When do you think Vail Resorts will expand to the east?

[Jully]

I think Nashoba is way too small to tip the scales for many people. It would for some, but most people would still be looking for another EC pass product. Not to sound snobbish, but unless I lived within 20 minutes of Nashoba, I wouldn't bother skiing there and even at that maybe only a few night sessions a season.
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Funny enough I grew up 15 minutes from nashoba and have literally not been since I was 6. I don't think it's snobbish at all.

I actually thought about Ragged or Sunapee and agree that would also work. Maybe you're right about nashoba, the average skier there might not have the scales tipped. I was thinking that there might be a number of double passholders at Nashoba who, with the Epic pass available would not buy the second pass and would instead go out west.

I know nothing about nashoba passholders though, so I could be completely wrong.

 

[snoseek]

Interesting. I've been to Vail, (and its satellite Epic Resorts in Colorado) and I'm not saying I didn't like them but I was always biased toward Aspen. OTH they pretty much started these "Pass Wars" of which I feel I'm getting to take advantage of with the Max Pass. The only Vail Resort I really want to ski with any consistency is Arapahoe and I can Liftopia that if need be. Otherwise Copper and Winter Park are the equal to Breck and Keystone IMHO. Can't speak of the Tahoe Resorts, but I don't see them coming east.

Alex

Lake Hopatcong, NJ

Abasin isn't owned by Vail but just on their pass. I would personally love to see them break off from Vail but its prolly a sweet deal for them. For Vail they get a nice steep resort on their portfolio. I feel like this is the main reason they swiped up Kirkwood also.

I can't speak for the other resorts but the tahoe resorts are pretty underfunded and really need a shot in the arm as far as infrastructure goes. We were all super pissed when that connector gondy at park city went in while everything locally on the south side is janky.

 

[WWF-VT]

Many people are saying that the exit strategy for the investors at Magic Mountain is to be acquired by Vail Resorts. It's just a matter of time before Magic goes completely corporate and is an eastern outpost of the Vail empire.

 

[4aprice]

Abasin isn't owned by Vail but just on their pass. I would personally love to see them break off from Vail but its prolly a sweet deal for them. For Vail they get a nice steep resort on their portfolio. I feel like this is the main reason they swiped up Kirkwood also.

I can't speak for the other resorts but the tahoe resorts are pretty underfunded and really need a shot in the arm as far as infrastructure goes. We were all super pissed when that connector gondy at park city went in while everything locally on the south side is janky.

You just hit on another thing that a minus for me with the Epic Pass and that's its Utah choices. Where we stay is up front by BCC and LCC so Park City/Canyons is a 2nd tier option for us. Right now its Max Pass or Mountain Collective. Since I'm still on the east coast (for the time being) Max takes it. Adding something like Sugarbush, to the Mountain Collective and I might reconsider.

Alex

Lake Hopatcong, NJ

 

[4aprice]

Many people are saying that the exit strategy for the investors at Magic Mountain is to be acquired by Vail Resorts. It's just a matter of time before Magic goes completely corporate and is an eastern outpost of the Vail empire.

I'll be waiting to see that happen.

Alex

Lake Hopatcong, NJ

 

[snoseek]

Also real quick in ill add working for Vail overall for me was a good experience. The pay was definitely lower than it should have been but in my little world everyone was really appreciative if you put in hard work and i at no point considered it a bad place to work. My bosses knew why we were all there so they made the best attempt to treat us with respect as year to year turnover is awful. I treated my staff the same way. We all got nice long ride breaks daily and were fairly empowered to help create a solid experience for guest.

I worked a similar job for ASC back in the day and my job the last few winters was soooo much nicer and also more fun.

 

[machski]

I'll be waiting to see that happen.

Alex

Lake Hopatcong, NJ

No way that happens. Too much competition in the local area, facilities no where up to the standard Vail would want requiring too much $$ up front without a solid ROI chance. I do not see Vail in the Northeast anytime soon if ever.

 

[deadheadskier]

Funny enough I grew up 15 minutes from nashoba and have literally not been since I was 6. I don't think it's snobbish at all.

I actually thought about Ragged or Sunapee and agree that would also work. Maybe you're right about nashoba, the average skier there might not have the scales tipped. I was thinking that there might be a number of double passholders at Nashoba who, with the Epic pass available would not buy the second pass and would instead go out west.

I know nothing about nashoba passholders though, so I could be completely wrong.

