Vote for Utah ski bus

[ss20]

I am not talking up on the hill to prevent. I am talking about at the tracks. They use them all the time in Europe. They make a small shelter over the tracks so the snow passes over. Your Gondi would be out on wind days. Even days with no snow. The wind can whip up that canyon on clear days as well as storm days.

Wind would be a non-issue. The 3S gondola proposed has 3 cables for a ton of stability.

Quick wiki search landed me on the Whistler Blackomb Peak-to-Peak 3s gondola...

The Peak 2 Peak Gondola has a number of unique safety systems beyond what a normal ski lift features. The gondola has high wind stability and is designed to operate in winds up to 80 km/h. Whistler-Blackcomb has called the Peak 2 Peak Gondola the most wind tolerant lift on Whistler Blackcomb. Testing at other Doppelmayr 3S installations have measured sustained winds at 120 km/h (75 mph) with no decrease in performance.

 

[thetrailboss]

Wind would be a non-issue. The 3S gondola proposed has 3 cables for a ton of stability.

Quick wiki search landed me on the Whistler Blackomb Peak-to-Peak 3s gondola...

Right. A 3S is not your average gondola and is built to handle higher wind gusts.

 

[FBGM]

Hey don't mess with that beautiful golf course
View attachment 26982

There is a giant gravel pit and eyesore that is even closer to the mouth of BCC. Build your transit village there. It's to the right in this photo. Old Mill GC is beyond it out of sight on the other side of Wasatch BLVD.
View attachment 26984

That gravel pit is not going anywhere. Where do you think all the material is coming from to do whatever this gondola road tunnel idea happens. That pit for Morgan and Granite is worth more then you could imagine and still had lots of life left in it.

Old Mill used to be the same type of pit. Now reclaimed into golf course. They should just keep the back 9 and make the front 9 parking cuz that’s all that front 9 is good for.

 

[jimk]

New governor of Utah is interested in a gondola for Little Cottonwood Canyon and has earmarked $50 million for dealing with transportation issues in the canyons: https://www.deseret.com/utah/2021/1...canyon-little-cottonwood-canyon-alta-snowbird

Article excerpt: So far, the work to improve the path to Snowbird and Alta’s world-class skiing in Little Cottonwood Canyon and overall access to the Wasatch mountains is focused on the following alternatives, many with big price tags.

• Enhanced bus service with no road widening (with 24 buses at six buses per hour to each resort) would cost $334 million to put into place and $10.3 million in annual winter operation costs, according to according to UDOT’s environmental impact study. Widening the road as well would bring the upfront costs to $481 million.
• A 30-gondola base station at the mouth of Little Cottonwood Canyon with bus service from two hubs would cost an estimated $576 million plus about $8.3 million to operate, UDOT estimated. A gondola with a base station built east of the La Caille restaurant at 9565 S. Wasatch Blvd, which would also have 30 cars, would cost an estimated $576 million to build and $6.9 million to operate.
• A cog rail with four train cars — with a station also based near the La Caille restaurant — would cost an estimated $1.05 billion and $6.3 million to operate, according to UDOT estimates.

 

[jimmywilson69]

there is no doubt from what I have read, I unfortunately have never been to Utah, something needs to be done. I've said it in the past, that the 1 Wasatch thing was an incredibly novel idea and would provide "European" style connection. I get that these things are incredibly expensive and many probably deem them government boondoggles, but having massive traffic jams seems pretty terrible for locals and visitors a like. if you have to, add some sort of "use fee" to pin some of the burden on visitors.

 

[kingslug]

Or they will wait for a real nasty life taking accident..then do something. I've been traveling up that road for 20 years ( not as much anymore though), and it can be downright scary.

 

[thetrailboss]

Or they will wait for a real nasty life taking accident..then do something. I've been traveling up that road for 20 years ( not as much anymore though), and it can be downright scary.

