The most EPIC KILLINGTON = FAIL of all time?

[jerryg]

Really am curious how many seasons pass day trip people have made a move to OKemo, Mt snow and Sunday River.. Property owners are going to ski where their bed is. The rest have a choice.

I think the descion will have some impact.

I still think Mt snow and Sunday River have got some of the market. I have heard others mention Okemo. Length of Season does not seem to be a competition issue there. Maybe Parks.

K is a great mountain. That has not changed,

I have a hard time thinking that K loses skiers to SR unless those skiers are from MA. If they are from NY/NJ they are going to Snow or Okemo... or the Jersey Shore to party with Pauli D and The Situation.

I don't see Snow or Okemo as having longer seasons and they sure as heck don't have better terrain than K, so I don't see why people would leave to go either place.

 

[bobbutts]

Really am curious how many seasons pass day trip people have made a move to OKemo, Mt snow and Sunday River.. Property owners are going to ski where their bed is. The rest have a choice.

I think the descion will have some impact.

I still think Mt snow and Sunday River have got some of the market. I have heard others mention Okemo. Length of Season dos not seem to be a competition issue there. Maybe Parks.

K is a great mountain. That has not changed,

I was an ASC passholder way back in the days b4 moving out of the area. Since returning I've done Stratton, Okemo, Sunapee passes for 3 years and Boyne for 1 year. Without superior snowmaking and season length I'd rather stay closer to home at places with admittedly weaker terrain, and pay less. When the snow is good I buy (usually discounted) day tickets at places like Magic, Bush, Cannon, Ragged, even Whaleback. Once Killington is the closest operating area they get my day business. About 3 days per year for the last few seasons although a few of those went to the Bush the last 2 seasons before this one.

If things were more like they used to be wrt season length and snowmaking overall probably all 4 of those years would have been K passes.

 

[dmc]

If they are from NY/NJ they are going to Snow or Okemo...

We've had a few Killington expatriates join us at Hunter in the last couple years.. We did lose a bunch of folks to K too... But I see them more lately...

 

[Vortex]

I was an ASC passholder way back in the days b4 moving out of the area. Since returning I've done Stratton, Okemo, Sunapee passes for 3 years and Boyne for 1 year. Without superior snowmaking and season length I'd rather stay closer to home at places with admittedly weaker terrain, and pay less. When the snow is good I buy (usually discounted) day tickets at places like Magic, Bush, Cannon, Ragged, even Whaleback. Once Killington is the closest operating area they get my day business. About 3 days per year for the last few seasons although a few of those went to the Bush the last 2 seasons before this one.

If things were more like they used to be wrt season length and snowmaking overall probably all 4 of those years would have been K passes.

I bet there are quite a few like you.

Jerry the boston market... I think the River as of Late is getting more of the Boston market than it did prior, and probably the NY NJ and Ct look to Vermont in some fashion.

 

[Riverskier]

I have a hard time thinking that K loses skiers to SR unless those skiers are from MA. If they are from NY/NJ they are going to Snow or Okemo... or the Jersey Shore to party with Pauli D and The Situation.

I don't see Snow or Okemo as having longer seasons and they sure as heck don't have better terrain than K, so I don't see why people would leave to go either place.

I would agree that K would likely only lose skiers to SR from MA and not NY/NJ, for the most part anyway. However, the MA market is huge! That equals a lot of existing/potential customers to lose.

As to Snow or Okemo, sure the terrain isn't any better or season any longer, but they are closer to th NY/NJ market. Without having the Oct.-May season as a draw, perhaps they would choose a closer mountain. Or without the long season as a draw, perhaps they choose to drive a little further to even better terrain north of K.

It is anybody's guess just how much a shortened season will effect K's business levels, but the one thing I am sure of is that it will have some effect. I have no statistics, but it is clear that some people are buying Boyne passes at least in part for their committment to a long season.

 

[Vortex]

Never thought about the shorter distance factor to other resorts in Vermont. I thought more would go further north. Good points there Mr I just out of surgery,

 

[Riverskier]

Never thought about the shorter distance factor to other resorts in Vermont. I thought more would go further north. Good points there Mr I just out of surgery,

Plenty of time on my hands. Pass is purchased though, and partly because of season length!

 

[deadheadskier]

I don't see Snow or Okemo as having longer seasons and they sure as heck don't have better terrain than K, so I don't see why people would leave to go either place.

Can't speak for Mt. Snow, but Okemo has far better terrain for intermediates than Killington does. Both quality and quantity.

When I got my first season pass at Okemo in 1985, they were doing about 200K skier visits. Today they're over 600. I'm guessing a lot of those skiers were from Killington. I know we were Killington skiers before Okemo. We'd do Thanksgiving weekend and Christmas week at K and day trip to NH areas the rest of the season. My folks being intermediate skiers tried Okemo once and we never vacationed at Killington again and ended up getting a home in Ludlow.

 

[drjeff]

Can't speak for Mt. Snow, but Okemo has far better terrain for intermediates than Killington does. Both quality and quantity.
.

