Tin
Active member
Bigger lifts or HS lifts would ruin the place imo. They are not bad for Sterling but it's a long haul to ski Madonna.
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Smugglers Notch lift opinions
- Thread starter Tin
- Start date
Bigger lifts or HS lifts would ruin the place imo. They are not bad for Sterling but it's a long haul to ski Madonna.
steamboat1
New member
Yeah so they say. Do I believe it? Nope.
ss20
Well-known member
Madonna would be perfect for a high-speed double.
steamboat1
New member
And MRG would be perfect for a High Speed Detachable single...:smile:
With a detach mid station of course.
Top of Madonna is too exposed and windy for a detachable chair.
Only upgrade I'd ever want to see on Madonna is maybe a fixed grip triple. A touch more capacity and having a singles line would be nice.
The long ride on Madonna has never bothered me. Probably because it goes over one of the top 5 trails in New England.
Only upgrade I'd ever want to see on Madonna is maybe a fixed grip triple. A touch more capacity and having a singles line would be nice.
The long ride on Madonna has never bothered me. Probably because it goes over one of the top 5 trails in New England.
BenedictGomez
Well-known member
I know this has been covered repeatedly, but I'm just not buying this. This, IMO, has always been used as the excuse and the "cover", but I ski there quite a bit, and M-F there are no crowds, a quicker trip would be nice.
Saturday the lines are getting horrific, and I'm not buying the, "more people would get too crowded" logic, because frankly even on the big crowd days the trails are relatively empty. Capacity NEEDS to be increased at Smuggler's Notch, and you'd hardly notice it.
Jully
Active member
They just really don't want to lose that empty feeling on a crowded Saturday. The conditions of the trails might not take that much, but twice as many people on the trails would definitely be noticed.
BenedictGomez
Well-known member
You dont have to go 2x, even 1.5x would be a godsend. The only place it might even be noticeable is right when you get off Madonna, because there's only two immediate routes down (3 technically, but only 1% of people ski Liftline), but I dont think juicing it to 1.5x would be an issue.
I think it is purely a cost issue. The install of a HSQ is several million dollars; and the operations require more electricity, more staff, and more maintenance.
steamboat1
New member
Killington only has only one immediate route & they have an 8 passenger gondola unloading onto it. How many ski Catwalk or upper Cascade/Downdraft? There's no excuse for Smuggs to not have a better main lift. They can't even give the kiddies a HSQ on Morse & that's not exactly a short lift either. Smuggs doesn't put any money into the mountain & that includes snowmaking. If you like clowns in the base lodge then Smuggs is for you.
There is absolutely zero comparison in trail capacity between K and their gondola and what's off the top of Madonna. Zero.
Lots of snowmaking improvements at Smuggs this past winter.
Lots of snowmaking improvements at Smuggs this past winter.
steamboat1
New member
How's that?
One way as opposed to two.
60% snowmaking coverage.
Does Wildcat have a problem running a HSQ on one of the windiest mountains in New England?
There is no excuse except for no investment.
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Chilcoot and Drifter are narrow trails that go for half a mile at least before splitting off to other significant options. The trail off of the Gondola at K is wider and runs into multiple trails within a very short distance. It's essentially a feeder trail to the Canyon Area, South Ridge, North Ridge.
The carrying capacity of the trails off the top of Madonna is maybe 25% what it is on K peak.
The good thing is you can just keep on skiing K if that's what you like. Pretty obvious pattern with you steamboat; crap on one ski area, sing the praises of Killington, wash, rinse, repeat. Smuggs isn't missing your business, nor Hunter, Magic, Burke etc. As you saw in the Hunter thread, nobody really cares to read your piss poor attitude either.
The carrying capacity of the trails off the top of Madonna is maybe 25% what it is on K peak.
The good thing is you can just keep on skiing K if that's what you like. Pretty obvious pattern with you steamboat; crap on one ski area, sing the praises of Killington, wash, rinse, repeat. Smuggs isn't missing your business, nor Hunter, Magic, Burke etc. As you saw in the Hunter thread, nobody really cares to read your piss poor attitude either.
