The Big Dig....

[Charlie Schuessler]

This Sunday's Boston Globe ran a good article explaining the process of "What-Went-Wrong" with the tunnel....

It seems pretty simple to understand, they built a tunnel knowing poor workmanship would undermine the design. It appears that the jurisdictional authority dropped the ball on Quality Control, and nobody will get blamed (except some blue collar workers by reports of drinking on the job), and the taxpayer gets to pay for a relining job worth $GBILLIONS…

Talk about RISK MANAGEMENT? This is going to be fun to follow, I may to re-up on Engineering News Record just to follow the Engineering & Shop Drawing "misinterpretations" of the pending lawsuits...

I believe that for the next 20-30 years we are going to watch some of the best legal minds that industry can afford…earning their pay wriggling wrong-from-right & right-from-wrong…

What do you think?

 

[MtnMagic]

Some call it incompetence.

Others call it "job security !"

Yeah great QC. Let's fix all the problems with the taxpayers $$!

Charlie, I think you hit the nail right on the head !!
_________________
Two thumbs up !!!
:wink:

 

[smitty77]

It appears that the jurisdictional authority dropped the ball on Quality Control, and nobody will get blamed (except some blue collar workers by reports of drinking on the job), and the taxpayer gets to pay for a relining job worth $GBILLIONS…

As someone who earns his paycheck as a QC Engineer for a constuction firm, this hits a little close to home. What gets me is the big shift toward contractor-run QC with state-run quality assurance was supposed to eliminate this kind of mess.

From what I understand the contractor, through his own quality control testing mandated by the Mass Turnpike Authority (MTA), found there were problems with the wall during construction. These problems were reported to the MTA, but were apparently ignored in favor of getting the tunnel opened as soon as possible. As far as I'm concerned, Matt Amorello (head of the MTA) should be fired. The whole MTA should be dissolved. The agency knew about the problems and yet chose to do nothing, in the end costing the public money. It's been the same story over and over since the beginning. It's a shame that such a magnificent feat of civil engineering has to be scarred by the inept handling and oversight of public officials.

I know contracts can be complicated documents, and the contractor may have obligations I am not aware of, but I think the contractor (Bechtel-Parsons) won't be held liable for this one.

My $0.02.
Smitty

 

[SilentCal]

If what Smitty says is correct that guy should not be fired. He should have to stick his finger in a leak for the next twenty years. The MTA is a shame. When the Turnpike was built the MTA said the toll booths would remain for some to pay for the highway and then be removed. They are still there. In Western Mass the last six exits are free but they still give you a ticket at the toll-booth and you don't have to pay if you stay within those six exits. How cosmically stupid is that. Why not remove the six and make one giant exit right after the Palmer exit. The MTA should be dissolved and it's higher up-s be forced to pick up trash along the Pike.

 

[MtnMagic]

Also, when the Callahan Tunnel to East Boston and the Mystic River Bridge connecting the new elevated Route 1 to the North Shore with Boston and beyond to Maine were built, the MTA promised the public tolls would end after the cost of the projects were collected. Then a big story how the revenue would help the state build and maintain it's roads. Of course it does. But why promise the citizens tolls would be temporary. Another broken promise!

 

[Charlie Schuessler]

...It's a shame that such a magnificent feat of civil engineering has to be scarred by the inept handling and oversight of public officials...

My feelings exactly, thank you for the graceful manner you phrased it.

 

[Stephen]

But why promise the citizens tolls would be temporary. Another broken promise!

You Mass people never learn! There is NO such thing as a temporary tax or toll. That's why we scream bloody murder up here in NH whenever it comes up. Sales tax wil not replace property taxes. They promise that if we incorporate a sales tax, the property taxes will go down.

As Mary Poppins said, that's a pie-crust promise; easily made, easily broken. Why give up one source of income when you can have two?

-Stephen

 

[smitty77]

...It's a shame that such a magnificent feat of civil engineering has to be scarred by the inept handling and oversight of public officials...

My feelings exactly, thank you for the graceful manner you phrased it.

As a budding civil engineer (hopefully taking my professional exam next spring) it pains me to watch my profession get bashed in the media. It's one thing if poor enginerring is to blame. It's quite another when a puplic agency shows such irresponsibility for the project management and blatant disregard for taxpayer's money, and then tries to pin it on the contractor.

Sickening...

Smitty

 

[jjmcgo]

Engineers are smart

Don't worry, Smitty77, from what I've read, the engineers covered their asses all along with memos that the Mass. officials didn't read or ignored. It's all on the political hacks. Of course, it won't bother the unions if they're blamed. They're the ones getting paid to fix what they screwed up!
I've been having fun with my Bush-Cheney-hating friends. When they go all ballistic about Halliburton as the general contractor in Iraq, I ask them who would you choose instead? Brown and Root is now part of Halliburton. I think Cabot, Cabot and Forbes is too.
As far as I know, the choice is Halliburton or Bechtel. Nice job Bechtel did in Boston, eh?

