legalize it already

[Jully]

I thought it was already decriminalized in MA?

It is decriminalized for less than 1 ounce.

 

[Jully]

I live in MA. The Ballot Question is pages and pages long. I couldn't read it. As a historical recreational user I've decided to vote No. Mostly because when you get govt involved in anything, it's gonna be a nightmare. What I would vote for is decriminalization. A legalization question should not take 12 pages of descriptions, rules, caveats and subclauses - right away you know it's not going to change a thing except More beauracracy. And as much as I enjoy my vice - I'm not sure I want it alongside cigs at the grocery store. And I don't want some newfangled drug test for drivers that will be unreliable but somehow appease people that no one is driving under the influence. This question has headache and beauracracy written all over it. The last ballot initiative is still being put into place and it's been years. And once they're voted on - they can be changed or gutted by elected officials. So believe it or not, I'm voting No to keep my vice status quo

See, I agree with you on almost all of this, but I'm still voting yes. While in my ideal world decriminalization is the way to go, I think the law as it is written now is better than the status quo. I just can't see a more in depth decriminalization option coming anytime soon and I think it will have a better effect on kids and in cities than the status quo currently.

 

[Edd]

My biggest concern is someone getting a record and having issues with attaining decent jobs as a result, when they have a joint on Friday evening, while the guy next to him gets absolutely plastered on beer, and can sit back and watch the police cuff the guy for a joint.

So you're concerned that it's currently illegal and you'd like to see it legalized?

 

[Jully]

My biggest concern is someone getting a record and having issues with attaining decent jobs as a result, when they have a joint on Friday evening, while the guy next to him gets absolutely plastered on beer, and can sit back and watch the police cuff the guy for a joint.

This 10,000%. I don't view it as any/much worse than alcohol, certainly not more dangerous to the degree that it should impact people's lives the way it does now. This is more an argument for decriminalization, but that's not the question on the ballot. If its legalized, at least we can now at least use and grow good old 100% american pot.

 

[dlague]

Well....here's my thoughts. First of all, let me say that I don't drink or smoke (I do ski, so there's that!)

I've said it many times, I've heard about drunken brawls, but never a stoner brawl. I really do not see pot as any worse than beer. And for people to get a record that impacts their ability to be employed..... While beer doesn't, unless you kill someone while driving. I find it interesting after all the public education and information about drinking and driving that the going rate for killing someone while driving under the influence is about 2 years in jail. But I digress....

Concerns are about enforcement of operating under the influence. Currently, there is no reasonable test for operating under the influence of pot. Right now, it's if there is any amount of pot influence, your done. At this point, until they can come up with a good metric to determine influence of pot, this will likely have to stay at zero being the threshold.

Washington and Colorado have seen a doubling of the deadly accident rate attributable to pot in the years since legalizing it. It is not missed by me that the numbers prior to legalization were ow to begin with, so a doubling of those numbers would not be hard to attain. But It is concerning that both states saw a doubling.

Beyond that, I say light em up where ever and how ever beer is legal, but I'd want a non smoking section, should I happen to be in attendance. For example, I wouldn't to be at the Seadogs game and have a guy with a joint next to me. I don't want to smoke his joint. I wouldn't mind if he had a beer, because he can drink without forcing me to drink.

Random thoughts....

Lots of the ski areas, apartment complexes, rental properties all object to smoking weed, there are others too. But you go into the woods to ski a glade and the smell seems to be everywhere. Rental properties threaten to kick you out but we still smell it where we live. So technically there seems to be some motivation to prevent it but it is never enforced.

The other issue, MJ is still an illegal substance everywhere when it comes to drug screenings for employment. Even if it is used on your own leisure time, it does not matter. Fail the drug test in Colorado you do not get the job. The reason, Federally it is still illegal.

 

[Edd]

Hopefully California votes to legalize next week, which would be a game changer.

 

[darent]

It is a slippery slope,watch what you wish for it could come back and bite you.most people will handle the legal pot ok, but what about all those who don't, what about the children watching their parents toke or the babies born with MJ in their system.I have spent my adult life working with children and have seen the damage drugs and alcohol has on families.

 

[Jully]

It is a slippery slope,watch what you wish for it could come back and bite you.most people will handle the legal pot ok, but what about all those who don't, what about the children watching their parents toke or the babies born with MJ in their system.I have spent my adult life working with children and have seen the damage drugs and alcohol has on families.

Sure, I totally get that but I would propose 2 things:

1) that just as with alcohol the vast majority of individuals who use marijuana use it safely and recreationally. The vast majority of those who would abuse it already do. I don't think more people are going to abuse MJ with it legal. If people are going to abuse a substance, they'll find a way through alcohol or drugs. It's not necessarily the substance (minus the hard and addictive drugs), but it's the disease of addiction.

2) the number of people who have their lives ruined by getting caught with an illegal substance for reasons like uphillklimber said vastly outnumber the family damage. Abuse is an extremely important issue and needs to be tackled with medical/psychiatric help. Leaving MJ illegal does very little in stopping and preventing abuse. Getting your future ruined as a kid, kicked out of college, or even jailed, doesn't happen when it's legal and can't be stopped with any form of counseling.

