Ski binding settings

[jack97]

wrt op, I tell the tech I'm advance and lie about my age. The later for the fact that it saves me the trouble of adjusting it again. The reason I do this is not ego, it's b/c I had pre releases in the moguls and crud condition. I get paranoid at the thought the bindings will release in the glades or when I go down a steep.

The other thing about bindings is I don't bother with Markers anymore. Anytime I had any slight jarring in the bumps with Markers, they released on me. I use Look/Rossi mainly because of the elasticity at the toe piece. I can be more aggressive with those bindings.

 

[Tin]

Your lucky dude. I witnessed someone do something similar at Stowe a few years ago. I'm pretty confident the woman tore most of the ligaments in her knee.



Actually it was more likely caused by poor technique.

Yes. Very very. I owe him quite a few beers. Really spooked me about skiing solo. I truly believe the combination of snow conditions and low setting did it.

 

[deadheadskier]

I use Look/Rossi mainly because of the elasticity at the toe piece. I can be more aggressive with those bindings.

I think sometimes it's possible to get a "lemon" pair of bindings. The only Rossi bindings I've ever owned were Axial 120. Single worst binding I've ever skied. Pre-released like crazy no matter how hard they were cranked down. I had them in the shop many times to get tested and the techs all thought they were fine. I eventually broke the heel piece on them.

Never had an issue with my Marker Dukes or the Fischer System binding on my Motives. I have both set at 9.

 

[Not Sure]

400 mines 400!

I can remember back when Ballet sking was in ,I met a guy who was sking on a set of 140's
Literally screwed his boots to the skis through the bases ,
Guy could jump with poles and with little forward motion do a 900
Insane talent

 

[goldsbar]

Aren't they like car tires? You just set them to the max?

Mine are at 8. That's what the DIN chart says for 155lb level III. It's also what I came to through experimentation. I went to Whistler one year and dropped a bunch of 5-10 footers onto hardpack (not exactly TGR forum stuff, but the most I do). 5-6 would come off on slightly bad landings and sometimes in bump skiing. 7 was generally good while 8 was almost always good.

 

[Savemeasammy]

Could also be caused by snow under the boot or not having your boot in the binding right as well.

Snow under the boot is possible, too. IIRC, this is the same run you took your ski off at the top trying to clean it. It's possible that some snow stuck on (your boot)...


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[Tin]

Is it? Thought that was earlier. Lesson learned

 

[Whitey]

I’m surprised to hear on this thread, on a msg board that is mostly hard-core skiers, no one who thinks like me. I wouldn’t let a ski shop tech set my bindings if you paid me for it. Springs and hardware aren't uniform in how they act and how stiff or loose they are. My opinion is that you could have two identical bindings and they could release differently. This is especially the case as the bindings get older. To me setting the binding by the DIN setting is at best a guess on the ski shops part. Added to that is that adjusting bindings is easy, it’s 4 screws. Takes me a max of 10 minutes to set the release on a pair of bindings. I do it for most of my neighbors and their kids.

To me the only way to do bindings is to set them by feel. The toe piece is easy, all you have to do is put a boot into it, set it on edge, and then twist the boot out of the nose piece. I’ve gotten pretty good over the years at “feeling” the release and setting it appropriate to the age, size, & skill. The rear release is a little harder but still can be done and to me the rear release isn’t as important as the toe anyway.

I always have screwdrivers in my ski bag, to me that’s mandatory equipment to carry. On our first couple days of skiing of the season I keep an eye on how my boys/wife/me/friends/etc are doing. Are they popping out of their bindings too easy? Are their skis staying on in falls when they should be releasing? If so – I tweak the settings up or down accordingly right there while we are at the mountain. I usually start the season with them set a little looser that I think they should be, figuring that popping out is better than not popping out (and shredding a knee, breaking a leg, etc.). I’ve been doing this forever and I can only think of maybe 2-3 times where I had to readjust any member of my family’s or friend’s bindings.

I was talking to a guy at a ski shop a couple of years ago. They were tuning my family’s skis and he asked me for the info to set the DIN settings. I told him “don’t worry about it, I am going to adjust them once I get them home anyway”. He looked at me like I had 3 heads. I told him, “don’t take this the wrong way but I would never let my kids ski on bindings I didn’t set myself.” We then had a long debate about that. He eventually relented and agreed that the way I was doing it was right but only if it was done by someone who knew what they were doing. I would say that the barrier to “knowing what you are doing” is pretty minor with bindings. Again, it’s just 4 screws and they can only go in one of two directions.

