trying to get politicians to scare them away.

Besides there already is a penalty imposed on idling buses. As I recall gas cost money. If Buses are willing to spend money to idle their buses all day they must be a reason for them to think it is worth spending their money to do it.

Yes, all forms of public transportation should be encouraged. That said, politicians aren't going to scare the tour companies away. Empty seats on the bus is what will scare them in the way and I doubt fewer people would use buses if they found out they wouldn't be idling all day in the parking lot.

If towns want to prohibit buses from idling, then they need to provide the facilities for buses to plug in their block heaters.

 

[jaywbigred]

the facilities for buses to plug in their block heaters.

Which leads to the further question as to whether the electricity used is coming from solar power (almost def not), hydroelectric power (prob not), wind power (prob not), nuclear power (possible, but prob not), or from a power plant burning coal, natural gas or oil (most likely), and assuming it is coming from coal/oil/nat. gas, is the impact of the use >,<, or = to the idling?

 

[deadheadskier]

Which leads to the further question as to whether the electricity used is coming from solar power (almost def not), hydroelectric power (prob not), wind power (prob not), nuclear power (possible, but prob not), or from a power plant burning coal, natural gas or oil (most likely), and assuming it is coming from coal/oil/nat. gas, is the impact of the use >,<, or = to the idling?

depends on the area. Sunday River and Sugarloaf offset 100% of the energy they use by purchasing wind credits.

I really don't think that point is worth agueing though. Plain and simple, idling is bad for the environment and should be discouraged. I really don't think anyone can argue against that.

 

[wa-loaf]

I'm all for discouraging the practice, but as stated there are some legitimate reasons that buses need to idle all day. There needs to be a combination of legislation to halt the practice and services offered by the ski areas to keep the buses coming. Ski areas (at least the big ones) should provide some sort of plug-in service, driver lounges and even heated bus shelters.

 

[SkiDork]

re: Deisels take a long time to warm up (I think someone mentioned that in here)

What about all the diesel SUVs/pickups? You don't see those guys idling all day when they're parked right?

 

[thetrailboss]

Cross posted from KZone:


I found out about this at Okemo:

The freaking buses stay idling ALL DAY LONG!!!

Typical example: At Okemo on Sunday there must have been between 20 and 30 buses, all idling all day long.

I actually knocked on the window of one of the buses and asked the driver why they had to be idling... After a lot of hemming and hawing, he came out with "the brake lines would freeze"

What a load of horse shit...

Has this ever been examined before?

Can we get this legislated????

How many carcinogenit particulates are being released into the atmosphere unnecessarily because of this????

Talk about being a green resert... NOT


Anyone have an opinion????

It probably has been mentioned, but VT did pass a no-idling law for school buses on school grounds. Whether that can be extended to resorts or not remains to be seen.

 

[Brettski]

Yes but what if you're idling in a Gondi?

Wait, wrong thread

 

[SIKSKIER]

OK,I'm far from a tree hugger but I fail to see why buses need to be running all day.As said before,they don't run all night so the brake freezing argument is out.I'm sure they warm up the buses before they are used but for how long?I can't imagine it's for more than an hour.The same thing could be done before departure from the ski area.As for truckers running their engines all night at truck stops,it would be pretty cold sleeping without heat.Compressors running to make snow,well they are MAKING SNOW,not running them and not making snow.Come on,use your brain.The buses are running and not transporting people.I for one can't stand when people leave their vehicle running.I get in mine in winter and it's warm in 5 minutes.What's the big deal?

 

[ski_resort_observer]

In Waitsfield signs were put up around the large parking lots by a local HS group asking folks to not idle their vehicles while parked/shopping. It's not law yet, like in Burlington, but probably down the road.

I think most of us are "fair weather" partcipants in this growing "green" movement. We will do it if it's not too big of a hassle. It does bug me when I see cars idling, locked(I assume) with no one inside while parked at Shaw's or Mehurons. Is is a metephor for a type of ski resort destination skier?

 

[Hawkshot99]

re: Deisels take a long time to warm up (I think someone mentioned that in here)

What about all the diesel SUVs/pickups? You don't see those guys idling all day when they're parked right?

Were it is cold enough that they need to, yes they do. Or they have a automatic starter that starts it every hour for enough time to keep the block/oil warm.

 

[Hawkshot99]

I wonder what Al gore has to say about this?

Gore’s mansion, located in the posh Belle Meade area of Nashville, consumes more electricity every month than the average American household uses in an entire year, according to the Nashville Electric Service (NES).

What would Gore say?

 

[tree_skier]

Mount Snow has the electric plug ins and the plugs in the bus lot (sundance) so they can plug in the heaters/ chargers and not idle.

 

[jaywbigred]

depends on the area. Sunday River and Sugarloaf offset 100% of the energy they use by purchasing wind credits.

Yes I am well aware. See my first post in this thread that no one read.

I really don't think that point is worth agueing though. Plain and simple, idling is bad for the environment and should be discouraged. I really don't think anyone can argue against that.

I can argue against it if it anti-idling laws/rules lead to more carbon-emitting vehicles on the road as a result of those skiers being forced to use NON-mass transit.

If anything, we should be doing EVERYTHING in our power to encourage mass transit to ski areas. The lack of which, I have to say, upsets me constantly. There should be more buses to ski areas! Why isn't taking the train more viable? Apparently people like sitting in traffic, like having thousands and thousands of extra SUVs on the road emitting fumes, like driving through snow, and so on.

I'll concede that once the buses are there, the idling is unneccessary, but the important thing is getting them there in the first place. My worry, then, is that any law or rule viewed as "anti-bus" might have an overall Chilling Effect (no pun intended) on the rate of bus trips to ski areas, generally, and that this would be a much greater evil.

 

[deadheadskier]

I'll concede that once the buses are there, the idling is unneccessary, but the important thing is getting them there in the first place. My worry, then, is that any law or rule viewed as "anti-bus" might have an overall Chilling Effect (no pun intended) on the rate of bus trips to ski areas, generally, and that this would be a much greater evil.

Give me one good reason why there would be fewer buses at ski areas if legislation was put into place to prohibit idling?

Do you honestly think people will stop using the bus if it's not idling while in the parking lot? Busses will only stop running to ski areas if the demand isn't there. I've never seen the demand so high as it is now. Friends of mine in the Boston area who would've never taken the bus to go skiing now do so because it's less expensive than driving.

I'm all for encouraging mass transit, but I do think it should be done in an environmentally responsible way. There is NO WAY anit-idling legislation is going to reduce ridership demand.