There have already been some deaths due to a number of reasons. Population growth and IKON has led to major traffic issues. It snowed 4 inches on Monday and it took me 90 minutes to go six miles down the road--mainly because of a couple cars that lacked snow tires and either went off the road or inched down the road holding up traffic.

 

[kingslug]

Almost every time I was there during a storm the road avalanched..once took out a bus. Took me 6 hours to finally get out of there once..rode in the back of a pickup to the bottom to get a bus back. Fun. But what a ski day. They are supposed to check for snow tires but I havent seen much of that. Rental cars and SUV's are the worst. 2 wheel drive SUV's with all season tires..yup that works.

 

[raisingarizona]

There sure have been a few arrogant posts in this thread. That one guy is exceptionally annoying. I feel bad for that poster and his poor self esteem. I’ll leave it at that.

I’m a fan of ONE and creating as many alternatives and options as possible. The crowds aren’t going away and it’s only going to get worse so the people that are scared of change are gonna have to toughen up a bit.

The anti one crowd cracks me up. This sort of connection between different operations is standard in Europe and has been working longer than a lot of us have been alive. And no, you don’t have to traverse and ride lifts all day to get somewhere to lap a lift for 3 hours of quality skiing. I’m gonna be blunt here, you sound really dumb and lack imagination. The options would be endless and besides, traverses and tours have been a part of skiing culture since the birth of alpinism. A lot of people love that. Get a grip, the only “Jerry” on this site is the one posting arrogant posts calling people Jerry’s.

 

[kingslug]

Change is hard for some..they want everything to be the same. Since i don't live there I can't really chime in as I only go there twice a year. But...interconnecting areas would be very cool. Its one of the great things about Europe. Endless possibilities. The insane crowds and traffic jams have to be addressed at some time. Now would be good. Hell, they build a new airport to handle all this..Where do they think a lot of these people end up..skiing.

 

[jimmywilson69]

Hell, they build a new airport to handle all this..Where do they think a lot of these people end up..skiing.

Exactly It has to be looked at as a "transportation solution" not a "ski lift"

 

[kingslug]

With so many people moving there, the new will outweigh the old soon enough. The place has changed dramatically since I started going there. It BOOMED.
Strip malls everywhere..actual traffic. I'll admit that I liked it back then better. It was an escape from NY for me. My friends who live there feel the same. One just sold everything and moved into a motorhome to travel all over.

 

[thetrailboss]

With so many people moving there, the new will outweigh the old soon enough. The place has changed dramatically since I started going there. It BOOMED.
Strip malls everywhere..actual traffic. I'll admit that I liked it back then better. It was an escape from NY for me. My friends who live there feel the same. One just sold everything and moved into a motorhome to travel all over.

Agreed. We've been here almost ten years. The changes in the last 3-4 years have been insane. There is a lot of growth...and not much planning. Apparently planning is an act of Satan for some folks. Add IKON to the mix and it is really bad.

We are actually supposed to get snow tonight and tomorrow. I am not planning on skiing at those times because the traffic will be ridiculous.

 

[jimk]

TrailBoss, you've probably posted this elsewhere on the site, but how are the lift lines at Alta and Snowbird this season? Have you been happy with how they are dealing with crowds under Covid rules? Any problems getting parking reservations for Snowbird? I'm hoping to make my seasonal migration out there in a couple weeks. Bring on that snow!

 

[JimG.]

We are actually supposed to get snow tonight and tomorrow. I am not planning on skiing at those times because the traffic will be ridiculous.

This statement is truly sad.

While I may sometimes envy the conditions in Utah, I don't envy the locals who have to deal with this. I could not imagine writing off a day of skiing in fresh snow because of crowds.

Hard to believe but I feel a bit sorry for you TB.

 

[bizarrefaith]

Rental cars and SUV's are the worst. 2 wheel drive SUV's with all season tires..yup that works.