PS – My attitude probably has a lot to do with the fact that I broke my leg 4 different times between the ages of 5 and 15 all while skiing and 3 of the 4 were directly attributable to the ski shop tech torquing my DIN settings too high and them not releasing in falls. I was always a big kid for my age back then and the techs would set the DIN too high because of that. This was the 70s too – so the equipment wasn’t nearly as good. But still. . .

 

[jack97]

I think sometimes it's possible to get a "lemon" pair of bindings. The only Rossi bindings I've ever owned were Axial 120. Single worst binding I've ever skied. Pre-released like crazy no matter how hard they were cranked down. I had them in the shop many times to get tested and the techs all thought they were fine. I eventually broke the heel piece on them.

never had the axial 120, I think that's an old binding now. I've been using the PX series, the heel section has two settings, one for the DIN and the other is for the proper amount of pressure. If the pressure setting is not right, it will pre release not matter how high you set the rear DIN. I found that out when I got new boots and had to adjust the bindings. Not sure if the old and new Axial has this feature.

 

[Not Sure]

Never had an issue with my Marker Dukes or the Fischer System binding on my Motives. I have both set at 9.[/QUOTE]

Marker Dukes 1+
What you have for a Din setting at the end of the season may not be what you have at the start of the next season
Had a set of Tyrolias in the 80's that had spring issues, kept cranking and finally gave up on them

 

[skiNEwhere]

Snow under the boot is possible, too. IIRC, this is the same run you took your ski off at the top trying to clean it. It's possible that some snow stuck on (your boot)...

When I had that huge fall at breck last year, my ski pre-released. The general consensus here was that I had some snow stuck underneath the boot from the hike up. Well after that ordeal, I took those skis (salomon guns) to the ski shop to have them check the bindings. The results came back normal. So I'm thinking there may be some truth to this. I also had my bindings on a DIN on 10, which was the max for that binding.

I've heard people say that you shouldn't set your DIN to the bindings max, but I've never seen any data to support this claim.

 

[goldsbar]

I’m surprised to hear on this thread, on a msg board that is mostly hard-core skiers, no one who thinks like me. I wouldn’t let a ski shop tech set my bindings if you paid me for it. Springs and hardware aren't uniform in how they act and how stiff or loose they are. My opinion is that you could have two identical bindings and they could release differently. This is especially the case as the bindings get older.

This is a great point. I always turn down my bindings to the minimum post season (sometimes during for skis I don't use much) and pop up the heel piece. Still, to your point, I bet even a brand new "8" isn't really a uniform "8." I've heard - on this board I believe - of some shops setting based on their testing equipment, not the actual binding marks.

 

[Bumpsis]

To me the only way to do bindings is to set them by feel. The toe piece is easy, all you have to do is put a boot into it, set it on edge, and then twist the boot out of the nose piece. I’ve gotten pretty good over the years at “feeling” the release and setting it appropriate to the age, size, & skill. The rear release is a little harder but still can be done and to me the rear release isn’t as important as the toe anyway.

I also adjust the DIN settings of my and my family's skis by "feel". To me, the amount of tension is about just right if it's just a notch above the point where I can forcibly twist out of it. I do this by first locking into the the binding, bending my knee hard (pushing forward) and trying to twist out of the toe piece while the ski is set on its edge, on a carpet. If I can twist out with some significant effort, that's pretty close to where the setting should be. I'll add just a 1/4 of turn to that.
The same for heel piece. I'll have my son step on the back of the ski while I put some effort into trying to wrangle my heel up. Again, this gives a good idea of where the tension should be.

I hardly ever pre-release and when I do come off my ski, there probably was a reason for it. The settings end up being lower than the official ones that a shop would use. I feel that I'd rather release than have the binding hold me in and mess up my knee.
As Whitney, I came to this through a rather sad experience of not being released when I should have. No broken bones but one expensive trip out west long time ago where early injury side lined me for a whole week.

 

[Edd]

I usually say I'm a type 2 many days and occasionally a 3, because I do spend a fair amount of time on ungroomed terrain. My last daily driver was set at 8. My current one is set at 6.5, which I'm not sure I'm comfortable with. This time they dismissed the occasional 3 part.

 

[Hawkshot99]

Still, to your point, I bet even a brand new "8" isn't really a uniform "8." I've heard - on this board I believe - of some shops setting based on their testing equipment, not the actual binding marks.

Just because the chart says to set the binding to a 8 does not mean that is what they are set at. Every binding that is adjusted will also be torque tested. Personaly I find this moee acurate than your "feel".
Chart calls for me to be at a 11. I ski a 10.

As a type 3 it calls for a 9.5, as a 3+ it calls for 11.

