NH Ski areas

[BeefyBoy50]

I'm wondering this- and I looked it up online to see if it had been answered before but it hadn't- why are none of the New Hampshire ski areas as big as vermont's or maine's? I know about the law in New York that limits New York ski areas to 25 miles of trails, but as the Whites are the tallest mountains in the North East, I'm wondering why there aren't a couple killington/sugarloaf sized ski areas in NH. Is it the national forest? Not that i'm advocating this kind of development (a large ski area could ruin the area's natural beauty)

 

[MadMadWorld]

I'm wondering this- and I looked it up online to see if it had been answered before but it hadn't- why are none of the New Hampshire ski areas as big as vermont's or maine's? I know about the law in New York that limits New York ski areas to 25 miles of trails, but as the Whites are the tallest mountains in the North East, I'm wondering why there aren't a couple killington/sugarloaf sized ski areas in NH. Is it the national forest? Not that i'm advocating this kind of development (a large ski area could ruin the area's natural beauty)

Good question. There is a lot of white tape because most of the mountains are in the White Mountains National Park.

 

[St. Bear]

Good question. There is a lot of white tape because most of the mountains are in the White Mountains National Park.

Also the biggest mountains in the heart of the Whites are windscoured like crazy. Not to say that snow doesn't get deep in spots, but running a whole ski area would be near impossible.

 

[yeggous]

I'm wondering this- and I looked it up online to see if it had been answered before but it hadn't- why are none of the New Hampshire ski areas as big as vermont's or maine's? I know about the law in New York that limits New York ski areas to 25 miles of trails, but as the Whites are the tallest mountains in the North East, I'm wondering why there aren't a couple killington/sugarloaf sized ski areas in NH. Is it the national forest? Not that i'm advocating this kind of development (a large ski area could ruin the area's natural beauty)

It's worth noting that even though NH areas may sprawl much less, their vertical is certainly competitive with most Vermont areas. The real vertical at most NH areas is much better than Killington's effective vertical. (The main face of each of there individual peaks is under 2k ft).

I've always thought of this as involving a few different factors:
1) The National Forest certainly adds additional regulatory tape, but lots of places out West have that issue too.
2) The tallest mountains (the Presidentials) also have wicked winds making them unfit for lift service. Wildcat has enough wind holds that I can't even imagine what lift service on Mount Washington would look like or how frequently it could actually run.
3) The financials are much different in NH. You don't have the hordes of people from the Mid-Atlantic coming up for weeks or long weekends and dropping $$$. Most people who ski NH are locals or regulars from eastern MA. You can see the difference in ticket prices, lift lines, and lack of slopeside condos and lodging.

I strongly prefer NH over VT because the resorts are smaller, more affordable, and focused on skiing.

 

[from_the_NEK]

You can see the difference in ticket prices, lift lines, and lack of slopeside condos and lodging.

T
IMHO, These are not attributes of Bretton Woods, Loon, and Waterville.

I strongly prefer NH over VT because the resorts are smaller, more affordable, and focused on skiing.

That is a very broad brush to paint with... MRG, Magic, Burke, Bromley, and Pico may beg to differ.

 

[riverc0il]

Interestingly enough, regardless of price, I find NH is a worse value than VT. There are a lot of ski areas in NH that are quite expensive for what they are (e.g. Ragged, Sunapee, Gunstock, and to a lesser extent Waterville). The big "old school" areas are really getting up there in price (Cannon and Wildcat are in the 70 range now) and generally don't have much for cheaper options (Cannon still has twofer Tues and Thurs but Wildcat got rid of their twofer and Cannon got rid of their old frequent skier program and twofer coupons that could be used on weekends).

There have been lots of expansions in NH recently with Bretton, Loon, and Cannon all adding a lot of new terrain which has really bulked out the bigger areas in terms of terrain. Waterville will soon be joining this group with another build out. There aren't any Killington-esque mega resorts but that type of ski resort design doesn't work well in NH which has consistent pitch and not much run out to speak of. Vermont areas almost across the board have run outs and can work their terrain and slopeside options together. A lot less protected forest land to deal with as well for the higher peaks. It is a lot easier to build out a resort when you own the land as opposed to leasing or trying to build out land in a protected forest area.

 

[Smellytele]

T
IMHO, These are not attributes of Bretton Woods, Loon, and Waterville.


That is a very broad brush to paint with... MRG, Magic, Burke, Bromley, and Pico may beg to differ.

No matter where you go - there you are

 

[steamboat1]

Aren't all VT. areas within the Green Mountain National Forest with the exception of Burke?

 

[deadheadskier]

Aren't all VT. areas within the Green Mountain National Forest with the exception of Burke?

