The Over $300 lift ticket has arrived. FU#K OFF at those prices.

[raisingarizona]

You must mean climate alarmists.

I'm genuinely fascinated by people who believe as you do though, ironically mentioning "science" coinciding with your view, which completely ignores the actual science.

It’s not my view. The most agreed upon scientific data is something that industry professionals are taking into account whether you like that or not. I can easily say the same exact thing to you but you’ll never quote me saying anything as biased as you just did.

The immediate emotional and defensive response gives you away. It’s just like if I were to say anything negative about Trump in front of some of his following they immediately assume I identify as a democrat when the reality couldn’t be any more farther from that.

Jumping to conclusions like that based on an unbiased statement really dumbs down the conversation.

 

[raisingarizona]

Wasn't it like 2 years ago that there were record snows (mostly out west) and the season went deep into the summer?

Derp.

 

[deadheadskier]

You must mean climate alarmists.

I'm genuinely fascinated by people who believe as you do though, ironically mentioning "science" coinciding with your view, which completely ignores the actual science.

What is the "science" that has the average winter daily high temp in BTV, 7 degrees higher today than 50 years ago?

Do I expect to still be skiing in New England 30 years from now? Yes. But if we see another 7 degree rise over the next 50 years, do I expect my grandchildren to be skiing in New England? Only in the three Northern New England states at higher elevation places.

 

[raisingarizona]

Do I expect to still be skiing in New England 30 years from now? Yes. But if we see another 7 degree rise over the next 50 years, do I expect my grandchildren to be skiing in New England? Only in the three Northern New England states at higher elevation places.

If the science is correct most of us won’t be able to afford skiing in 30 years.

It’s not that there won’t be any snow during brief periods at the most ideal locations it’s that there just won’t be enough to go around making that experience extremely rare and ridiculously expensive. Only the mega wealthy or what is often referred to as the 1% will be able to afford it.

This is why I have my theory that the big mega ski conglomerates don’t give a damn about developing new skiers and snowboarders. They’ve got plenty and are already looking at the more privatized luxury ski experience of the future.

 

[KustyTheKlown]

Derp.

Unbelievable levels of derp on that one

 

[raisingarizona]

Unbelievable levels of derp on that one

I won’t even touch it beyond that.

My take, humans are wrong all the time, god knows I am but I’m not going to call the most agreed upon current science a bunch of bs. That’s obviously denial and manipulating the narrative into something that that person finds more comfortable. Now, can that science be completely wrong? Of course that’s possible and let’s hope so but for now, it’s what the majority of scientists (people that for the most part much more educated than I am) agree on and that’s something that people in a business that depends on weather, cold weather to be more specific are going to be paying attention to.

 

[4aprice]

Derp.

I'm only making an observation, not a POV. Winter Park was only closed for a 165 days from closing last May to opening in November. That's almost 2/3 of the year open for skiing. No matter what people think or say. seems to me the ski seasons have actually been longer the last few years. Man made snow, sure but the opening to closing dates and snow fall totals are fact not scientific theory.

 

[snoseek]

I'm only making an observation, not a POV. Winter Park was only closed for a 165 days from closing last May to opening in November. That's almost 2/3 of the year. No matter what people think or say. seems to me the ski seasons have actually been longer the last few years. Man made snow, sure but the opening to closing dates and snow fall totals are fact not scientific theory.

And then the pendulum always swings the other way. It can get lean out there, I've lived some pretty bony years as well as some deep ones. Back east its been below average since I came back but hopefully that changes this year.

 

[4aprice]

And then the pendulum always swings the other way. It can get lean out there, I've lived some pretty bony years as well as some deep ones. Back east its been below average since I came back but hopefully that changes this year.

Exactly. In my almost 60 years now of skiing that's what I have seen as well. Saw it snowy in the late 60's, a series of bad winters in the early/mid 70's (a lot of smaller operations closed in these years) to a series of good winters in the late 70's , up, down ,up down always variable. We are lucky that technology has improved so much that they can provide us with entertainment even when Old man winter takes a break.

 

[raisingarizona]

I'm only making an observation, not a POV. Winter Park was only closed for a 165 days from closing last May to opening in November. That's almost 2/3 of the year open for skiing. No matter what people think or say. seems to me the ski seasons have actually been longer the last few years. Man made snow, sure but the opening to closing dates and snow fall totals are fact not scientific theory.

Ahh, fair enough. The “what about the snow on the ground” statement arguing against climate change is super derp though and that was how I read it. I apologize.

We are having a drought season so far here in the SW, it’s the first one though since the winter of 17/18. Looking back at the last ten years I’d say we’ve had some seriously big years more so than dry ones but it does make sense since warm air driven off the pacific holds more moisture. Winter of 18/19 was huge and the San Juan’s saw an unusually deep and stable winter, something I imagine will happen more often with a warming world. Truthfully though, our personal data set of 30 or 40 years isn’t really anything.

