FTO News Item: Rumors Fly Regarding Pending Sale of ASC Resorts

[drjeff]

I ski the crap out of ASC mountains, and even though I'm saving big on lift ticket prices, I POUR money into skiing, with the bars, lunches, lodging,and stuff I buy at the mountain on the spur of the moment. The A41 pass gets me there to spend more money, and I'm sure I'm not alone here.

Alot of people are the same way. Plus, if you bought a Bronze, realistically before that pass, you might have skied/rode an ASC mtn 3 or 4 times a year and then another hill for the remainder of the 10 days or so the average skier goes a year. Now with the Bronze, that average skier will do 8 or 9 of those 10 days at an ASC hill, and all of the extra spur of the moment purchases at the hill happen at an ASC hill.

Since I'm a property owner in the Mt Snow area, if the sale(s) go through it won't effect the majority of days where I ski a year, but it is nice with the A41 since I have relatives not too far from Attitash and I'll typically drive the hour or so up the road from MS to K a few times a year.

In the past I paid alot more for a pass, so I'd do it again if the price went up. Plus, with new owners, that would in all likelihood mean new, much needed capital improvements, and frankly if my pass costs me $1000 instead of the $650ish my gold pass was, and I have a few new lifts and some expanded snowmaking, that extra $$ I spend would be worth it.

 

[2knees]

I ski the crap out of ASC mountains, and even though I'm saving big on lift ticket prices, I POUR money into skiing, with the bars, lunches, lodging,and stuff I buy at the mountain on the spur of the moment. The A41 pass gets me there to spend more money, and I'm sure I'm not alone here.

i bet they're losing money on the a41. regardless of how many long trails you suck down. :smile:

 

[Vortex]

Edd and DrJeff. I'm with you guys on your points. I spend the money in the Rest and bars and some lodging. I also frequent ASC places much more know than before.
They are getting more of my money than they were before.

 

[bigbog]

..wayyyy too late with the a41

Actually it did......they made a TON of cash on these...much more than back before when the passes were over $1000.00...ASC just failed EVERYWHERE else...

Killington is on the "chopping block" because its like the only resort in the ASC family that makes money. They have to sell of things to relieve debt...the A41 pass didn't hurt ASC at all..M

Agreed, the a41(and similar prices) just came wayyyy too late, particularly for areas of New England that haven't fared as well since the beginning of the Reign of Dubya.
EDIT:...but agree with you 2knees, especially on the Bronze pass....

 

[thebigo]

This link is in the other forums but in case anybody didnt see it:

http://www.rutlandherald.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070209/BUSINESS/702090320/1011/BUSINESS

Talks more about the rumored sale and mentions LBO in relation to SR.

 

[Vortex]

thankx Big O.

I think I remember a thread before about the potential of LBO buying back SR and another Asc mountain. I thought it was Attitash. The attitash part seems wrong anyway. I thought it was Phildozer that had some insight. Maybe I'm way off.

This went back to last fall.
More questions than answers.

 

[thebigo]

I think I remember a thread before about the potential of LBO buying back SR and another Asc mountain. I thought it was Attitash. The attitash part seems wrong anyway. I thought it was Phildozer that had some insight. Maybe I'm way off.

I remember reading somewhere that LBO was interested in SR and SL. Could have been here or the nelsap forum or i could be losing my mind.

Wouldnt it be fitting if after the entire ASC debacle LBO ended up exactly where he started. Does anybody know the general feeling at SR towards LBO these days.

 

[Vortex]

I eat at the Phoenix. Maybe it was SL (The big O) . That is a funny thought though... about a LBO return.. Truth is more humorous than fiction.

 

[salida]

I'm exactly the opposite of you guys... I've skied asc mountains over 30 days this year, and yesterday was the first day I've bought anything their all year (a delicious bread bowl, I might add)...

I can't imagine they are making money off this pass, and if they are it surely isn't a sizable amount. The money is just spread to thin.

 

[Phildozer]

I thought it was Phildozer that had some insight. Maybe I'm way off.

Nope, you're right. : )

LBO is gunning for Sunday River.

 

[Vortex]

Dozer 6 months ahead of the crowd on this one.

 

[Vortex]

http://www.rutlandherald.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070209/BUSINESS/702090319/1011/BUSINESS

I stole Bubb'a work to get this one.

Talking about the changes in tickets and other industry changes.

 

[persee]

Ok kids. I've just been skimming here and had a few questions/comments.

First off I keep seeing a reference to an "LBO" and Sunday, could someone give me some history? Unfortunately I didn't get to ski in the 80s or 90s - stupid family deciding it was too expensive/dangerour/something so I never got started until 2 years ago.

Secondly I can say for a fact that I would not pay $600-1000 for any ski pass. There is just no way that times 2 (for a couple) that you could guarantee a reasonable return. When one is looking at for 10 days of skiing your cost is up to $100 per day per person well that's just crazy when one also has to shell out for lodging, food, etc. That takes the sport to one only those of serious privelidge could enjoy. I think for the most part even now the majority of those who purchase the A41 passes don't use them enough to really cost ASC money in terms of lost day passes, plus it's money they get up front prior to crappy snow conditions, injury, illness, forced relocation,etc

So personally I hope this is all just rumouring as it's likely to put a serious kabosh on an activity I just started 2 years ago and really love.

 

[SkiDog]

Ok kids. I've just been skimming here and had a few questions/comments.

First off I keep seeing a reference to an "LBO" and Sunday, could someone give me some history? Unfortunately I didn't get to ski in the 80s or 90s - stupid family deciding it was too expensive/dangerour/something so I never got started until 2 years ago.

