Jay Peak Thread (New owners, New Future)

[MidnightJester]

The stations are already there. This is very new technology which wasn't available to the public just a year ago.

Over time the cost will come down on the Technology that when the weather station is replaced or upgraded they will include that snow module.

 

[BenedictGomez]

Over time the cost will come down on the Technology that when the weather station is replaced or upgraded they will include that snow module.

Agreed. Not sure why almost all of the new installs are in the west, but I doubt it's drinking water. Probably just the fact it snows much more there. I'd even accept "avalanches" as a more likely answer.

 

[jimmywilson69]

I tend to think it is for water equivalent modeling but it just might be newer tech that has become affordable too

 

[AdironRider]

The stations are already there. This is very new technology which wasn't available to the public just a year ago.

You are wrong. These stations have existed across the mountain west for decades. Maybe the one at the Canyons is new.

For example, Jackson has had 6-7 just within the resort boundary since at least 2006, in most locations longer (summit mid and base since 1975). You can literally look up the snow depth for every day of the winter season dating back to 1975 here: https://jhavalanche.org/historicalData.php or get real time data here: https://bridgertetonavalanchecenter.org/weather-stations/#/station-table

Water rights make the West go round, and they have been measuring snowpack and the associated water content for the better part of 100 years. You best believe the public that relies on said water, and depend on said water rights, were very interested in that data. The method of measurement might have changed over that 100 years, but that data has existed publicly for much longer than you claim. They used to broadcast it via am radio along with the beef and soybean prices back in the day.

That just isn't going to happen on the East Coast because water isn't a problem here (if anything the opposite is true, where we often have way to much rain to handle). They don't need to monitor the snowpack to nearly the same extent because generally, there is plenty of water to go around most of the year.

Now I will say that Jackson conveniently takes the highest snowfall on a given day and posts it to their report. Aka the Raymer plot above the gondola summit gets 13 and the Rendesvous plot (which is significantly higher in elevation but more exposed) only gets 10, guess what number they report. So they can still fudge the numbers to their hearts content.

 

[BenedictGomez]

You are wrong. These stations have existed across the mountain west for decades. Maybe the one at the Canyons is new.

No, you are wrong, because you don't have any idea what the conversation is about.

Obviously "stations" have existed for "decades", and all over America, but they have not had instantaneous snow monitoring & data capturing using ultrasonic pulse transmission until very recently, and most still do not, even in the "mountain west".

 

[kingslug]

And in other news...
Tim Kelley is predicting measurable snow into saturday...
He thinks up to 10 inches...
We shall see...

 

[Tin Woodsman]

Agreed. Not sure why almost all of the new installs are in the west, but I doubt it's drinking water. Probably just the fact it snows much more there. I'd even accept "avalanches" as a more likely answer.

You are 100% incorrect. It is entirely about measuring Snow Water Equivalent (SWE) that most cities and ag regions out West desperately rely on. The certainty with which you approach highly nuanced issues that you don't know much about is...a choice.

 

[MidnightJester]

How a Vermont Ski Area Roared Back From a Financial Scandal. Less than a decade ago, the biggest fraud in ski industry history nearly took down a beloved ski area. But Jay Peak, long known for its powder, has since transformed into a sparkling modern resort.​

How a Vermont Ski Area Roared Back From a Financial Scandal

Less than a decade ago, the biggest fraud in ski industry history nearly took down a beloved ski area. But Jay Peak, long known for its powder, has since transformed into a sparkling modern resort.

