Black Mountain, NH OPEN AGAIN more alive than ever

[drjeff]

I'm gonna agree with @AdironRider here. What Black is doing is definitlely working right now, but likely not sustainable. Sustainability might come from vibe/community/goodwill from the insane efforts to provide great product the last 2 seasons, and I am hopeful that these metrics being shared are proof of that and that Black continues this way for the foreseeable future. Cautiously optimistic here.

That said I am bringing a group of 20+ there tomorrow and half of them plan to simply drink mimosas and eat fondue mid-mountain all-day.

Exactly. The key will be 2 to 3+ years from now and will the folks who are discovering Black for the 1st time now, keep coming back. Time will tell

They are definitely doing many things right now, and folks are noticing, which is a great thing for any ski area, and especially one that was definitely on "life support" a couple of years ago

 

[millerm277]

I'm gonna agree with @AdironRider here. What Black is doing is definitlely working right now, but likely not sustainable. Sustainability might come from vibe/community/goodwill from the insane efforts to provide great product the last 2 seasons, and I am hopeful that these metrics being shared are proof of that and that Black continues this way for the foreseeable future. Cautiously optimistic here.

That said I am bringing a group of 20+ there tomorrow and half of them plan to simply drink mimosas and eat fondue mid-mountain all-day.

Are they really though? Beyond the expense of catching up with deferred maintenance, I'm not really convinced that Black is doing something unsustainable to continue in the future if their customer base is recovering well.

Between last season's numbers and those percentages for this year, it sounds pretty plausible that they could be turning in 90k+ visits or the like for this year if the end of season numbers stay that high vs prior year.

 

[machski]

Are they really though? Beyond the expense of catching up with deferred maintenance, I'm not really convinced that Black is doing something unsustainable to continue in the future if their customer base is recovering well.

Between last season's numbers and those percentages for this year, it sounds pretty plausible that they could be turning in 90k+ visits or the like for this year if the end of season numbers stay that high vs prior year.

I would say the one thing not sustainable under a co-op model is pushing to open super early like this year or pushing for super late closes. Snowmaking is still expensive, especially pushing and having to rebuild for super early and build crazy depths for super deep. Black has the wrong exposure to make that eve close to cost effective year in and out.

 

[Newpylong]

There is no way in hell they haul 90K skier visits, Ragged just broke 100K for the first time ever last year. The infrastructure (parking, lodge, lifts, etc) won't support it even if they wanted to come.

I don't think the current model is sustainable either, but I don't know if it has to be, unless people are going to be expecting that year in and year out. I think a more moderate opening and closing date and more realistic snowmaking makes more sense long term. You can still put out a good product if you can do so efficiently and Black's snowmaking now is in a much better position.

I have to assume this is all part of simply trying to create enough energy and interest so that a more sustainable model will actually work.

 

[machski]

There is no way in hell they haul 90K skier visits, Ragged just broke 100K for the first time ever last year. The infrastructure (parking, lodge, lifts, etc) won't support it even if they wanted to come.

I don't think the current model is sustainable either, but I don't know if it has to be, unless people are going to be expecting that year in and year out. I think a more moderate opening and closing date and more realistic snowmaking makes more sense long term. You can still put out a good product if you can do so efficiently and Black's snowmaking now is in a much better position.

I have to assume this is all part of simply trying to create enough energy and interest so that a more sustainable model will actually work.

Well, it does seem to be working anecdotally from our perspective. Friends of my wife pivoted this year from season passes at Cranmore to passes at Black at they are really loving it there. They were also very excited about the offer to become share owners and are seriously contemplating that. This is a one couple example, but I am sure this sentiment is being replicated for many that are MWV owners or frequents. Other friends just sent me pics from Friday Night Lights. Will have to give that a go. That looks cool. Personally, can't wait to get over and give them a try. Just letting my kneee get a bit stronger to really be able to go full out. Planning to visit in February.

 

[shpride]

Im another example. I ended up buying a Black pass this year just after new years because their conditions were great as opposed to the sheets of ice at Attitash and Wildcat. I’m dropping my Epic pass next year and just skiing Black.

 

[bigbob]

Im another example. I ended up buying a Black pass this year just after new years because their conditions were great as opposed to the sheets of ice at Attitash and Wildcat. I’m dropping my Epic pass next year and just skiing Black.

Vail needs the competion, otherwiswe they won't do much at either mnt, other than possibly sell out. Not having a good season out west may also crimp their cash flow and may have to liquadate some assets. This would be good for the valley depending who ends up with these mnts.

 

[snoseek]

Vail needs the competion, otherwiswe they won't do much at either mnt, other than possibly sell out. Not having a good season out west may also crimp their cash flow and may have to liquadate some assets. This would be good for the valley depending who ends up with these mnts.

Blackcat pass..

Plz god make this happen

 

[pinion]

Blackcat pass..

Plz god make this happen

I can only hit the Like button once but please know I wish to register the , , and emojis for this.