 

[Scruffy]

I’m surprised to hear on this thread, on a msg board that is mostly hard-core skiers, no one who thinks like me. I wouldn’t let a ski shop tech set my bindings if you paid me for it. Springs and hardware aren't uniform in how they act and how stiff or loose they are. My opinion is that you could have two identical bindings and they could release differently. This is especially the case as the bindings get older. To me setting the binding by the DIN setting is at best a guess on the ski shops part. Added to that is that adjusting bindings is easy, it’s 4 screws. Takes me a max of 10 minutes to set the release on a pair of bindings. I do it for most of my neighbors and their kids.

To me the only way to do bindings is to set them by feel. The toe piece is easy, all you have to do is put a boot into it, set it on edge, and then twist the boot out of the nose piece. I’ve gotten pretty good over the years at “feeling” the release and setting it appropriate to the age, size, & skill. The rear release is a little harder but still can be done and to me the rear release isn’t as important as the toe anyway.

I always have screwdrivers in my ski bag, to me that’s mandatory equipment to carry. On our first couple days of skiing of the season I keep an eye on how my boys/wife/me/friends/etc are doing. Are they popping out of their bindings too easy? Are their skis staying on in falls when they should be releasing? If so – I tweak the settings up or down accordingly right there while we are at the mountain. I usually start the season with them set a little looser that I think they should be, figuring that popping out is better than not popping out (and shredding a knee, breaking a leg, etc.). I’ve been doing this forever and I can only think of maybe 2-3 times where I had to readjust any member of my family’s or friend’s bindings.

I was talking to a guy at a ski shop a couple of years ago. They were tuning my family’s skis and he asked me for the info to set the DIN settings. I told him “don’t worry about it, I am going to adjust them once I get them home anyway”. He looked at me like I had 3 heads. I told him, “don’t take this the wrong way but I would never let my kids ski on bindings I didn’t set myself.” We then had a long debate about that. He eventually relented and agreed that the way I was doing it was right but only if it was done by someone who knew what they were doing. I would say that the barrier to “knowing what you are doing” is pretty minor with bindings. Again, it’s just 4 screws and they can only go in one of two directions.

PS – My attitude probably has a lot to do with the fact that I broke my leg 4 different times between the ages of 5 and 15 all while skiing and 3 of the 4 were directly attributable to the ski shop tech torquing my DIN settings too high and them not releasing in falls. I was always a big kid for my age back then and the techs would set the DIN too high because of that. This was the 70s too – so the equipment wasn’t nearly as good. But still. . .

I mount my own bindings, so, yeah... I hear ya.

BTW, I broke my leg in the 70's also because a ski did not release, but as you say, the equipment was not as dialed in then.

 

[Highway Star]

On the chart following the directions, I'm 9.5 at level 3, and 11 at level 3+. Level 3+ is an optional setting for advanced skiers in many tech manuals, where you go down one more row from level 3. I normally ski a 13 din, but sometimes go up to 14 or down to 12. I'll walk out of a binding at 9.5 multiple times a day, but have never really pre-released at 13, have only released from crashing.

http://www.dinsetting.com/dinchart.htm

 

[machski]

Also, while din is suppose to be a universal setting, it is really a starting point. A shop should load test a binding with the boot you ski after setting to ensure the load release matches the din setting. I have had different din settings on toe/heel and the reason was that at the different settings, the pieces load tested to the actual din the III+ called for. Never had a problem with them pre or not releasing correctly. So have a good, competent shop check and set them and get them checked at least once a season, more if you ski a ton.

 

[doublediamond]

What people fail to realize is that certified shops never go by the DIN settings. They may start at a certain desired number, but they don't give up there. And they'll tell you that point blank. Those numbers aren't written on there accurately, and with age and use of the binding, things loosen/change.

They go by how much torque it takes to cause a release. Unless you have an accurate way to test and measure that, you should never ever touch the DIN settings on your binding. It irks me that so many ski areas have screwdrivers at the base.

Trust the pros ... all of our knees are far more valuable to you than what number you can crank it to. We're talking 10s to 100s of thousands in surgery/hospital charges before you consider lost wages. Just transportation to the hospital in ski country is not cheap in and of itself. This ain't a dick measuring contest.

And as others have alluded to here, most pre-releases are caused by user error: snow, improper technique, not in the binding correctly, etc.

 

[mishka]

Trust the pros====> what make them pros? Because somebody work in the shop and has been "certified" doesn't make them pro. The only difference if job done wrong you can blame somebody else, demand a refund or take them to the court

To adjust the binding need simple skill, simple tool and a lot of common sense.

How about changing tires? change oil in your car by yourself? I don't even want to mention change breaks.