 

[jjmcgo]

Engineers are smart

Don't worry, Smitty77, from what I've read, the engineers covered their asses all along with memos that the Mass. officials didn't read or ignored. It's all on the political hacks. Of course, it won't bother the unions if they're blamed. They're the ones getting paid to fix what they screwed up!
I've been having fun with my Bush-Cheney-hating friends. When they go all ballistic about Halliburton as the general contractor in Iraq, I ask them who would you choose instead? Brown and Root is now part of Halliburton. I think Cabot, Cabot and Forbes is too.
As far as I know, the choice is Halliburton or Bechtel. Nice job Bechtel did in Boston, eh?

 

[Charlie Schuessler]

Engineer Drops Big Dig Safety Claim

The Boston Globe reported today that the Investigating Engineer Jack Lemley has changed his opinion about public safety driving through the Rte-93 tunnels. He has reversed his opinion from "no reason to believe the public was at risk" to "has reasons to believe the public is at risk."

The report states that there are more than 40-large sections of the tunnel have been compromised by the leaking conditions previously reported. And that he discovered officials have no formal plan to correct the leaks.

In addition the report states that project officials have block the investigator from obtaining records and data related to those issues.

The Governor's Office reponse of "clearly cause for concern" seems a bit understated.

The plot continues to thicken.....

 

[ctenidae]

My question is, what happens if they close the tunnel down for repairs? There's no way to get through anymore. Can you imagine all that traffic winding through downtown?

Bechtel didn't do the best job, clearly. Didn't they get fired already, though? The MTA is, like every other government or quasi-government agency in Mass, as crooked as a dog's back leg. This is not at all the first slimey event they've been wrapped up in.

 

[bigbog]

...It's a shame that such a magnificent feat of civil engineering has to be scarred by the inept handling and oversight of public officials...

Same old problems of *corruption happens at the top...the rest of the people just try to do their job as best they can* Smitty...

 

[thetrailboss]

From what little I've actually processed of it all (I'm trying to ignore it really...) sounds like we have

• a. An enormous project with lots of potential for error.
  
  b. Some "experimental" design work in the slurry walls that did not quite work.
  
  c. A few pompous officials who did not want to admit mistake (we'd probably all do the same).
  
  d. Contractors and construction workers who, for 'job security,' could have done a shoddy job.

Not defending them, and not to be cynical, but I'm not really surprised that there is "trouble in paradise" :wink:

 

[smitty77]

Not defending them, and not to be cynical, but I'm not really surprised that there is "trouble in paradise" :wink:

I'm not suprised either. I knew it would be a long, wasteful project that really would not solve any traffic problems when it was finished. But to have a tunnel that is unsafe and no sure plans to fix it, really does suprise me. Were they just going to let everyone use the thing and pray that nothing catastrophic happens? If it's really as bad as the consulting engineer says, I envision crippling gridlock in the city of Boston for 20 or more years when parts or all of that tunnel is put out of service. Makes me glad I live 70 or 80 miles to the west.

 

[thetrailboss]

If it's really as bad as the consulting engineer says, I envision crippling gridlock in the city of Boston for 20 or more years when parts or all of that tunnel is put out of service. Makes me glad I live 70 or 80 miles to the west.

Makes me glad I'm getting the he$% out of here soon!

 

[ctenidae]

Crippling gridlock for 20 years? So, business as usual, huh? "Business as usual" also covers greed, graft, shoddy workmanship, and corruption.
This state amazes me on a regular basis, and that's saying something- I'm from the South.

 

[smitty77]

The MTA is, like every other government or quasi-government agency in Mass, as crooked as a dog's back leg. This is not at all the first slimey event they've been wrapped up in.

If anyone can get rid of he MTA, Romney can. He's already rid us of the redundant MDC (since merged with the newly named DCR), and the MTA has been high on his list since he took office. It's nice to finally see someone on Beacon Hill trying to stop the waste.

I just hope the SJC rules that he has the power to can MTA officials. Once they go, it will open the door for a merger with MassHighway, where Mitt can then focus on trimming the waste in that organization. Of course all of this may come to an end when he wins the White House in 2008 in an upset over Hillary.

 

[ctenidae]

I agree, smitty- if anyone can get authority over the MTA, it'll be great. I worry, though, about "cutting waste" going teh wrong way- One of the things the ex-MDC is looking at is closing most of the ice rinks. Not a good thing.

 

[Charlie Schuessler]

Today's Boston Globe is reporting the Big Dig Tunnel System operated by the Mass Turnpike Authority (MTA) is pumping a million gallons of water a month into the Deer Island Wastewater Treatment plant, exceeding their authorized permit amount 35,000 gals/month. The Treatment Plant is operated by the Mass. Water Resource Authority (MWRA) and to resolve this issue they suggest that the tunnel water (which is not polluted according to MWRA officials) should be pumped into the Fort Point Channel [and thus out to the Harbor and onto the Beaches of Cape Cod & the Islands].

If this wasn't really happening, I believe it would make an obtuse science fiction thriller that could include murder, Bogota drug money laundering, hidden Russian Nuclear warheads, discovery of Jimmy Hoffa’s body, suspect relationships between elected officials, bureaucrats, a Contractor’s spouse or two and some cross-dressing strippers on a charter Cruise Boat…

As one of my boy-hood hero’s would say, "its deja-vu all over again…"