Black was - as expected - packed today and a very good time.

 

[snoseek]

I can only hit the Like button once but please know I wish to register the , , and emojis for this.

Black was - as expected - packed today and a very good time.

It's skiing so good there. Im burning my 2nd day next week.

 

[eatskisleep]

I can only hit the Like button once but please know I wish to register the , , and emojis for this.

Black was - as expected - packed today and a very good time.

I was there too, skiing was great. Place was packed but lift lines kept moving. Snowmaking happening all over the mountain. Diana's Bath Salts were rockin the base lodge Apres Ski. Everyone seemed to be having a great time.

I never realized that kids are considered up to 21 at Black, helps keep costs reasonable. Met some people that used to be WIldcat/Attitash skiers but don't bother anymore with either.

Wildcat is still my favorite mountain terrain wise in NH (Cannon a close second), but I refuse to pay for a pass there under Vail management.

Also there used to be a season pass called the Big One: Wildcat, Black Mountain, Cranmore, Tyrol, and Attitash.

So one can still dream...

 

[eatskisleep]

It's skiing so good there. Im burning my 2nd day next week.

Debating buying a season pass there for next season. I usually like to travel around more, but the snow quality was just so good. The vibes and the skiing today was that good, despite being the busiest day of the year.

 

[deadheadskier]

Diana's Bath Salts

What a great band name.

Absolutely love what's going on at Black and happy to support via Indy. If I lived in the Valley, I would possibly get a full pass.

That said, even if I had a few grand to set on fire without worrying about ROI, I still don't think I'd invest in the co-op model. I just don't see it being a viable alternative like MRG has. I wish I did because I love Black, but lower elevation, south facing terrain and 120" a year is just tough math.

 

[Edd]

None of this is confirmed but I was talking with a local at Big Day Brewing a couple days ago who knows someone who bartends at the mid-mountain cabin. They say bartenders are unusually well paid per hour and the cabin is making a mint selling lots of full bottles of champagne for stupid money, but people are paying it.

 

[bigbob]

Diana's Bath Salts

What a great band name.

Absolutely love what's going on at Black and happy to support via Indy. If I lived in the Valley, I would possibly get a full pass.

That said, even if I had a few grand to set on fire without worrying about ROI, I still don't think I'd invest in the co-op model. I just don't see it being a viable alternative like MRG has. I wish I did because I love Black, but lower elevation, south facing terrain and 120" a year is just tough math.

Black does have snowmaking where MRG has 2 guns. Longer season at Black.

 

[urungus]

None of this is confirmed but I was talking with a local at Big Day Brewing a couple days ago who knows someone who bartends at the mid-mountain cabin. They say bartenders are unusually well paid per hour and the cabin is making a mint selling lots of full bottles of champagne for stupid money, but people are paying it.

I was there yesterday for first time, had a great time a definitely will be coming back. They are making bank at the champagne bar for sure. One thing they need to figure out is the Indy Pass redemption, there was an enormous line and not the best way to start the day. It boggles the mind that as a resort owned by Indy Pass, I cannot use the Indy Pass card that they mailed to me to go straight to lift. Especially since Entabeni who bought Indy Pass in 2023 is a friggin ski resort focused IT company.

 

[Smellytele]

I was there yesterday for first time, had a great time a definitely will be coming back. They are making bank at the champagne bar for sure. One thing they need to figure out is the Indy Pass redemption, there was an enormous line and not the best way to start the day. It boggles the mind that as a resort owned by Indy Pass, I cannot use the Indy Pass card that they mailed to me to go straight to lift. Especially since Entabeni who bought Indy Pass in 2023 is a friggin ski resort focused IT company.

Indy redemption at any place with a crowd is horrible.
I thought Bolton was the worst until I went to Burke. 99% of the people getting day tix were indy pass. The ones who were not the took them out of line a got them a ticket somewhere else behind the scenes. Then they did have a kiosk that a few people who bought (non indy) online could use. I actually like places like Cannon and Pats where you can reserve indy online. Makes it so much easier.

 

[Edd]

Indy redemption at any place with a crowd is horrible.
I thought Bolton was the worst until I went to Burke. 99% of the people getting day tix were indy pass. The ones who were not the took them out of line a got them a ticket somewhere else behind the scenes. Then they did have a kiosk that a few people who bought (non indy) online could use. I actually like places like Cannon and Pats where you can reserve indy online. Makes it so much easier.

Didn’t know that about Pats, thanks. Every time I go it’s somehow single digit temps and that wait at the outside window (why?) can be brutal.

 

[SkiNewEngland.net]

Indy redemption at areas still using wicket lift tickets is typically much faster.

 

[Smellytele]

Didn’t know that about Pats, thanks. Every time I go it’s somehow single digit temps and that wait at the outside window (why?) can be brutal.

Well at Pats you still have to go the tix window but it is way faster. Cannon if you have a RFID card already you don't