i dont know if there was a loan involved but they took the eb5 money, tens of millions, and transferred it to the previous owner to close on the jay deal.
-
Welcome to AlpineZone, the largest online community of skiers and snowboarders in the Northeast!
You may have to REGISTER before you can post. Registering is FREE, gets rid of the majority of advertisements, and lets you participate in giveaways and other AlpineZone events!
Stenger and Quiros Ousted from Management of Jay Peak and Burke
- Thread starter thetrailboss
- Start date
i dont know if there was a loan involved but they took the eb5 money, tens of millions, and transferred it to the previous owner to close on the jay deal.
VTKilarney
Well-known member
Most people who engage in fraud don't tell their victims that they are being defrauded. They also don't like to leave evidence where people can see it.
Nope. There is nothing that I have seen that should have raised red flags with the bank. It's not like it was paid for in cash with cocaine residue.
The complaint makes it quite clear that the shit began hitting the fan before this season began.
BenedictGomez
Well-known member
Most likely, but Ponzi schemes typically end when you hit a patch of economic hardship. Same with Madoff.
Eventually the wheels would have come off this thing relatively soon, because Quiros was pilfering way too much money, relatively speaking. Whereas Madoff was an evil genius, Quiros was an evil idiot.
How would the investors know? they dont get the bank statements. who knows what they got from Stenger/Q.
the money was transferred from the bank it was in under the previous owners of Jay, to a financial company where the broker was Q's former son in law. They also placed the money into margin accounts, so they borrowed off the collateral of the investors funds.
There is an indication in the complaint that the broker at raymond james, Q's ex son in law, was aware of the fraud. Before the money was transferred from the bank under the control of the previous owner, their lawyer advised and the broker acknowledged that the funds were not to be used for the purchase of jay. within days though, the money was in fact, transferred into new accounts and then subsequently used to satisfy the sale obligation.
VTKilarney
Well-known member
But none of that attaches to the bank that took the money for payment on the loan.
Yeah, sorry Jay skiers. The money for the Bonnie Six Pack had to pay for Daddy's new pad at Trump Place in New York City. Better luck next time.
VTKilarney
Well-known member
Here is the apartment that Quiros purchased. I am surprised that it took over two months to close. Moving money around all sorts of shell companies must take time.
http://therealdeal.com/2013/08/13/ilan-bracha-takes-two-years-to-sell-trump-place-abode/
http://therealdeal.com/2013/08/13/ilan-bracha-takes-two-years-to-sell-trump-place-abode/
VTKilarney
Well-known member
Sorry, Newport.
.
.
amf
Member
Yep, I think that Newport hole will stick around for awhile.
Zermatt
Active member
Nobody seems to be focusing on how this is going to play out....Jay Peak is done! The assets have been put into receivership by the federal government with the sole purpose of getting the investors money back. Nobody knows how that will effect day to day operations of the resort. I can paint a scenario that is not good.
Jay Peak has no credit right now, they have no access to money. People don't work for free for very long. That is one issue.
Nobody is going to give Jay Peak any money to hold. For example, season pass purchases, deposits for stays, etc. Confidence among the consumers will dry up rapidly.
This was not a normal financial default allowing for an orderly transition of ownership. Investors' money was stollen and now the SEC has seized whatever they can to try to get it back.
Maybe I'm wrong, does anybody have an example of another ski resort that has been seized by the SEC in the past?
Jay Peak has no credit right now, they have no access to money. People don't work for free for very long. That is one issue.
Nobody is going to give Jay Peak any money to hold. For example, season pass purchases, deposits for stays, etc. Confidence among the consumers will dry up rapidly.
This was not a normal financial default allowing for an orderly transition of ownership. Investors' money was stollen and now the SEC has seized whatever they can to try to get it back.
Maybe I'm wrong, does anybody have an example of another ski resort that has been seized by the SEC in the past?
Jully
Active member
No knowledge of a resort being seized. However, if Jay really does completely run out of cash, I'm sure there would be some operator agreement that could be made. It's not like Jay is going to sit idle for a season.
eatskisleep
Well-known member
- Joined
- Dec 23, 2003
- Messages
- 1,584
- Points
- 83
So... about that Jay Peak expansion...
abc
Well-known member
actually, it did raised red flag with investor
last year, CBS 60 Minute did a program about it. An investor from Scotland was interviewed. that was his suspicion, where did the money gone?
I bet he and other investor got the attention of the SEC.
P.s.
I got the impfression many in the industry thought these EB-5 investors are so rich they don't care about the return of their investment as long as they got their green card. I suspect some ARE. Problem is, there're others a bit more naive. They thought they can move to the US and grow their investment in the US!
Last edited:
Zermatt
Active member
Why would it continue to run? The investors want their money back and all of Jay Peak's assets are tainted.
Obviously, the best way to get all your money back is through an orderly sale or continued operation of the resorts, but no guarantee they will wait around for that to happen.
Obviously, the best way to get all your money back is through an orderly sale or continued operation of the resorts, but no guarantee they will wait around for that to happen.
UVSHTSTRM
New member
- Joined
- Sep 3, 2009
- Messages
- 879
- Points
- 0
I am really not all that shocked with today's announcement. What I am surprised at is that no government agency heads have rolled yet? Here is a list of things that leave me wondering.
1) Is EB-5 considered state and or federal money, if so how did PeakCM get all of these no bid contracts?
2) Is PeakCM in bed with Quiros or Stenger and then had a falling out?
3) How did the state let this go on for 8 years? Heck the purchase ($625,000) and sale ($7m) of the land in Newport (I think it was Newport). How did that not raise any red flags? This was well known for a few years.
4) How did the state not even attempt to follow the money or better yet, why wasn't the state paying the bills when needed vs. paying Quiros/Stenger and leaving them to toss the money around?
5) Will Peter Slumin' and others be forced to release their emails? I am really curious to see how far this scam went?
1) Is EB-5 considered state and or federal money, if so how did PeakCM get all of these no bid contracts?
2) Is PeakCM in bed with Quiros or Stenger and then had a falling out?
3) How did the state let this go on for 8 years? Heck the purchase ($625,000) and sale ($7m) of the land in Newport (I think it was Newport). How did that not raise any red flags? This was well known for a few years.
4) How did the state not even attempt to follow the money or better yet, why wasn't the state paying the bills when needed vs. paying Quiros/Stenger and leaving them to toss the money around?
5) Will Peter Slumin' and others be forced to release their emails? I am really curious to see how far this scam went?
Zermatt
Active member
According to the government presentation today they will not face "jail time" only civil penalties.
VTKilarney
Well-known member
And if they don't wait around for that to happen they get $0. You are being overly pessimistic. Anything will sell for the right price.
Zermatt
Active member
Agreed, I just watched some of the presentation. Seems like there could be a way out where day to day operations continue.
