Burke Mountain: The 2006 AlpineZone Ski Area Challenge

[thetrailboss]

Hannah Collins, the Marketing Coordinator at Burke Mountain has agreed to take the 2006 Alpine Zone Challenge!!! This is your opportunity to ask questions, offer suggestions, or say some praise to the men and women who are in charge of the Northeast’s Ski Areas. Please post some suggested questions in this thread and we'll select ten to present for official responses.

Also please don't be offended if we edit/change your question for grammar, tone, or some other minor thing. In order to get in all of the questions we MAY merge some questions but we'll do our best to keep the substance of your question. If we don't get your question in, feel free to post a follow up after we get the results...we are encouraging the representatives follow the threads. :wink:

As always, please be respectful of Hannah and keep it civil. Also, please refrain from asking specifics about skier visit numbers, financials, demographic information, etc. Burke needs to be discrete about certain information.

We are honored to have Hannah participate in this challenge—Burke's third! :beer: Please take advantage of this special opportunity!

Ask away!

Burke's Profile

Burke's 2004 Challenge Responses.

Burke's 2005 Responses.

 

[thetrailboss]

All right, I'm going to get things going here.

Hannah, my compliments on the work that was done last season. The Sherburne Express is magnificent. Dashney Mile had consistent deep bases all season long. The Lodge work was great. Service was excellent at Burke this season. I am concerned about snowmaking last season. Could you tell us what work was done (besides the Dashney and Lower Mountain work)? It seemed that snowmaking last season was below par, especially considering that some trails including Little Dipper, Open Slope, Ledges, and Middle Fox's Folly saw little or no snowmaking done. During Christmas week, Binney Lane was grass which did not look too good. What happened? Was it the weather? Not having enough staff? Cost? What improvements are going to be made for snowmaking this season? The grooming and other snowmaking was great.

 

[from_the_NEK]

Burke Questions

The non-official reply on the snow making front is that I have heard that the snowmaking equipment wasn't all ready to go at the beginning of the season so the mountain started off trying to play catch-up after not making enough snow during what would turn out to be the coldest part of the year (mid-late December). I agree with TheTrailBoss that not having any snow on the upper section of Lower Foxes Folly looked really bad. That trail is right under the lift. Even though it is not used a whole lot, not having any snow on it makes skiers and riders think about how much snow may not be on the rest of the mountain. I know I was personally sick uke: every time I went over that section. Just having enough snow to cover up the grass that was sticking through would have been good.

So far I really like the new developments at Burke. The level of service was outstanding this year. The service was maybe even a little over the top (see "wasteful") during very poor condition days when there were very few skiers and riders on the mountain.

Anyway, I want to pose a question/comment about the plans for a high speed quad to the summit. I have recently heard disturbing rumors that the new lift has been cut from the drawing board :-o . I know that a lot of the skiers and riders that use the upper part of the mountain were scratching their collective heads when the Sherburne Quad was installed but we were all patient since we were told that this year, a summit high speed would be installed. I agree that the lift on the lower mountain is nice if you want to access the base lodge once in a while (which I did...once in a while :roll: ). However, even beginner skiers who are on the lower mountain improve enough over a year or two where they eventually want to access the intermediate/advanced terrain on the upper mountain . If they are used to riding the high Speed Quad at the base, hopping on the slow quad to the summit is a huge letdown :-? They will end up going elsewhere.
In order for Burke to attract return clients and to be considered a top resort among day trippers, the mountain HAS to put in a high speed to the summit :idea: . From my experience, this is THE major knock against the mountain. I have actually heard people say they do not want to go to Burke because of the long lift ride to the summit. Although, I'll be the first to admit that Burke doesn't really need the extra capacity that a high speed provides (I've been there on many a deserted powder Saturday), maybe having a high speed to the summit will actually bring people to the mountain and eventually make the extra capacity necessary. I don't want to see the mountain go under again and I am desperately hoping that the new owners don't base all of their future planning on last year's horrible snow conditions. If the owners are going to put serious $$$ into service they are going to need to put at least a little more $$$ into the skiing experience. So here is the question... Is the high speed summit quad still going to happen this year? Thanks for any input

 

[kingdom-tele]

first, thanks hannah for taking the time to read these

My question (to be read with good intentions), to you- Will burke consider offering VT residents discount ticket prices that are at least on par with jay or will the weekend full day prices still remain so high?

Would there be a day when burke considers 1/2 day tickets for morning as well as afternoon?

Thanks again

 

[nelsapbm]

I actually have more of a suggestion.....how about implementing a "Mad Card" style option...I don't get over to Burke often enough to buy a pass or the 10 ticket option, but if a 3-pack were available, I would almost definately buy. It's been very successful at both Mad River and Wildcat.

 

[thetrailboss]

Would there be a day when burke considers 1/2 day tickets for morning as well as afternoon?

Thanks again

They used to sell Sunday AM Tickets. And they also used to open at 8am on weekends.

 

[Jonni]

I know that this question has most likely been asked, but I will reiterate it again: What is the future for the Burke Mountain Poma? This lift is always the highlight for me of any trip to Burke. I make it a point to ride this thing at least once while I'm skiing just for the experience. I hope that this will continue to be a part of the Burke Mountain experience as at this point it's becoming a last of it's kind in the ski industry.