www.nytimes.com

After the fraud​

Then the pandemic shut everything down. The Canadian border closed for nonessential travel for 19 months. For the entire winter of 2020-2021, Jay Peak was inaccessible to half of its clientele and subject to strict health restrictions by the state of Vermont. Annual skier visits plunged to 75,000 from some 300,000.
In a curious twist, weathering the EB-5 scandal prepared the resort for surviving the pandemic. “We can probably get through this,” Mr. Wright recalled thinking during the height of the pandemic. “A lot of it was with the resiliency that we built up through surviving the receivership.”
Jay Peak has set records in revenue and lift ticket sales annually since 2006, said Mr. Wright, who would not reveal exact sales figures. One reason is the many non-skiing options available to visitors, evident in the bustling water park I saw when I visited on a brisk January day. Another is Jay Peak’s tree skiing. Nearly a third of its 385 skiable acres are glades and the mountain has a throwback feel, offering skiers a mix of narrow natural snow trails and broad boulevards. Skiing Jay Peak feels like a safari, where skiers freely roam the snowy landscape, in contrast to the domesticated feel of other resorts.
Image

“I don’t think the Jay vibe has changed at all. If anything, it’s gotten better,” said one lifelong Jay Peak skier of the scandal’s impact.Credit...Caleb Kenna for The New York Times

Jay Peak’s new owners are not planning major changes. “We are very cognizant of the loyal clientele and the unique vibe that it has,” said Mark Fischer of Pacific Group Resorts. “We don’t want to change that culture.”
Chris Young, the principal of the nearby North Country High School, is a lifelong Jay Peak skier.
“I don’t think the Jay vibe has changed at all. If anything, it’s gotten better,” he said.
But wounds from the scandal are still visible in the surrounding area. Burke Mountain Resort, where Mr. Quiros and Mr. Stenger built a hotel, is still under federal receivership (Mr. Goldberg expects the ski area to be sold this year). In Newport, a gaping weed-filled hole sits in the center of downtown. An entire block was razed in 2015 to make way for what Mr. Stenger and Mr. Quiros promised would be a multimillion dollar hotel and conference center. The hole is like a scarlet letter from a cheating paramour. The parcel is awaiting sale by the federal receiver.
The outcome for the foreign investors has been decidedly mixed. Eighty percent of Jay Peak’s EB-5 investors have received green cards, Mr. Goldberg said, but none of the 121 investors in Burke have received one. Getting green cards for investors is one of his remaining priorities, he said. Many investors have lost money.
Is it ironic that one fruit of the fraud is that Jay Peak is a thriving modern resort?
“Having a fraud and having a beautiful end product are not inconsistent,” Mr. Goldberg quipped.
Image

Nearly a third of Jay Peak’s 385 skiable acres are glades and the mountain has a throwback feel, offering skiers a mix of narrow natural snow trails and broad boulevards. Credit...Caleb Kenna for The New York Times

 

[MidnightJester]

Jay Peak, VT, Report: Pushing Myself Over the Edge on the Face Chute​

by: Liam Abbott

• Date Opened: 1957
• Multi-Destination Pass: Indy Pass
• Number of Trails: 81
• Skiable Acres: 385
• Vertical Drop: 2153′
• Base Elevation: 1815′
• Summit Elevation: 3968′
• Average Annual Snowfall: 359″ (most on the East Coast)
• Terrain Breakdown:
  • Beginner: 20%
  • Intermediate: 40%
  • Advanced: 40%
• Number of Lifts: 9
• Night Skiing: no
• Other Activities:
  • one of the largest indoor water parks in North America
  • cross-country skiing & snowshoeing
  • ski biking
  • rock climbing gym
  • hockey rink
  • spa
  • movie theatre

After dabbling with a few different types of gladed runs and finding that they were manageable if taken slow and steady, I set my eyes on the Face Chutes over the top of the tram. There was no harm in at least looking up there, right? I felt that added pressure of doing this because I was skiing with a friend who had never been to Jay when the tram was opened and had continuously hyped up how insane the runs off the top were, so up the tram we went.
Before today, I had only skied the face chutes a couple of times, and it was only on one day back in 2018 when Jay Peak had the best and earliest opening on record.