I don't think any of the rental car places even offer the option of getting something effective snow tires - the best you can get is M+S which may (or may not) meet the minimum legal requirements but are definitely not good enough. I don't understand why in areas with traction laws rental car companies are allowed to rent cars in winter without at least offering renters the option of getting tires that meet the traction requirements/needs of the area.

 

[kingslug]

Found that out the hard way at A Basin..friend had an SUV that we ended up pushing up the hill out of the lot..with 5 other people.
As far as not skiing. I would go to PC/Canyons if they are getting snow. At least everything is spread out and no crazy road to get up. Its been working for us for a few years.

 

[thetrailboss]

I don't think any of the rental car places even offer the option of getting something effective snow tires - the best you can get is M+S which may (or may not) meet the minimum legal requirements but are definitely not good enough. I don't understand why in areas with traction laws rental car companies are allowed to rent cars in winter without at least offering renters the option of getting tires that meet the traction requirements/needs of the area.

People either don't know that or don't care. As someone said, enforcement is spotty at best. If someone goes off the road then they get a ticket. I would think (and hope) that the airport rental agencies would have something for the conditions because a fair number of folks fly here in a normal year to ski in the Canyons. The road to Park City can be interesting.

 

[thetrailboss]

TrailBoss, you've probably posted this elsewhere on the site, but how are the lift lines at Alta and Snowbird this season? Have you been happy with how they are dealing with crowds under Covid rules? Any problems getting parking reservations for Snowbird? I'm hoping to make my seasonal migration out there in a couple weeks. Bring on that snow!

Alta has been busy. Lines are longer because of spacing and because the terrain has been limited. So folks are taking quicker runs.

Snowbird has been a disaster in terms of parking. Like Solitude, they announced the parking system AFTER folks bought passes. I talked to one passholder who said he made reservations using his name, his wife's name, and his dog's name. Others did the same. As a result, one can't get parking on weekend or holiday periods and could not since November 30th. They did not sell paid parking spots this season. A lot of passholders turned in their passes in December to get a credit for next season. Crowds have been not bad as a result at Snowbird, but having no lines at all at Gadzoom on MLK Day is not good at all for business I would imagine. This season would have been break-even at best with COVID. Without snow and with this stupid parking system, John Cumming has made sure that he goes down in flames this season. Honestly, if passholders had a way to guarantee parking (or get preference) then I think most would deal with it. But Cumming can't be a pig and has to be a hog by trying to get $$$ from passholders AND IKON. I feel bad for the employees who have to deal with angry passholders.

As for me: my pass included an IKON base pass. I've done 20 days this season--9 at Brighton (night pass), 1 at Deer Valley (IKON), 3 at Discovery, and the rest (7) at Alta and Snowbird. Usually by now I would be at about 5-10 days at Snowbird alone. I think I've done 4 days at Snowbird. That said, I DO have parking at Snowbird for the next four or five Sundays and I've found that one can get parking the day-of or the night before.

Honestly, IKON should not be in LCC. We have too much demand without it. But as I said, they want to be hogs. While pigs get fat, hogs get slaughtered as they say.

 

[thetrailboss]

This statement is truly sad.

While I may sometimes envy the conditions in Utah, I don't envy the locals who have to deal with this. I could not imagine writing off a day of skiing in fresh snow because of crowds.

Hard to believe but I feel a bit sorry for you TB.

I do get my days here and there. Between a crazy work week and what I imagine will be crazy traffic, I am too tired and unmotivated to go tonight. As I said in another post, it took me 90 minutes Monday night to drive from Snowbird to the mouth of the Canyon, or six miles. We got four, yes (4), inches of snow and it brought traffic to a standstill largely because folks did not have snowtires and slid off the road or creeped down holding up the traffic heading home.

A lot of old timers are really angry and have taken to the backcountry, which is also getting busy. I just have reset my expectations.

Here is a post about Monday night's disaster: https://wasatchweatherweenies.blogspot.com/2021/01/yesterdays-snowmaggedon.html