From KZone: Guerilla Trailblazers Arrested

[skibum1321]

I hope these individuals were smart enough to keep their mouths shut.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that they aren't all that smart, considering what they did. And for the record, I would like to see these guys get the book thrown at them. Stupid doesn't begin to describe it...

 

[David Metsky]

Are people being a hypocrite for saying they won't ski this illegaly cut "trail", but use the illegaly cut trail to get to big jay from jay peak?

I skin up from the road. I yelled (but not as loudly since I hadn't skied up there then) when the first illegal trail was cut.

http://www.burlingtonfreepress.com/legacy/slideshows/081007jay/index.html
Here's some images of the cut.

 

[tjf67]

Does the state even have a case here? Were there witnesses to the actual cutting? Was the finger pointed at these guys just from word of mouth? I hope these individuals were smart enough to keep their mouths shut. What trees were cut where ???

I know in NY State if you cut up that high in elevation something like that you would most likely spend time in jail.

There first mistake was cutting on State land. Cutting above 3k is probably going to doom them. That stuff does not grow easily up there.

You ski sugarloaf. Look at the top of that hill. After the fire in the 50's it still has not grown back.

 

[Tin Woodsman]

I'm interested in hearing peoples thoughts on this question.

Are people being a hypocrite for saying they won't ski this illegaly cut "trail", but use the illegaly cut trail to get to big jay from jay peak?

People were hiking out to Big Jay long before Stenger widened the path. Many people called Jay Peak out for that stupidity and rightly so. Should Big Jay skiers now insist on skinning up from 242 in the interest of maintaining some theoretical purity?

There are a thousand other routes down Big Jay than what these yutzes cut. For the forest's sake, it would make sense to use those options.

 

[David Metsky]

BTW, I wouldn't object to skiing along the illegal trail on the ridge because if you want to ski from the ski area you don't have a whole lot of choice in the matter. They cut the trail exactly where the herd path was. So I expect to ski that eventually but would have preferred a herd path.

I think the elevation, size, and visibility of the cut is going to doom these guys. I hope the state makes an example of them in an effort to nip this type of activity in the bud (pardon the pun).

 

[drjeff]

The real prosecution issue here maybe that if the State DOESN'T do something atleast semi-serious (i.e. big fine or some time behind bars or both instead of just probation and/or community service) then other "knuckleheads" may very well the get idea and do similar cuts in other areas around the state.

 

[dmc]

I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree. Having skied up there I find this to be an unneeded, poorly thought out, horrendously executed clusterfuck. It will change the nature of that area for the worse for years to come. I hope the two idiots get the book thrown at them. This is the second major illegal trail cut in that area where none was needed; it seems no one learned from the first one.

Agreed... Never skied it.. But from the shots I've seen.. It seems VERY skiable.. With plenty of room.. So why even cut?

 

[jimmer]

anybody have any ideas as what the name of this trail should be, usally left up to the builder, but maybe we can help them out. how about -busted or two idiots, any others ?

 

[ctenidae]

anybody have any ideas as what the name of this trail should be, usally left up to the builder, but maybe we can help them out. how about -busted or two idiots, any others ?

If you ski the right side, it's Tweedle-Dum.
If you ski the left side, it's Tweede-Dummer

 

[drjeff]

anybody have any ideas as what the name of this trail should be, usally left up to the builder, but maybe we can help them out. how about -busted or two idiots, any others ?

5 to 10
Don't Drop the Soap!

 

[riverc0il]

lets fight, you can just try to kick some *ss, just don't let me see you there, and rivercoil, steve, your an idiot. i don't know what else to say, you are being ridiculous and don't know the first thing about cutting glades and what any of the terrain of big jay looks like without snow, just stop posting about it.

Name calling? Is an ad hominem name calling personal attack the best argument you can add to this discussion? Because that is what this is, a discussion, and it was a civil one at that until you posted. You are right, I do not know the first thing about cutting glades. Does that discount my argument? Perhaps, but I sure know enough about maintaining and trimming which is a heck of a lot better than clear cutting 20 foot wide trails which I want to remain clueless about. You "know" you will see me out there next season? When did you become omnipotent? Give me a break.