 

[dlague]

Sure, I totally get that but I would propose 2 things:

1) that just as with alcohol the vast majority of individuals who use marijuana use it safely and recreationally. The vast majority of those who would abuse it already do. I don't think more people are going to abuse MJ with it legal. If people are going to abuse a substance, they'll find a way through alcohol or drugs. It's not necessarily the substance (minus the hard and addictive drugs), but it's the disease of addiction.

2) the number of people who have their lives ruined by getting caught with an illegal substance for reasons like uphillklimber said vastly outnumber the family damage. Abuse is an extremely important issue and needs to be tackled with medical/psychiatric help. Leaving MJ illegal does very little in stopping and preventing abuse. Getting your future ruined as a kid, kicked out of college, or even jailed, doesn't happen when it's legal and can't be stopped with any form of counseling.

Hospitalizations involving patients with possible marijuana exposures and diagnoses increased from approximately 803 per 100,000 between 2001 and 2009 to 2,413 per 100,000 after marijuana was legalized and sold at retail stores, according to the report, which was unveiled Monday. Recreational marijuana was legalized for sale on Jan. 1, 2014, in Colorado.

Visits to emergency rooms also went up from an average of 739 per 100,000 patients between 2010 and 2013 to 956 per 100,000 after Jan. 1, 2014. A 2014 opinion co-written by Monte and other physicians at University of Colorado said their most pressing concern after marijuana legalization was in children who accidentally ingested marijuana through edible sources.

 

[Edd]

Hospitalizations involving patients with possible marijuana exposures and diagnoses increased from approximately 803 per 100,000 between 2001 and 2009 to 2,413 per 100,000 after marijuana was legalized and sold at retail stores, according to the report, which was unveiled Monday. Recreational marijuana was legalized for sale on Jan. 1, 2014, in Colorado.

Visits to emergency rooms also went up from an average of 739 per 100,000 patients between 2010 and 2013 to 956 per 100,000 after Jan. 1, 2014. A 2014 opinion co-written by Monte and other physicians at University of Colorado said their most pressing concern after marijuana legalization was in children who accidentally ingested marijuana through edible sources.

Compared to booze statistics, these numbers have got to be minuscule. I'd be much more concerned with children interacting with guns than weed.

 

[JimG.]

Visits to emergency rooms also went up from an average of 739 per 100,000 patients between 2010 and 2013 to 956 per 100,000 after Jan. 1, 2014. A 2014 opinion co-written by Monte and other physicians at University of Colorado said their most pressing concern after marijuana legalization was in children who accidentally ingested marijuana through edible sources.

Utter drivel. Nobody was even looking at or gathering this data in earnest until marijuana was legalized in CO. These conclusions are similar to saying last winter was the hottest in history based on data going back 10 years. Useless.

I respect doctors and healthcare in general, but some doctors and mostly drug companies are the poison peddlers who prescribe opiods. Take a look at the number of children who wind up in emergency rooms because they got into mommy and daddy's painkillers. That epidemic is far worse than anything marijuana will cause.

But opiods are legal and profitable so that's all good. You can be a raging opiod addict and you will never lose your job or be denied one because you are an addict; you will in fact be coddled and offered help to treat your "disease". But God help you if you smoke a joint and then get tested 2 weeks later.

I don't believe industries that police and do research on themselves ever produce unbiased and truthful results. Fact is, pot scares the crap out of a lot of powerful lobbies (tobacco, alcohol, drug companies to name just a few) and these entities will do everything they can to thwart legalization until they can figure out how to grab all the profit for themselves.

And THAT is their only concern I assure you.

 

[deadheadskier]

Maybe the solution regarding concerns with edibles is to make them legal only medicinally? I would think that would take care of some of the concerns with kids eating candy etc.

If you think about it, that makes the most sense if the goal is to translate laws of control to be similar to that of alcohol. It's not like you can go to the liquor store and buy Jim Beam Tootsie Rolls. I get that the primary difference would be that smoking a substance has greater health concerns than drinking a bottle of beer, but modern vaporizers mitigates a lot of the health risks of smoking.

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[Edd]

Maybe the solution regarding concerns with edibles is to make them legal only medicinally? I would think that would take care of some of the concerns with kids eating candy etc. Sent from my XT1565 using AlpineZone mobile app

I don't think the tourism market will tolerate that in Colorado at this stage. People love edibles, especially those that don't smoke weed habitually.

 

[Not Sure]

I don't think the tourism market will tolerate that in Colorado at this stage. People love edibles, especially those that don't smoke weed habitually.

Do the effects last longer? I was against it for a long time but after giving it some thought taking money away from the drug cartels seems like a win! Eventually it will be legal in all states but not until the politicians divvy up the monopolies.

