More news on apparent decline in snowboarding / increase in skiing

[Cheese]

I know all you skiers think it's so cool to see someone doing what you do - but if everyone carved - it would suck..

I would argue that the groom on any given trail would last far longer. It's the skidding by skiers and boarders alike which wipes the snow from the trails exposing the icy base layer beneath.

 

[C-Rex]

Well I let your "Rocker" comment go even though it was Shane McConkey skiing powder on water skis in Alaska that spawned reverse camber.

Didn't know that. I learned something today! :-D But it was definitely the snowboarding industry that brought it to the mainstream.

The funny thing is that a lot of pros ride regular camber boards more often than not. Rocker is nice for float in deep pow or for pressing rails with ease, but it sucks for stability and response when riding fast or trying to land off a 75 foot stepdown. A lot of the guys I know that rode rocker boards a couple years ago switched back to camber recently. I think rocker is nice for beginners because it's more forgiving but once you get to a certain level, camber is really the only way to go in everyday conditions. Just my opinion, of course.

I agree with the Dr. about terrain parks. I like to compare it to skateboarding vs. rollerblading in skate parks. I did both as a kid. I started skateboarding and was never really any good at it. The learning curve is very steep, but with roller blading I picked it up very quick and progressed steadily so it held my attention longer.

 

[dmc]

I would argue that the groom on any given trail would last far longer. It's the skidding by skiers and boarders alike which wipes the snow from the trails exposing the icy base layer beneath.

I've heard people complain about the trenches that carvers create...haha...

But seriously... If EVERYONE made those big carve turns.. I wouldn't want to share the trail with them..

I never have a problem on the trail edges ripping up all the snow that ends up there with small turns....

 

[AdironRider]

Actually most pros are using regularly cambered boards with the rocker models graphics for marketing. Trice, etc all do this.

Its not bad in powder, soft chop, soft bc stuff, but resort, park, big mountain, Ill take camber every time.

 

[SnowRock]

Interestingly enough there is a small contingent of hard booters I see out at Camelback fairly often. Male and female... i think mostly on Kesslers. I haven't been to Windham very regularly as of late but feel like there was a handful there as well. Don't see many at Hunter, or up in VT or out west when i go there.

I have never ridden on an alpine set-up like that... I ride a regular camber salomon man's board and can carve well enough (for me at least) on that, though seeing the hard booters laid out looks like it would be fun to try for a run or two.

 

[fbrissette]

I know all you skiers think it's so cool to see someone doing what you do -

All us skiers ??? I don't like carving. Carving is something i do for a short time when all the fun stuff (glades, steeps, backcountry) is closed.

 

[Glenn]

I think it's park skiing that's helping. A few years ago, I started seeing families snowboarding together. I figured once that happened, it lost a bit of its edge. Once you see mom an dad sporting center mounts, short poles, big jackets and saggy pants, the shark will have been jumped. :lol:

 

[Cheese]

I also see less and less true carving skis for that matter.

Rather than derail this thread ...

http://forums.alpinezone.com/showth...-ride-on-a-race-ski-latey?p=760501#post760501

 

[Mpdsnowman]

I'm pretty impressed that this thread has gone 4 pages and all the posts are respectful and intelligent. Maybe we all CAN get along!!

Lol I was actually thinking the same thing. But honestly ive only been on here since march of last year and it does seem pretty neutral all the way around lol...which is nice...

I think it is fair to say snowboarding did give the Winter Enthusiast industry a needed shot in the arm. I remember when resorts opened snowboarding up and yes it was an issue to many. Cant blame them skiing was the original...But it was conceived as expensive and for those of a more "astute" nature if you will lol and snowboarding did bring in a new group and sort of leveled out the playing field.

You guys are right when you speak of the punk kids now getting older and more responsible. And of course the majority back in 1984 were mostly kids....

But lol...

Snowboarding has done a lot for the industry lol

 

[AdironRider]

This whole debate reminds me of the NYT article this weekend about a bunch of hipsters from Brooklyn moving to the burbs.

Next thing you know them and the snowboarders will vote republican.

 

[BenedictGomez]

I also think that a lot of skiers have a quiver of skis. Many have rock skis, race skis, powder skis, etc. Most snowboarders have one board.

Maybe you're right, but in my limited sample size, the snowboarders I ski with all have at least 2 boards. Some have 3.

Riding in powder is especially awesome and while snowboarding in the woods is definitely more difficult than skiing, that's part of the thrill. Sometimes when I say how hard a section was, my friends suggest that I try skis and it wouldn't be so hard.

Have to disagree with this too. While skis are a much more practical and efficient all-mountain tool than snowboards, if there was one place where I think snowboarding has an advantage over skiing, I would say it would be in trees.

 

[Cheese]

While skis are a much more practical and efficient all-mountain tool than snowboards, if there was one place where I think snowboarding has an advantage over skiing, I would say it would be in trees.