 

[riverc0il]

Are people being a hypocrite for saying they won't ski this illegaly cut "trail", but use the illegaly cut trail to get to big jay from jay peak?

This is a good question and one that I considered. Big Jay was still accessible before the herd path became a fully blown "trail" so I don't think this is quite the same type of issue. And unlike skiing any where on Big Jay, unless you skin up, there is no way to avoid the cut. Though I would maintain there is a difference between a small cut and a twenty foot wide trail. I still would prefer it without the cut to ensure more pure experience. The rub here is the only way to avoid being "completely" "hypocritical" would be to avoid Big Jay or only skin up. However, I can certainly avoid skiing the cut from the ridge easily enough.

 

[nhski]

This is a good question and one that I considered. Big Jay was still accessible before the herd path became a fully blown "trail" so I don't think this is quite the same type of issue. And unlike skiing any where on Big Jay, unless you skin up, there is no way to avoid the cut. Though I would maintain there is a difference between a small cut and a twenty foot wide trail. I still would prefer it without the cut to ensure more pure experience. The rub here is the only way to avoid being "completely" "hypocritical" would be to avoid Big Jay or only skin up. However, I can certainly avoid skiing the cut from the ridge easily enough.

This is a question i have been pondering since i heard about the cut. I agree there is a big difference between the herd path cut and the clear cut trail that these two idiots did. I use the herd path (as you know) and probably won't be looking to ski this "trail" as there is plenty of good options out there. It just seems like a double standard to say "ban skiing this illegal trail" and then to use a different illegal trail. I guess it comes down to the severity of the illegal cut. But then i say to myself wrong is wrong, regardless of severity. Is stealling $10 okay but $100 not?

 

[kbroderick]

This is a question i have been pondering since i heard about the cut. I agree there is a big difference between the herd path cut and the clear cut trail that these two idiots did. I use the herd path (as you know) and probably won't be looking to ski this "trail" as there is plenty of good options out there. It just seems like a double standard to say "ban skiing this illegal trail" and then to use a different illegal trail. I guess it comes down to the severity of the illegal cut. But then i say to myself wrong is wrong, regardless of severity. Is stealling $10 okay but $100 not?

I haven't skied Big Jay, so I don't know...but is the herd path relatively flat? The pitch on the new swath seems to make it quite liable to serious erosion, particularly if vegetative regrowth is hampered by additional skier traffic. If the herd path is less erosion-prone, then I don't see any double standard at all--it's not about the legality of the cut, it's about the impact of the action (the skiing, not the cutting) on the environment.

 

[VTpowder]

steve
the thing is, i have come across your path a number of times at jay. you are hard to miss. you post everything you do. so when i say i better not see you out there i mean it, because i most likely will. we share the same mountain and you seem to be there any time the snow is good the same goes for me. so that is all i meant.

 

[riverc0il]

steve
the thing is, i have come across your path a number of times at jay. you are hard to miss. you post everything you do. so when i say i better not see you out there i mean it, because i most likely will. we share the same mountain and you seem to be there any time the snow is good the same goes for me. so that is all i meant.

Fair enough, call me out as a liar publicly if you see me over there. Next time you cross my path, be sure to say hello I would do the same saying hello to you if I saw you, but you seem to have the advantage in knowing what I look like

 

[Phildozer]

When did you become omnipotent?

Omnipotent? Who said he has Erectile Dysfunction?

 

[Phildozer]

steve
the thing is, i have come across your path a number of times at jay. you are hard to miss. you post everything you do. so when i say i better not see you out there i mean it, because i most likely will. we share the same mountain and you seem to be there any time the snow is good the same goes for me. so that is all i meant.

Wow.

Threatening violence over skiing. Talk about a total buzz-kill. Very, very not-cool.

 

[VTpowder]

no violence is intended, only words.
someone who had post earilier in this thread had threatened violence and some of my comments were directed at them.
sorry for the confusion.

 

[JD]

Fools (to get caught) If they had done this thing and not gotten caught, I know what all of our reactions would have been stumbling onto this line this winter for the first time on a good day. YEEHAW! Does seem a little over kill to take out such big trees, but I can't wait to ski it. What's it called anyway? Jailbird?
DeWeez's Chute?
Forbidden fruit?