Jay Peak, VT, Report: Pushing Myself Over the Edge on the Face Chute - SnowBrains

Report from Sunday, February 25th, 2024 Out of all of the East Coast resorts, Jay Peak is the one where I end up most. It’s diverse and challenging terrain, from steep groomers off the Jet Triple to tight glades like Timbuktu and Beaver Pond to its extreme Face Chutes directly under the tram...

snowbrains.com

 

[kingslug]

Do that shit when your young!

 

[TyWebb]

Question(s) for you guys

Suppose to head up to Jay this weekend with my son for his spring break, never been. They are suppose to receive a little rain (.40 inch approx) on Wed and we plan to ski sat and Sun tho I may push it back one day depending on other mountains we are going to hit and their conditions. I know abt the Jay cloud and snow can fall but who knows. I'm not big on knowing all the minutia of weather, how snow holds up, etc. Considering that they are known for their natural un-groomed terrain what should I expect?

When he's with me we ski mostly Blues and single diamonds unless he goes for a few runs w/out me where he bumps it up or heads to a park but won't ski those trees w/out someone so we will be mostly their Blue glades - I ski some trees but not crazy trees that I know can't handle.

How is the maintenance on the mountain, groomed decently, etc

Still solid tree skiing on their Blue glade runs if no snow?

Here is todays forecast for the week - Thanks in advance

 

[LONGBOARDR]

There is a ton of snow up here, all trails open and skiing well. They groomed some of the natural snow trails to even out all the powder. Ungroomed trails and steeper glades are bumping up and were fun yesterday. Low angle (beginner) glades like Moonwalk and Bushwacker have great coverage and will be fun for the kiddo. Not expecting much rain wed and temps look relatively stable and supporting springlike conditions into the weekend.
Hope this helps, have fun.

 

[TyWebb]

There is a ton of snow up here, all trails open and skiing well. They groomed some of the natural snow trails to even out all the powder. Ungroomed trails and steeper glades are bumping up and were fun yesterday. Low angle (beginner) glades like Moonwalk and Bushwacker have great coverage and will be fun for the kiddo. Not expecting much rain wed and temps look relatively stable and supporting springlike conditions into the weekend.
Hope this helps, have fun.

Thank you - much appreciated

Doing a 5 day trip with 4 skiing days and one day checking out a few colleges for my son. Going back and forth btwn Jay or Saddleback to start but leaning Jay as Saddle adds 2+ hours from the Philly burbs. Girlfriend decided to tag along for two days with her 2 daughters if we stay in Burlington instead of Maine so that is also part of the decision and a hard lean towards Jay (1st time for all of us).

Started doing some recon for the green glades for them to get experience and blue & 'easier' blacks glades for me and son - so far I've got

Blue - Bushwacker and moonwalk which u mentioned assuming all the moons, right? - I also see Doe woods and Kokomo - am I missing any?

Easier black glades - Buck woods and off Beaver Pond for son and if I think I'm up for it and can bail to Ullr's if too tough- if snow is still good am I right here ie easier blacks and any others?

Green - do they have any for the girls or just head to the Blues with them

Thanks in advance

 

[MidnightJester]

Here is a taste of what you can enjoy. Mostly higher terrain pictures. This was Friday before the biggget storm but after a week of new snow and they had wind closed lifts the Thursday before

 

[LONGBOARDR]

Started doing some recon for the green glades for them to get experience and blue & 'easier' blacks glades for me and son - so far I've got

Blue - Bushwacker and moonwalk which u mentioned assuming all the moons, right? YES- I also see Doe woods and Kokomo - Yes am I missing any?

Easier black glades - Buck woods and off Beaver Pond for son and if I think I'm up for it and can bail to Ullr's if too tough- if snow is still good am I right here ie easier blacks and any others? Those are good choices stay close to Ullrs in Beaver pond and drop in below the entrance sign, it gets choppy there

Green - do they have any for the girls or just head to the Blues with them Moonwalk should be fine, they run a groomer though the center and you can veer off into the trees as desired and comfortable

 

[TyWebb]

Started doing some recon for the green glades for them to get experience and blue & 'easier' blacks glades for me and son - so far I've got

Blue - Bushwacker and moonwalk which u mentioned assuming all the moons, right? YES- I also see Doe woods and Kokomo - Yes am I missing any?