I thought the same, but recently checked out the USDA Forest Service website and the only VT areas that they list in the Green Mountain National Forest are Mt. Snow, Bromley and Sugarbush. Could have sworn I've seen Green Mountain National Forest signs at many more areas, but perhaps they only include those areas that reside entirely within the National Forest boundaries????

South half of the forest:

http://www.fs.usda.gov/wps/portal/f...t+-+Green+Mountain+National+Forest+South+Half

North Half

http://www.fs.usda.gov/wps/portal/f...t+-+Green+Mountain+National+Forest+North+Half

 

[steamboat1]

I thought the same, but recently checked out the USDA Forest Service website and the only VT areas that they list in the Green Mountain National Forest are Mt. Snow, Bromley and Sugarbush. Could have sworn I've seen Green Mountain National Forest signs at many more areas, but perhaps they only include those areas that reside entirely within the National Forest boundaries????

South half of the forest:

http://www.fs.usda.gov/wps/portal/fsinternet/!ut/p/c5/04_SB8K8xLLM9MSSzPy8xBz9CP0os3gDfxMDT8MwRydLA1cj72BTSw8jAwgAykeaxcN4jhYG_h4eYX5hPgYwefy6w0H24dcPNgEHcDTQ9_PIz03VL8iNMMgycVQEAIzTHkw!/dl3/d3/L2dJQSEvUUt3QS9ZQnZ3LzZfME80MEkxVkFCOTBFMktTNUJIMjAwMDAwMDA!/?ss=110920&ttype=recarea&recid=64901&actid=50&navtype=BROWSEBYSUBJECT&position=BROWSEBYSUBJECT&navid=110160000000000&pnavid=110000000000000&cid=FSE_003714&pname=Green+Mountain+National+Forest+-+Green+Mountain+National+Forest+South+Half

North Half

http://www.fs.usda.gov/wps/portal/fsinternet/!ut/p/c5/04_SB8K8xLLM9MSSzPy8xBz9CP0os3gDfxMDT8MwRydLA1cj72BTSw8jAwgAykeaxcN4jhYG_h4eYX5hPgYwefy6w0H24dcPNgEHcDTQ9_PIz03VL8iNMMgycVQEAIzTHkw!/dl3/d3/L2dJQSEvUUt3QS9ZQnZ3LzZfME80MEkxVkFCOTBFMktTNUJIMjAwMDAwMDA!/?ss=110920&ttype=recarea&recid=64899&actid=50&navtype=BROWSEBYSUBJECT&position=BROWSEBYSUBJECT&navid=110160000000000&pnavid=110000000000000&cid=FSE_003714&pname=Green+Mountain+National+Forest+-+Green+Mountain+National+Forest+North+Half

Yes but I know Killington is in Coolidge State Forest (not sure if it's in the Green Mountain National Forest) & Middlebury Snow Bowl is in the Green Mountain National Forest. Can't imagine Mt. Mansfield not being on some kind of protected land.

 

[BeefyBoy50]

good point about the wind- 250 miles per hour or whatever the wind was on Mt. Washington certainly is not anything to chuckle at. The White Mountains are also not part of the appalachians I believe which explains their steeper, more consistent fall lines and their lack of run-outs.

 

[Smellytele]

good point about the wind- 250 miles per hour or whatever the wind was on Mt. Washington certainly is not anything to chuckle at. The White Mountains are also not part of the appalachians I believe which explains their steeper, more consistent fall lines and their lack of run-outs.

They are part of the Appalachians.

 

[Smellytele]

Cannon actually is part of the Franconia Notch state park

 

[St. Bear]

The Appalachian Trail runs through NH/ME, but I guess it doesn't necessarily have to follow the mountain chain exactly.

 

[Gnarcissaro]

The White Mountains are also not part of the appalachians...

Geography FAIL.

 

[Puck it]

Geography FAIL.

Actually they extend into Canada.

 

[from_the_NEK]

Geography FAIL.

Like saying the Tetons are not part of the Rockies.

The Appalachians and Rockies are large macro ranges that are made of many smaller micro ranges.

 

[from_the_NEK]

The top 1/2 of Burke CCC road up is in Darling State Park.

Stowe (Mt MAnsfield side) and Smuggs are in the Mt Mansfield State Forest. Spruce Peak is outside the State Forest.

Much of Jay Peak is in the Jay State Forest. The West Bowl is not.

MRG and Magic are not in a State Park or Forest.

The top of Mt Ellen and all of Sugarbush South are in the GMNF.

 

[Gnarcissaro]

Actually they extend into Canada.

Yes. Hence the failure...

 

[gregnye]

Much of Jay Peak is in the Jay State Forest. The West Bowl is not.

Aha! So that's why they seem to be so eager to expand over there! No national forest!. I get it now!