 

[SkiingInABlueDream]

If global warming is not actually occurring (cause is a separate point, I'm just taking about whether or not it's occurring) then what's causing the disappearance of glaciers and the polar ice caps breaking up? The melting point of water changed??

 

[raisingarizona]

If global warming is not actually occurring (cause is a separate point, I'm just taking about whether or not it's occurring) then what's causing the disappearance of glaciers and the polar ice caps breaking up? The melting point of water changed??

A natural warming period not related to human caused climate change is what most disbelievers argue. It’s not like it hasn’t happened before.

 

[SkiingInABlueDream]

A natural warming period not related to human caused climate change is what most disbelievers argue. It’s not like it hasn’t happened before.

yes, but that acknowledges that climate change is actually occurring. my point was there are people who argue that climate change is not actually occurring. Which is like, flat earth level stupidity.

 

[jimk]

I have a buddy that I skied with from the late 1970s until the late 1990s. He gave up the sport about 25 years ago. Great guy, still see him for other activities. He often asks, "what's the price of a lift ticket now?" And he will propose, "$200, 300 per day?"
I laugh, but tell him, "yeah, but for the price of about four days I can ski all winter long at 30 of those great ski areas in North America that we used to dream about back in the day."
You guys have heard this before from me. I've been skiing almost 60 years. I'm of the mind that - now is the good old days. I'm glad to still be alive
I'm enjoying my mega-pass. I still get to ski with family and I have lots of geezer ski buddies.
It wasn't so long ago that many of us worried that the ski business was going to die before we would, but now many ski areas are booming. And though I lament the gradual loss of mom and pop mountains, the big and well managed places are so busy I have to use all my savvy to find parking and less crowded terrain.

 

[deadheadskier]

I'm only making an observation, not a POV. Winter Park was only closed for a 165 days from closing last May to opening in November. That's almost 2/3 of the year open for skiing. No matter what people think or say. seems to me the ski seasons have actually been longer the last few years. Man made snow, sure but the opening to closing dates and snow fall totals are fact not scientific theory.

I won't opine on season length in the West as I don't ski out there enough to pay attention. But to suggest that season length in the East is as long as it was 30 years ago is categorically false. Skiing was practically a guarantee at Killington in October for years. It barely happens anymore. I mentioned the temp in BTV. Here in NH, Ice Out on Winni is 9 days sooner these days than historical averages. Ice In much later in the winter. 6 out of the 10 earliest ice outs dating back to the 1800s have occured in the past 20 years. The Northeast has experienced the greatest degree of warm up in the country. It's due to rising water temps in the Gulf of Maine as I understand it.

 

[jimk]

Because of snowmaking improvements the ski season in my area of the mid-Atlantic is at least as long and probably better quality than 50 years ago. Truth is, we always had bad/inconsistent winter weather here and modern snowmaking makes the snow conditions more durable. I can appreciate how New England skiers could see a more notable switch from the long cold winters of their past to more mid-Atlantic type weather/temperature inconsistencies.
Utah is kind of a funny animal. It may be snowier there than ever, but maybe not quite as dry/blower as decades ago?

 

[BenedictGomez]

Wasn't it like 2 years ago that there were record snows (mostly out west) and the season went deep into the summer?

The last 2 years I was having snowball fights on July 4th. Making it a family tradition, though it might not happen in 2025 unless it starts to snow soon.

 

[BenedictGomez]

What is the "science" that has the average winter daily high temp in BTV, 7 degrees higher today than 50 years ago?

Well, the "science" is that what you're saying isn't true, so.......

In fact, I recall for the entire year the AVG annual temps in BTV only increased by about 1.5 degrees or so over roughly 50 years the last time this conversation came up a few years back, and it was something like an increase of 3 degrees for the winter in like 110 years or something like that.

 

[BenedictGomez]

It’s not my view. The most agreed upon scientific data is something that industry professionals are taking into account whether you like that or not.

Well, we agree that it's not your view. It's the "view" of the politicians who are lying to you & pushing an agenda, and of the activists who are lying to you & collecting fat paychecks. Of course, "view" is probably a strong word since they don't really believe it, they just use that propaganda for their aims.

And no, the "scientific data" doesn't suggest what you're saying about no skiing soon either, nor do the most passionate scientists who genuinely believe Global Warming is real, is 100% human caused, and is a terrible threat. None of them will tell you that "today's generation" of children wont be skiing as adults as you claimed. It's a ridiculous thing to believe. Even if the "science" is 100% correct, the change in Celsius over time is extremely small in terms of a human lifetime, or even a few human lifetimes. We're talking a mere handful of degrees by the year 2100. And ironically the "science" is accompanied by the belief that while man-made Global Warming may lead to these slighty increased temperatures, it will likely also lead to an increase in powerful winter storms. As a general FYI, "powerful winter storms" means......... checks notes....... SNOW.

TLDR: If you're going to "believe" something, it behooves you to understand what you believe. I'm sorry to sound harsh, but this is intellectual laziness.