Secondly I can say for a fact that I would not pay $600-1000 for any ski pass. There is just no way that times 2 (for a couple) that you could guarantee a reasonable return. When one is looking at for 10 days of skiing your cost is up to $100 per day per person well that's just crazy when one also has to shell out for lodging, food, etc. That takes the sport to one only those of serious privelidge could enjoy. I think for the most part even now the majority of those who purchase the A41 passes don't use them enough to really cost ASC money in terms of lost day passes, plus it's money they get up front prior to crappy snow conditions, injury, illness, forced relocation,etc

So personally I hope this is all just rumouring as it's likely to put a serious kabosh on an activity I just started 2 years ago and really love.

Honestly...the A41 was tooo good a deal...its made us expect it...take a look at season passes at ANY resort out west...You'll see $1000+ is the norm...of course those that buy those passes ski a great deal so it pays off...for the typical "weekender" it would not be worth it..

M

 

[thebigo]

First off I keep seeing a reference to an "LBO" and Sunday, could someone give me some history?

LBO is les otten, he grew SR from a whole in the wall to what it is today. He aquired too many resorts too quickly and eventually drowned in debt leading to where asc is today.

Check out this link, its a little outdated but will fill in the details:

http://www.fundinguniverse.com/company-histories/American-Skiing-Company-Company-History.html

 

[madskier6]

This link is in the other forums but in case anybody didnt see it:

http://www.rutlandherald.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070209/BUSINESS/702090320/1011/BUSINESS

Talks more about the rumored sale and mentions LBO in relation to SR.

That article is the first where I've heard about Vail Resorts as a possible buyer for Killington. Interesting. Don't know how likely that is, but if it did happen at least Vail Resorts has the financial capability to invest in infrastructure improvements. They also have a good track record of running ski resorts successfully. Could be good for K as you know they would make improvements. I hope they wouldn't "gentrify" K, however, and make it "upper crusty".

 

[drjeff]

I'm exactly the opposite of you guys... I've skied asc mountains over 30 days this year, and yesterday was the first day I've bought anything their all year (a delicious bread bowl, I might add)...

I can't imagine they are making money off this pass, and if they are it surely isn't a sizable amount. The money is just spread to thin.

You're a college student. Frankly they're not expecting to make alot of $$ on you, but are hoping that in a few years when you're out of school and get a family going that you'll bring the whole family to their hill and then they'll recoup the money that they didn't make off you now.

Case in point, I'm paying ASC (via Mt Snow) just over $3000 for a season of child care and lessons for my 2 kids(ages 3 and 1) this season. That doesn't even get into the all for 1 passes for my wife and I, food, the occassional purchase from one of their ski shops when my 3 year olf looses something at at the mountain, the pair of Nordica Victory Speeds my wife just bought using the discount her all for one pass got her at the Mt Snow ski shop, and then there will be the additional daycare/ski lessons for my kids + lift tickets for me and my wife when we go out to Park City and ski at the Canyons in a few weeks. ASC likes me:wink: and in general I like most of what ASC has done! :argue:

 

[MadPadraic]

Honestly...the A41 was tooo good a deal...its made us expect it...take a look at season passes at ANY resort out west...You'll see $1000+ is the norm...of course those that buy those passes ski a great deal so it pays off...for the typical "weekender" it would not be worth it..

M

It may be the norm at the top of the top end, but a quick check shows that Copper Mountain is 800, Alpine Meadows is 900, but only 700 for a Sun-Fri pass. Alta is 725 and Schweitzer is only 500. When I lived out west, I used to get a season pass to the local hill for well under 350, which included everything but Saturday before 5pm. (If Saturday was going to be an epic powder day, we put in the extra 1.5 hours drive for bigger bowls; otherwise we would sleep in and go night skiing.)

Even Aspen has a season pass that gives you unlimited access to two of their mountains for under 750 (thought these mountains have shorter seasons than the other two).

 

[SkiDog]

It may be the norm at the top of the top end, but a quick check shows that Copper Mountain is 800, Alpine Meadows is 900, but only 700 for a Sun-Fri pass. Alta is 725 and Schweitzer is only 500. When I lived out west, I used to get a season pass to the local hill for well under 350, which included everything but Saturday before 5pm. (If Saturday was going to be an epic powder day, we put in the extra 1.5 hours drive for bigger bowls; otherwise we would sleep in and go night skiing.)

Even Aspen has a season pass that gives you unlimited access to two of their mountains for under 750 (thought these mountains have shorter seasons than the other two).

There are deals to be found...and those mtns you mention do offer great deals...my buddy lives in Dillon, so I do follow you on this....but the idea of a $1000+ season pass is not far from reality...

M

 

[Geoff]

Killington pass prices pre-ASC always broke even with 21 ski days. That's ~ $1400 with today's lift ticket prices.

Whoever buys Killington is doing a real estate deal. They'll be building trophy homes and luxury homes and selling them to multi-millionaires. If you total up the houses and condo units that are in the Killington Village plan, this is approaching a $1 Billion real estate deal. To appeal to that market, they're going to need to spiff the resort up and fix their Saturday overcrowding problem. Cheap season passes are likely gone forever. I'd also expect them to boost Saturday day ticket prices.


Park City Mountain Resort
Day Ticket Price: $77
Season Pass: $1195

Killington has much higher energy costs because of all the snowmaking and uber-expensive electricity from Central Vermont Public Service. $80 on Saturdays and holiday periods and $1400 for a season pass wouldn't surprise me.