Easier black glades - Buck woods and off Beaver Pond for son and if I think I'm up for it and can bail to Ullr's if too tough- if snow is still good am I right here ie easier blacks and any others? Those are good choices stay close to Ullrs in Beaver pond and drop in below the entrance sign, it gets choppy there

Green - do they have any for the girls or just head to the Blues with them Moonwalk should be fine, they run a groomer though the center and you can veer off into the trees as desired and comfortable

TY

Yea - read up on them grooming of some blue glades so I think the girls will be good. My son will def do it an if I'm ready to step up (we'll see knees and back) - def gonna give Beaver a shot and the bail out Ullrs if needed is what I was thinking.

Finally getting up there! As an indy pass holder never ended up driving the extra miles when I do Bolton for two days .. burned Bolton a few weeks ago so very excited.

Thanks much for the input

 

[TyWebb]

Here is a taste of what you can enjoy. Mostly higher terrain pictures. This was Friday before the biggget storm but after a week of new snow and they had wind closed lifts the Thursday before
View attachment 62134
View attachment 62135
View attachment 62136
View attachment 62137
View attachment 62138
View attachment 62139

Any spot with a Shakedown is good for me - looks like it will remain dry so I hopeful the snow will be solid w/ all they've received. So looking forward to this and my son is really excited to finally get up there!

 

[BenedictGomez]

Bushwacker - about the best "learning glades" I can think of just about anywhere in terms of low-angle & sustained, but not boring. There are a few steeper, short pitches that can be easily avoided if needed or done for more challenge. You can lap this for an hour or two and still have fun if the snow's good.

Moon glades - I barely call these glades really, though they are fun for little kids.

Beaver Pond - definitely not for people just learning to ski glades for the first time. If you go in there, be sure to stay right so you have an easy escape to Ullr's Dream. I would recommend you try one of or both Bonaventure Glade as well as Show-Off Glade before you attempt Beaver Pond. They're both short & have easy escapes. If you're handling those safely & fine, then Beaver Pond should be doable.

Kokomo - not a glade, just a little return trail with a few patches of trees.

 

[thetrailboss]

Bushwacker - about the best "learning glades" I cant think of just about anywhere in terms of low-angle & sustained, but not boring. There are a few steeper, short pitches that can be easily avoided if needed or done for more challenge. You can lap this for an hour or two and still have fun if the snow's good.

Moon glades - I barely call these glades really, though they are fun for little kids.

Beaver Pond - definitely not for people just learning to ski glades for the first time. If you go in there, be sure to stay right so you have an easy escape to Ullr's Dream. I would recommend you try one of or both Bonaventure Glade as well as Show-Off Glade before you attempt Beaver Pond. They're both short & have easy escapes. If you're handling those safely & fine, then Beaver Pond should be doable.

Kokomo - not a glade, just a little return trail with a few patches of trees.

That’s great and all, but in what glade did Q bury the money?

 

[TyWebb]

Bushwacker - about the best "learning glades" I can think of just about anywhere in terms of low-angle & sustained, but not boring. There are a few steeper, short pitches that can be easily avoided if needed or done for more challenge. You can lap this for an hour or two and still have fun if the snow's good.

Moon glades - I barely call these glades really, though they are fun for little kids.

Beaver Pond - definitely not for people just learning to ski glades for the first time. If you go in there, be sure to stay right so you have an easy escape to Ullr's Dream. I would recommend you try one of or both Bonaventure Glade as well as Show-Off Glade before you attempt Beaver Pond. They're both short & have easy escapes. If you're handling those safely & fine, then Beaver Pond should be doable.

Kokomo - not a glade, just a little return trail with a few patches of trees.

TY - looks like some rain up there so hopefully snow holds up ok the next two days