Mount Snow will give the "cruiser" market much of the same appeal as what Okemo can offer the "cruiser" market - a large pod of cruising terrain with some tougher stuff thrown in to boot. Plus, for the more and more likely to be park using "kids of cruiser" the park set up that Mount Snow can offer them is second to none on the East Coast - and happy kids/teens can easily play into a parent's descsion about where to go/possibly where to get a pass. And in now way am I trying to compare K and Mount Snow, as about the only thing they have in common is the customers slide down a snow covered mountain

 

[thetrailboss]

Really am curious how many seasons pass day trip people have made a move to OKemo, Mt snow and Sunday River.. Property owners are going to ski where their bed is. The rest have a choice.

I think the descion will have some impact.

I still think Mt snow and Sunday River have got some of the market. I have heard others mention Okemo. Length of Season does not seem to be a competition issue there. Maybe Parks.

K is a great mountain. That has not changed,

I was an ASC/KMart Passholder in College and in 2006-2007. When POWDR came in, I went to Sugarbush. Haven't left. Count me as a daytrip passholder that left.

To be frank, if things changed but I was in New England, the only other place I'd consider getting a pass to would be Sugarloaf/Sunday River. Good deal with the long season, excellent service and facilities, and diversity of terrain. I like Sugarbush a lot, but it is in my backyard. Stowe is nice, but it is way too expensive. The fact that my soon-to-be Mrs. has been a Sugarloafer since 1984 plays some role in it. Damn women :wink:

 

[Vortex]

There are different levels. Day skier who buy tickets, they will still go to K. There are day skier pass holders. The jury is out on what they are doing. Property owners tend to stay where they are.

House share folks have options, Families want a place that is well rounded with family activities kids programs and social life. Jury is out on that group. I think this is where Snow and K Okemo are making a move.

K is still the King for the Ny, CT and NJ market. The Metro Boston area I think is split up more than it use to be with maine and NH and southern VT. The recent actions and directions have effected that.

If I was just looking at turns in Vermont K the Bush and Mad River would be the places I would go. Terrain is the reason. Ride is shorter or the same than a trip to Maine,

 

[roark]

Really am curious how many seasons pass day trip people have made a move to OKemo, Mt snow and Sunday River.. Property owners are going to ski where their bed is. The rest have a choice.

This will be year #2 w/o a K pass for me.

 

[Bubbartzky]

Just catching up on my reading and came upon this thread. Here's a tidbit from a meeting I had recently that included one of the senior management types here in Killington. He acknowledged that Killington had alienated a lot of skiers, with those skiers heading toward other mountains in Vermont and elsewhere, and he also acknowledged that it's costing them a lot of money to try to bring them back. Basically, they know they f*cked up and they know they're paying for it. I'm not sure, however, they yet realize how much they hurt themselves with the earlier than planned closing, especially the way it was handled - one day promoting May 2nd, the next announcing a closing a week earlier.

 

[Highway Star]

Bump. Just a reminder of what happened at Killington this past spring. Fail.

Fast forward to this fall:

Spending $90,000 on a walkway, get roughly 1.5ft snow (enough to open), put ~$50,000+ of snowmaking on top of it (again, enough to open), getting beat to the opening by Sunday River, then not opening, having all the snow melt, and not opening for at least 2 weeks.

Now seriously, who is making the operational decisions here....????

That's pretty epic to me.

 

[gmcunni]

Bump. Just a reminder of what happened at Killington this past spring.

thanks, i completely forgot about that.

 

[thorski]

Bump. Just a reminder of what happened at Killington this past spring. Fail.

Fast forward to this fall:

Spending $90,000 on a walkway, get roughly 1.5ft snow (enough to open), put ~$50,000+ of snowmaking on top of it (again, enough to open), getting beat to the opening by Sunday River, then not opening, having all the snow melt, and not opening for at least 2 weeks.

Now seriously, who is making the operational decisions here....????

That's pretty epic to me.

They spent $90,000 on that walkway??? That must be one epic walkway, seriously.
If they spent $90,000 on it, it better be skiable.

 

[AdironRider]

You Killington guys are high if you think any major ski area is opening with just 18" on bare ground unpacked.

Im sure it was awesome for the 15-20 people who booted up, but an entire opening weekend crowd, puhlease.

 

[Highway Star]

There were roughly 100+ people there hiking. They could have let people up the gondi (which was running, 3 cabins) ski at your own risk, etc, and called it an opening. Pretty much what went down Oct. '05..............

 

[AdironRider]

100+. Ok, if you say so. Thats more aggro than the Jackson Hole crowd, and we just got 4 feet. Maybe over the course of the weekend, but I doubt it was like Tux in April up there either.

But 100 people taking 1-2 runs is not several hundred making 10+.

No ski area that takes on liability is going to just spin em up for 18" fresh on bare ground. No way, no how. Hate to break it to you.

 

[JimG.]

You Killington guys are high if you think any major ski area is opening with just 18" on bare ground unpacked.

Im sure it was awesome for the 15-20 people who booted up, but an entire opening weekend crowd, puhlease.

Wow, a voice of reason.