BUTTERNUT: The 2005 AlpineZone Challenge MUST go on!

[Steve@jpr]

Setting the record

Just as an FYI--Butternut passes include access to Jay Peak lift tickets at 50% off the normal window rate. Our Other-Mountain-Passholder program allows for $35 lift tickets for those carrying season passes from other resorts.

Steve

 

[Tin Woodsman]

I thought his reply on the issue of lift capacity was....interesting. If I follow his logic, more lift capacity enables you to get more fresh powder runs b/c you're not waiting in line. I see. So what about the other 10,000 people the lift system swallowed up? Are they choosing to ski in the same line, thereby leaving your powder untouchaed? What a load of garbage. It's much more rewarding to wait in a line at, for example, the MRG Single for 30 minutes at a time and be ensured of gettgin good snow all day than it is to wait for 2 minutes at the Butternut quads with the knowledge the mountain will be skied off by 10AM. Does anyone here buy that malarkey?

Apples and oranges and hardly a fair comparison. Butternut is a small family hill and certainly not known as some eastern powder mecca. Overall, the higher lift capacity is better for this type of mountain. And I do see his point. A good comparison is a 15 minute drive away at Catamount. The lift system there sucks (two rickety old doubles that service the summit). On a busy day you can burn 20-30 minutes between the wait and the ride. Not that Catamount can use three quads, but I'm sure that the folks at Butternut tried to balance lift capacity with skier volume based on their target clientele.

Well sure it's apples and oranges - I wasn't trying to say that Butternut should be like MRG. Tow different mountain, markets, strategies, etc... What I was getting at is that his logic was fundamentally flawed. He was trying to sell us snake oil in the form of a statement that more uphill capacity equated to more runs in the powder on a snow day. That's fundamentally untrue. By definition, as the quantity of runs increases, the quality of those runs (if you are looking for powder, or even fresh courduroy) will decrease. In fact, I think Butternut is doing their skiers a great disservice by adding so much capacity. It comes down to a fundamental question of quaility vs. quantity. The Butternut rep was trying to imply that you can have both at his mountain and that's simply untrue. Only in rare cases like maybe the Canyons or Snowbasin where you have high speed lifts coupled with an abundance of uncrowded terrain will that be the case. Given your comparison, I'd much rather wait 20 minutes in the line at Catamount, secure in the knowledge that there will still be fresh lines by the time I reach the top of the mountain.

 

[Greg]

I see your point, Tin. I guess we'll just have to wait and see how this additional quad affects skier traffic. I only skied Butternut twice last season (once early, once late); both on mellow crowd days so I can't comment on what result the new Highline quad had. I think part of Matt's point was the three quads should distribute skier traffic across the mountain better. Does a higher lift capacity always result in higher skier visit numbers? If not, then you're just spreading people more evenly on the hill as they won't all flock to the Top Flight quad.

 

[Tin Woodsman]

I don't think it's a question of whether quads draw more skiers to a ski area (though anecdotal evidence suggests they do). The key issue is that with all that lift capacity, the same amount of skiers will be able to double or triple the number of runs they can take in a given time frame. As such, the powder gets chewed up extremely quickly and the corduroy gets scraped off into ice just as fast. Matt engaged in a bit of marketing doubletalk about how great Butternut's snowmaking and grooming were to compensate. But that's not going to make a difference at 10:30AM on a Saturday when all the good snow is scraped off b/c of the massive lift capacity. I love high speed, high capacity lifts when the terrain it serves is large enough to handle the traffic. Alas, Butternut is not one of those areas. The last time I skied it two years ago, it felt crowded on the slopes and that was with only one quad installed. Now there are three and all the people I saw waiting in line at the Highline double will instead be on the hill. I'd like to know how Butternut defines its carrying capacity, b/c if they still aren't meeting it with their lift capacity, they have a very strange definition indeed.

 

[bvibert]

I look forward to giving this place a try! The AZ Challenge has really made me interested!

Be sure to lemme know when you come down...

Yeah, me too! It'll give me an excuse to visit there myself...

 

[thetrailboss]

I look forward to giving this place a try! The AZ Challenge has really made me interested!

Be sure to lemme know when you come down...

Yeah, me too! It'll give me an excuse to visit there myself...

Ms. Trailboss and I will come down for an AZ rendezvous!

 

[Greg]

I look forward to giving this place a try! The AZ Challenge has really made me interested!

Be sure to lemme know when you come down...

Yeah, me too! It'll give me an excuse to visit there myself...

Ms. Trailboss and I will come down for an AZ rendezvous!

You guys should make a weekend out of it and hit a few Berkshire areas.