I suppose the other way of looking at it (which I wasn't) is that if Vail bought Nashoba, they're probably guaranteed any Western trip visits from those who already ski Nashoba. It would be a good play for those who buy Nashoba passes either way, but likely wouldn't encourage that many new Nashoba skiers.

I was mainly thinking ad Nashoba as the incentive to buy the Epic Pass. It wouldn't be for me, but something like Ragged would be

 

[dlague]

Maybe im being a little harsh....
But really if you are looking for competition in the length of season out of them its not happening. Despite everyone thinking they have deep pockets remember they are only willing to invest in the actual mountains if it is a guaranteed roi. ...in vails ideal world there's massive slope congestion with traffic police everywhere and employees are generally paid lower than industry standard....straight up through MGMT not just the unskilled folks. Those cheap epic passes are awesome but come with a price.

Don't get me wrong they are great at what they do, im just not a huge fan overall of what that is.

The ski industry is littered with low paying jobs. I talked to some classmates that work for Jay Peak and they too are paid fairly low wages. And it is not just at Jay. Ski instructor in many places are paid barely over minimum wage and go with out pay if they do not provide a lesson. Yes there are perks with these jobs like % of gear, season pass etc. but still over all low wages in many places. Pats Peak make sure many employees do not go over 20 hours and absolutely avoid full-time is they can.

All in all it is not unique to Vail.

 

[dlague]

Now that I think about it more - Balsams might be the deal! Les will build it up then Vail swoops in! Just build out the Berlin or Errol airports and voila!

 

[snoseek]

You are correct but I do know alot of people that switched over to other resorts locally, did the same sorta work and gave themselves a nice pay raise.

 

[skifree]

Many people are saying that the exit strategy for the investors at Magic Mountain is to be acquired by Vail Resorts. It's just a matter of time before Magic goes completely corporate and is an eastern outpost of the Vail empire.

Hilarious. I just choked on my Chex mix.

 

[canobie#1]

I'd love to see them take over the Killington Resort.

 

[FBGM]

Got to wear knee high boots in here to step through all the bullshit you people say. Lot of people talking like they sit at the head table of ski area operations when they really are just Joey from Hoboken

 

[snoseek]

Got to wear knee high boots in here to step through all the bullshit you people say. Lot of people talking like they sit at the head table of ski area operations when they really are just Joey from Hoboken

This is sorta what we do in here to pass the time till ski season.....


Anyhow what about Peak resorts? If they ever failed I would see that as a good way to enter the eastern market.

 

[deadheadskier]

As long as Vail didn't shorten the season at Wildcat, I'd be all for it. Maybe they'd fix the remaining snowmaking issues including expanding the pond.

 

[dlague]

Got to wear knee high boots in here to step through all the bullshit you people say. Lot of people talking like they sit at the head table of ski area operations when they really are just Joey from Hoboken

Not sure where you are going with that but, I have worked at two ski areas in the northeast - making snow (barely over minimum wage) and trail clearing asleep barely over minimum wage at the same ski area, albeit blue collar work. Later as a ski instructor at another - basically minimum wage when you had a lesson. Unpaid when waiting. While at both I spoke to many people that I worked with that were barely making it. I am not complaining that was fine where I was at in my life at the time - I was more concerned about the season pass.

 

[thetrailboss]

As said, I just don't see them doing it at all. The east is not in their business model and, to be honest, they don't have to. I spoke with an attorney who recently represented Vail and he was saying that Vail brags about how many New Yorkers have Epic passes because for them they go out to Vail for two weeks and it pays for itself.

 

[Jully]

Jesus. Pays for itself is an interesting phrase to use when you're out at Vail for 2 weeks haha

 

[Quietman]

While at both I spoke to many people that I worked with that were barely making it. I am not complaining that was fine where I was at in my life at the time - I was more concerned about the season pass.

100% true. I did the same for 4 years recently, and while I had a full time job, running a lift on weekends in the winter got me out of the house, gave me exercise, provided some extra cash, and yes FREE SKIING! There we some good full time workers, but also many that were there because they had no other choice and acted that way. Every year, attrition was steep and it was a real struggle to keep enough employees to cover Feb vacation week.

That being said dlague, your comment about 20 hours per week at Pat's confuses me. Ski area workers are 90% seasonal and in NH seasonal workers don't get overtime or benefits no matter how many hours are worked.