At this point, other than the installation of a new HSQ to the summit, my only recommendation would be to possibly install a mid mountain lift. I'm thinking along the lines of having this begin from the mid-burke area and going half way up the mountain. You may ask the question: why, if we have the Poma? My reasoning would be to have it service the terrain park, as well as service the "Lower" trails (Lower Willoughby, Lower Foxes', etc.). I would build use a second hand double chair to minimize cost and operation, as well as only run it on weekends and holidays. I know this isn't a question but I figured I would put in my $0.02 worth for something like that.

 

[thetrailboss]

Hannah, I just read the Caledonian's article on your meeting last night with Burke Town. Would it be possible to either post or send the images/maps of the proposals for this Challenge? How about setting up a website for locals and Burke enthusiasts to look at? Just from what I saw in the Caledonian's picture, it looks like the Summit Quad may be relocated to a line that runs from Mid Burke, up through Doug's Drop or so, and to the summit while another lift would be in the East Bowl, closer to Powderhorn/Wilderness.

 

[the original trailboss]

Growth goals

Hannah, what is the long-term "skier visit" target for the ski area portion of the Ginn real estate development? and, how private or exclusive do you think the ski area might become as the rest of the development grows?

 

[from_the_NEK]

Mtn Biking

I have a question about plans to increase business during non-snow months; I know the mountain works closely with Kingdom Trails. The trail system currently has several trails on the mountain in the vicinity of East Bowl as well as several others lower on the mountain. Is there any plan to enhance the experience of the Kingdom Trail experience by offering lift served downhill mountain biking from the summit? This would likely require a detachable quad. It appears from the picture of the meeting in Burke that was in the newspaper the other day that some lift rearrangement/replacement is still in the plans.

 

[thetrailboss]

Hannah--regarding lift configurations, it was rumored that there is now a plan to remove the Willoughby Quad, replace it with a shorter lift, and install a lift in the East Bowl that will reach the summit. This plan makes no sense because it (a) curtails any early or late season skiing plans that may rely on getting people to the summit for skiing, and (b) would mean that skiers and riders would need to use three lifts to get from the base to the summit. Sugarbush made a similar change, going from two to three lifts for base-to-summit access at Mt Ellen and many people complained. In 2002 Sugarbush went back to three lifts. Tell me that this is just a proposal and one that will not come to fruition.

 

[thetrailboss]

Regarding the Poma, last year, Dave Gwatkin said it was here to stay. As the original lift from 1955, it is not just historical, it is a relic. Can you confirm that Ginn intends on keeping it? Also, could you share some historical pics for us here? Though it has been modified, have you considered applying for Historical Site Status with the state or federal government seeing that it has been probably one of the longest operating lifts in the state? Last, the towers are looking rough on that lift and I know that Mr. Ginn likes his resorts in tip-top shape. Have you considered repainting the towers and cleaning it up? Thanks.

With regards to the lower mountain, there was some talk regarding replacement of the J-Bar or adding a lift to that area. Is this still in the plans? Where can we expect to see the old Hall Double resurface?

 

[thetrailboss]

And regarding lifts, might as well get to the heart of the matter. When will the Willoughby Quad be upgraded and what is in the plans?

 

[skibum9995]

What are the plans for on mountain real estate development. I've heard that the area around Mid-Burke will be the target for some building, is this true? How will the development effect the layout of the mountain, espically around Mid-Burke? Finally, I love the Mid-Burke lodge, is the current lodge going to stay as is or will development force it to be torn down and rebuilt. Thanks for taking the time to answer our questions.

 

[thetrailboss]

Any more questions here folks?

 

[Jonni]

Another question regarding lifts: Everyone has been talking about the possible new location of the bottom of the Willoughby chair if or when it gets replaced by a HSQ, but has there been any talk about relocating or heightening the top of the new lift? The current lift position forces skiers and riders to go uphill to get to the East Bowl and Dipper trails will this be changed at all in order to make getting to those trails easier?

 

[thetrailboss]

Good question, Jonni. I'm not sure what they can do considering that the landing where the quad unloads is the parking lot for the Toll Road, which is owned by the state. Knowing Ginn, they'd probably truck a bunch of gravel/fill up the Toll Road and elevate it!

 

[from_the_NEK]

The top of the lift doesn't need to be raised. The only trail you have to ski uphill (a whole 3.6 vertical feet!!!) to get to is East Bowl. The little traverse trail immediately to the left of the lifts unload area gets you to the Dippers without any uphill skiing.

 

[thetrailboss]

The top of the lift doesn't need to be raised. The only trail you have to ski uphill (a whole 3.6 vertical feet!!!) to get to is East Bowl. The little traverse trail immediately to the left of the lifts unload area gets you to the Dippers without any uphill skiing.

Very true. That cutoff trail is a savior. One of Northern Star's improvements. Good call.

 

[thetrailboss]

Closing this today.

One more question: about alternative activities at Burke. One of the criticisms at Burke is that there is no "nightlife" or anything. I had a few ideas that might help. First, how about taking Stowe's approach and offering night skiing? Now with an HSQ on the Lower Mountain and a renovated baselodge, and 100 percent snowmaking down there, why not place lights on the lower mountain runs and offer night skiing? Nobody else does it and te nearest competitor is Bretton Woods with one whopping trail. Offer three or four and you've got them beat. Maybe set up some bumps on one side of Bunker Hill. With that new terrain park on the Lower Mountain, it would be a hit. Plus, by only having lights on the lower mountain, you reduce light pollution. Also, do you plan on offering snowtubing anytime soon? The J-bar is perfect for that.