Jully
Active member
Wildcat's trails do get skied off really quickly up top. I've had countless discussions with people about how wildcat needs more trail capacity up top.
Absolutely the case at Wildcat with their high speed lift. Love the lift, but it hammers the top. It would be even worse at Smuggs. Best thing that could happen at Wildcat would be another trail cut between Lynx and Polecat. A reasonably wide blue to chew up skier traffic.
BenedictGomez
Well-known member
Agreed. I'm fairly confident it's 90% about money, maybe more.
That said, with regard to current ownership, it might well be a "be careful what you wish for" sort of a thing, because I love Smuggler's Notch, and to put it gently, ownership isnt that young. I fully expect an ownership change within the next decade, and god forbid it it gets sold to an entity like SKIS or MTN who starts building 4-star restaurants, doubles parking, bubble quads everywhere, and every square inch of viewable space gets branded.....well....I'll cry. I'll take the decrepit lifts and dime store on-mountin "entertainment" (which can be embarrassing if you're well familiar and know what I mean) any day over that.
ss20
Well-known member
Does Smuggler's still advertise that "new" base village at Morse? Stayed in a condo there a few years ago... felt more like a lower-class apartment. Lots and lots of concrete. Food there was extremely "meh". Getting to Madonna was an absolute PITA. The shuttle was quicker than taking one of the Morse lifts and then traversing over to M1.
It was crappy conditions with little natural open but I was able to see what all the hubub was about on Madonna. I can also see that management doesn't invest any money into their on-or-off-mountain product. But considering what's on the other side of the Notch I don't know if that's good or bad. But like the skier's we are, we'll clench our teeth as we go through the two worlds that are Smuggler's and Stowe, until we get on the mountain, where the Promised Land awaits.
It was crappy conditions with little natural open but I was able to see what all the hubub was about on Madonna. I can also see that management doesn't invest any money into their on-or-off-mountain product. But considering what's on the other side of the Notch I don't know if that's good or bad. But like the skier's we are, we'll clench our teeth as we go through the two worlds that are Smuggler's and Stowe, until we get on the mountain, where the Promised Land awaits.
steamboat1
New member
Explain to be how I was praising Killington. I wouldn't exactly call saying an 8 passenger gondola empties onto a single trail giving it praise. If you prefer ski areas with all old slow Hall double chairs that's your prerogative. My opinion happens to differ. Besides I thought you were supposed to be a moderator on this site not a shit stirrer.
Not a shit stirrer. Just calling it like I see it. You've got a crappy attitude.
BenedictGomez
Well-known member
The shuttle still is quicker, but that's a function of how close Morse & Madonna are. I dont think it's a big deal to take the lift up Morse and ski to Madonna I/II when I'm slopeside.
Food at Smuggs is still somewhat "meh" as you say, mostly due to lack of options. Green Tomatoes is very good food for lunch though, I'd recommend that, but the on-mountain apres ski restaurant food is just okay. The Morse Grill restaurant's decent. Not bad, not stellar. I've never eaten at the Smuggs' pizza parlor, because I'm from New Jersey. And I've never actually eaten in the "high-end" on-mountain Smuggs restaurant (Hearth & Candle) either, because the prices were like Manhattan, which I think is stupid, and the fact I thought it might be "high-risk" so to speak. When I'm staying at Smuggs and want a very nice meal, I go to 158 Main. Very good food.
The newest condos are higher up the hill you go on Morse, they're not bad at all. The base inventory is the oldest, and some of the "non-repairs" are penny-wise and pound foolish. Actually, I'd classify some of them as completely ridiculous. For instance, in the Hakone building, the stairwell carpets are worn out so bad in spots it reaches the concrete. EVERYONE staying in that building will see that. So that's a cheap repair and it's on management. Not that I give a ratz azz, I'm there to ski. Just as long as the obvious spendthrift lack of repairs doesnt include the lifts, I'm happy.
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