Is this because of their ability to side slip narrower sections? If not, I'd think the blind spot and the difficulty in making quick turns would make the opposite true.

 

[dmc]

Is this because of their ability to side slip narrower sections? If not, I'd think the blind spot and the difficulty in making quick turns would make the opposite true.

It has to do with having less to deal with - imho... All I have is a one deck.. No extra ski and poles...

I point that deck where I want to go and it goes there.. If i need to switch for some reason I can do that as an extra tool in the box.. If I fall i don't lose my board which is nice...

Blind spot has nothing to do with it... I face down the falline... I can look left or right..

I can tear up trees all day long... Tight and steep... VT or Wyoming..

Hell - we even rode trees in Kashmir that if we stopped of fell we'd risk being attacked by monkeys... and I HATE monkeys...

 

[C-Rex]

Is this because of their ability to side slip narrower sections? If not, I'd think the blind spot and the difficulty in making quick turns would make the opposite true.

I've never skied so I really can't say for sure, but I figure with how much more movement is necessary to turn, and the fact that we can't really slow down without turning the board sideways a good deal, it's actually more difficult to snowboard. At least skiers can snowplow if they need to. Not to mention we have a wider surface area to work with. If the line is narrow or there are obstacles, having two narrower skis can be an advantage. Skiers also have the advantage of a single pivot point under your feet on the ski. This gives way more flexibility in bumps. Sorry but I just can't see snowboarding being easier in the woods than skiing.

/threadjack

I wonder if the decline in snowboarding and the rise in skiing is the same nationwide or if places more suited to snowboarding are maintaining better numbers.

 

[dmc]

I remember when resorts opened snowboarding up and yes it was an issue to many. Cant blame them skiing was the original...

Well... original skiing was a LOT different from what we know today..

Remember that skiing was borne from necessity - delivering mail - attacking the next town over...
And snowboarding was borne only for fun.

I was there when snowboarding opened up to ski areas.. In the mid/late 80's we we're there at Hunter and other areas working to make sure everyone had equal access.
When Hunter closed Anna Purna to boarders we marched into Izzy's office and complained...
When the tried to open a snowboard only "park" on Drop Off( I think) we marched into Izzys office and told him to open it to everyone..
When people on the chairs ripped into us - we calmly talked to them and quelled the miss-information.. and made some friends..

We've been at it for a while and I still jump in on the anti-snowboard BS I see to this day as many here know...

 

[C-Rex]

Maybe you're right, but in my limited sample size, the snowboarders I ski with all have at least 2 boards. Some have 3.

Do they have multiple board they use throughout the season for different conditions or types of riding, or do they just have 2 or 3 boards because they didn't sell the old one when they bought a new one?

I have 5 boards but 3 of them are unofficially retired. I've never sold a board. I still have all of them since I first started. One day they will make an awesome display in my man cave. The two I use are similar, but I keep the newer one for good conditions and the older one for days with likely rock encounters.

 

[C-Rex]

Well... original skiing was a LOT different from what we know today..

Remember that skiing was borne from necessity - delivering mail - attacking the next town over...
And snowboarding was borne only for fun.

I was there when snowboarding opened up to ski areas.. In the mid/late 80's we we're there at Hunter and other areas working to make sure everyone had equal access.
When Hunter closed Anna Purna to boarders we marched into Izzy's office and complained...
When the tried to open a snowboard only "park" on Drop Off( I think) we marched into Izzys office and told him to open it to everyone..
When people on the chairs ripped into us - we calmly talked to them and quelled the miss-information.. and made some friends..

We've been at it for a while and I still jump in on the anti-snowboard BS I see to this day as many here know...

You, sir, are a gentleman and a scholar.

 

[dmc]

Do they have multiple board they use throughout the season for different conditions or types of riding, or do they just have 2 or 3 boards because they didn't sell the old one when they bought a new one?

I have 3 working decks..
A smaller one for East Coast
A larger for Big mountains..
A Split deck for BC

i have a couple others that are totally trashed and not rideable...

 

[AdironRider]

I have two techinically, but really its one.

Two Salmonon burners, one custom split, and one regular 163 for inbounds.

I dont know of to many snowboarders that have more than one board, outside of a split. In fact I cant think of any.

Having an old board lying around that you used to ride doesnt really count IMO.

 

[C-Rex]

I have 3 working decks..
A smaller one for East Coast
A larger for Big mountains..
A Split deck for BC

i have a couple others that are totally trashed and not rideable...

Well, I'd say that a lot of the snowboarders on these forums are just a bit more dedicated than your average rider. So you guys don't count. :razz: I really want a split, but first I need to get my friends to buy into doing some hiking/skinning for turns. I don't think it'd be as fun, or safe, if I went by myself.