Haystack / Hermitage news

[icecoast1]

If you're going to buy that mountain, you might as well buy Barnstormer too unless you plan to just liquidate it, and without that new lift, there's no way theres more than 4.5 million worth of sellable assets

 

[ss20]

I do feel some sympathy for the people who invested in the Hermitage. Rich as they may be, no one deserves to be scammed.

I am out of sympathy for people who have tried to make Haystack a viable operation. Literally every decade the cycle of failure continues. Literally. Every. Decade. I say liquidate the crap outta it and re-vegetate it. Maybe keep a couple backcountry trails off the ridgeline.

 

[sull1102]

If you're going to buy that mountain, you might as well buy Barnstormer too unless you plan to just liquidate it, and without that new lift, there's no way theres more than 4.5 million worth of sellable assets

My only thought is IF you were planning to operate the place and you had another mountain or two in your portfolio you could move Barnstormer to that mountain and move whatever lift you are replacing to Haystack with the plan to run the place weekends and holidays only. I'm thinking something like Waterville buying it to replace White Peaks and then that lift lives out the rest of it's days as the new Haystack summit lift. Of course in the end it's likely cheaper in the mid to long term to just buy a new lift in this scenario and not move the 6 pack at all.

New owner will also need to replace many fan guns and the entire grooming fleet.

Oh! And you likely also have a legal battle to figure out if you can even be a public ski area. But with the rise of Snow as one of the most crowded resorts in New England you would think Haystack could make it through.


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[sull1102]

Just doing some digging, Barnstormer seems to have a good shot at being the new Kanc 6 Pack. The vert lines up well and they'd have some extra length so some minor engineering needed. Also Loon is entirely Dopp so that seems to make almost too much sense. Be the first bubble 6 in NH and save a couple million in the process.


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[MG Skier]

If I were a major group with opportunities to acquire a lift I'd want to move it to the closest mountain that needs a lift. Fuel costs aren't what they used to be and the bigger the lift as in 6 pack = more trucks, more gallons of fuel. But, what do I know my yearly budget/salary is a drop in the bucket to a major operation. I will say I really enjoy lift construction!

 

[drjeff]

If I were a major group with opportunities to acquire a lift I'd want to move it to the closest mountain that needs a lift. Fuel costs aren't what they used to be and the bigger the lift as in 6 pack = more trucks, more gallons of fuel. But, what do I know my yearly budget/salary is a drop in the bucket to a major operation. I will say I really enjoy lift construction!

I still say that the helicopter plucking the towers off of their current pads at the Hermitage, and flying them less than 2 miles North to the Sunbrook line at Mount Snow, and and then making the roughly 5 mile round trip with the 18 wheelers for the terminal parts and chairs, haul rope, etc, is still certainly in play.

Guessing that Boyne's offer won't be the only offer for that chair. They just started the bidding in this "game"

 

[jaytrem]

I still say that the helicopter plucking the towers off of their current pads at the Hermitage, and flying them less than 2 miles North to the Sunbrook line at Mount Snow, and and then making the roughly 5 mile round trip with the 18 wheelers for the terminal parts and chairs, haul rope, etc, is still certainly in play.

Guessing that Boyne's offer won't be the only offer for that chair. They just started the bidding in this "game"

Only about a 20 mile flight to Okemo. And we already know they're getting a 6 next year.

 

[drjeff]

Only about a 20 mile flight to Okemo. And we already know they're getting a 6 next year.

Pretty sure they announced that Okemo's would be a Leitner-Poma manufactured bubble six, so that eliminates the Dopp that the Hermitage's is...

Plus, could you imagine the chaos it would cause if they had to install a gray bubble vs the orange bubbles the okemo clientele are used too!! :-o;-):roll::razz:

Who knows where it will end up.... Guessing now it seems like the least likely place will be at the Hermitage....

 

[jaytrem]

Was the manufacturer and bubble part ever announced? I assume they would prefer to be all Poma, but if the price is right....

Also, when was the last time Vail built a bubble? Maybe Vista Bahn?

 

[drjeff]

Was the manufacturer and bubble part ever announced? I assume they would prefer to be all Poma, but if the price is right....

Also, when was the last time Vail built a bubble? Maybe Vista Bahn?

I forgot which lift site I read it on...maybe liftblog? But it was confirmed by an Okemo admin, that the new lift was going to be a Leitner/Poma and that L/P would also be handling the moving of the existing Quantum 4.

And yup, the last time Vail Resorts actually built a new bubble was the Vista Bahn back in the 80's. Although they now own a Dopp bubble 4 out at Park City, and 2, soon to be 3 L/P bubble 6's and a L/P bubble 4 between Mount Snow and Okemo.

Not sure what their international ownership resort portfolio vs just "partner EPIC resorts" and their lift types are off the top of my head...

 

[KustyTheKlown]

i just posted a new thread for an article about all the sanctioned vt backcountry zones, but the most interesting piece of the article to me was that they are actively glading 800 acres between snow and haystack. if vail were to buy haystack, connect with a slide-brooky type lift, and keep the middle fully gladed, it would take mount snow into the big leagues.

 

[slatham]

So if I recall correctly, Rainmaker Mountain LLC was formed by a bunch of Hermitage members. The Barnstormer is owned by a bunch of Hermitage owners. If the same group, sell Barnstormer for $3.5mm (or more), buy rest of Hermitage for $4mm, and the club is back in business (especially if Barnstormer sells for more than $3.5). But I have no idea if the Rainmaker investors=Barnstormer investors.

 

[jaytrem]

And yup, the last time Vail Resorts actually built a new bubble was the Vista Bahn back in the 80's. Although they now own a Dopp bubble 4 out at Park City, and 2, soon to be 3 L/P bubble 6's and a L/P bubble 4 between Mount Snow and Okemo.

So you know for sure they're building a new bubble and keeping the bubble on the relocated lift?

 

[MEtoVTSkier]

Yes, it was confirmed some where along the line by an Okemo official statement.

 

[jaytrem]

Yes, it was confirmed some where along the line by an Okemo official statement.

I keep hearing that, but nobody ever provides a link. I know I haven't seen anything official. At any rate I'm sure it wouldn't go over too well if there is no new bubble, but since when has Vail cared about that?

 

[drjeff]

Yes, it was confirmed some where along the line by an Okemo official statement.

That's exactly what I remember, The new lift will be an L/P orange bubble 6 with heated seats, and the movement/reinstallation of Quantum 4 will retain its bubbles and also be done by L/P

 

[icecoast1]

So if I recall correctly, Rainmaker Mountain LLC was formed by a bunch of Hermitage members. The Barnstormer is owned by a bunch of Hermitage owners. If the same group, sell Barnstormer for $3.5mm (or more), buy rest of Hermitage for $4mm, and the club is back in business (especially if Barnstormer sells for more than $3.5). But I have no idea if the Rainmaker investors=Barnstormer investors.

If Rainmaker is Hermitage members, I am shocked they didn't try to be the stalking horse for the lift as well, because if they want to run the mountain, they need that lift.

 

[sull1102]

I believe Rainmaker is not the group of club members according to that article.

 

[thebigo]

Yes, it was confirmed some where along the line by an Okemo official statement.

It was also posted in the comments on liftblog by the dude who runs liftblog, a reliable source. Speaking of liftblog, top story is on the kanc 8, safe to say boyne has no intention of placing the barnstormer at loon.

And rainmaker is about the worst possible name for a group of ski area investors.

 

[KustyTheKlown]

loon just sent an email with a promo video for kanc8. where on the moutnain will they be putting it? hopefully t2b augmenting the gondola?