 

[Edd]

I've been to CO twice since legalization, and have partaken of edibles multiple times while there. My experience has been that it doesn't last longer. If you're not used to it though, who knows? Same rules apply to alcohol. Know what you're getting into.

That said, I've read that the doses on edibles can be inconsistent, so that one brownie may be twice as strong as the other, but I don't know that this is true.

 

[deadheadskier]

Totally get what you're saying Edd. However, I'm just speaking from a point of consistency on controlled substances. If I'm Jim Beam, I'm looking at MJ edibles being legal and saying, "Why can't I produce bourbon Tootsie Rolls?" The FDA and other agencies would never allow alcohol businesses to produce products that are appealing to kids like the MJ industry is now doing in Colorado and elsewhere. Not a chance.

Much of the argument against legalization of recreational MJ is the fear of kids getting their hands on it more easily. If the hangup is edibles because of those fears, I'd be willing to make the concession that only the raw product (buds) are available for sale recreationally.

If you want edibles, buy the buds and make your own at home. Kind of like how people buy booze and make their own jello shots at home.

I'm just thinking of this from a high level (no pun intended). How do we get marijuana scheduled and regulated on the level with alcohol such that societal acceptance is the same for both substances. I just think there will always be a percentage of the population that will never except recreationally sold candy MJ just like they wouldn't accept liquor candy.





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[chuckstah]

Totally get what you're saying Edd. However, I'm just speaking from a point of consistency on controlled substances. If I'm Jim Beam, I'm looking at MJ edibles being legal and saying, "Why can't I produce bourbon Tootsie Rolls?" The FDA and other agencies would never allow alcohol businesses to produce products that are appealing to kids like the MJ industry is now doing in Colorado and elsewhere. Not a chance.

Much of the argument against legalization of recreational MJ is the fear of kids getting their hands on it more easily. If the hangup is edibles because of those fears, I'd be willing to make the concession that only the raw product (buds) are available for sale recreationally.

If you want edibles, buy the buds and make your own at home. Kind of like how people buy booze and make their own jello shots at home.

I'm just thinking of this from a high level (no pun intended). How do we get marijuana scheduled and regulated on the level with alcohol such that societal acceptance is the same for both substances. I just think there will always be a percentage of the population that will never except recreationally sold candy MJ just like they wouldn't accept liquor candy.





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Liquor candy already exists. Not sure what is available stateside but a friend recently brought some booze laced candy home from Italy, and it was strong. Here's a link to what is claimed to be liquor candy, but I have no experience with what they sell.
http://www.candywarehouse.com/flavors/liquor-candy/

 

[dlague]

Totally get what you're saying Edd. However, I'm just speaking from a point of consistency on controlled substances. If I'm Jim Beam, I'm looking at MJ edibles being legal and saying, "Why can't I produce bourbon Tootsie Rolls?" The FDA and other agencies would never allow alcohol businesses to produce products that are appealing to kids like the MJ industry is now doing in Colorado and elsewhere. Not a chance.

Much of the argument against legalization of recreational MJ is the fear of kids getting their hands on it more easily. If the hangup is edibles because of those fears, I'd be willing to make the concession that only the raw product (buds) are available for sale recreationally.

If you want edibles, buy the buds and make your own at home. Kind of like how people buy booze and make their own jello shots at home.

I'm just thinking of this from a high level (no pun intended). How do we get marijuana scheduled and regulated on the level with alcohol such that societal acceptance is the same for both substances. I just think there will always be a percentage of the population that will never except recreationally sold candy MJ just like they wouldn't accept liquor candy.





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Colorado is trying to deal with this issue by making the laced candies look different. Not sure if that will work. The numbers are low. In 2014 there were 14 cases. I say irresponsible parenting is reply the issue here.

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[JimG.]

The numbers are low. In 2014 there were 14 cases. I say irresponsible parenting is reply the issue here.

Bingo!

Then again, how many of us got their first taste of alcohol by raiding their parents' liquor cabinet? Or beer fridge?

 

[SkiFanE]

Hospitalizations involving patients with possible marijuana exposures and diagnoses increased from approximately 803 per 100,000 between 2001 and 2009 to 2,413 per 100,000 after marijuana was legalized and sold at retail stores, according to the report, which was unveiled Monday. Recreational marijuana was legalized for sale on Jan. 1, 2014, in Colorado.

Visits to emergency rooms also went up from an average of 739 per 100,000 patients between 2010 and 2013 to 956 per 100,000 after Jan. 1, 2014. A 2014 opinion co-written by Monte and other physicians at University of Colorado said their most pressing concern after marijuana legalization was in children who accidentally ingested marijuana through edible sources.

Just for real life FYI. I work in IT of safety net hospital. So whenever there are new programs/depts/concerns/zika's - we know about them and have to adjust systems to accommodate. Recent projects are setting up a transgender program, new department for opioid addicts, screening for zika's (Ebola before that), screening for cervical cancer, colon cancer, electronic prescription of opioids. But oddly, in my city hospital I have NEVER heard of screenings or concerns surrounding marijuana exposure. If it's a social epidemic - I'd know about it.