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Year Round Indoor Ski Park Coming to Jersey Next Year?

cdskier

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This will be a little different than other malls in a sense that 55% will be dedicated to entertainment and food. As far as the number of visits, their other malls pull in 30 to 40 million visits a year. As far as parking, you can't just look at the total number of spaces available. A single parking space at a mall may be used by multiple visitors. Most people do not hang at the mall from opening to closing.

How much competition does Mall of America have around it vs the amount of competition in NJ for both retail and entertainment? And I already mentioned that it is different than simply a traditional mall and that's why I added in entertainment-related comparisons as well.
 

cdskier

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Does it spiral down those 12 stories?

No, but based on one of the renderings on their website it will have moguls on part of it!

Any bets on how much they will charge for the excitement of skiing an 800' long trail covering less than 200' of vertical?
 

Domeskier

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Powder Ridge in CT charges $24 to ski down their plastic Astra-turf material. I would guess this has to be more. $50?
That would be my guess, too. For a 4 hour session, probably. Which I'd be more than willing to pay if they seed some moguls. If they don't, I'll probably pass.
 

skiur

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If it ever opens I would have to go at least once for the novelty of it. I think 4 hours would be a bit long though, 200 very would get boring quick enough with or without bumps. Would be kinda nice during a week like this when it is 95+ out to cool off while making some turns in July.
 

Domeskier

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I think 4 hours would be a bit long though, 200 very would get boring quick enough with or without bumps.

For me, 4 hours of dome-skiing felt long without bumps. With bumps, it felt too short. I might be atypical, but I hope not so much so that they don't see a demand for moguls there.
 

BenedictGomez

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they think that this new mall/entertainment venue will somehow pull in more visitors a year than the current most popular mall in NJ and Disney World combined?

Of COURSE they dont. They just needed to SAY that to make the numbers work to get the corrupt thing built & opened.

This entire thing was a massive scam from the start, taking place (of course) in one of the most politically crooked states in America.
 

benski

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Of COURSE they dont. They just needed to SAY that to make the numbers work to get the corrupt thing built & opened.

This entire thing was a massive scam from the start, taking place (of course) in one of the most politically crooked states in America.

Is it publicly funded? I feel like putting the worlds ugliest building on the side of a busy highway is a great way to kill support.

As with the parking, I think the stadium and the mall share a parking lot and the mall will close for games, otherwise what a waist. I think the mall will suck up a lot off there air from other nearby malls and possibly close some of them but I don’t know much about those malls.
 

mbedle

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How much competition does Mall of America have around it vs the amount of competition in NJ for both retail and entertainment? And I already mentioned that it is different than simply a traditional mall and that's why I added in entertainment-related comparisons as well.

I don't think it is reasonable to compare this place to places like Disney Land or the Garden State Plaza. People go to Disney Land for only entertainment and people go to the Garden State Plaza to basically only shop. People are going to go to this place to visit a doctor in urgent care, workout, go to the spa, see a movie, ride a roller coster, ski, ice skate, swim, attend a work convention, stay at the hotel for the football game, shop, go out to dinner, see a concert, etc. It's for that reason that I don't think the projected numbers are unreachable. I did read that they are actually building a second one down in Miami.
 

mbedle

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Also, I forgot to add go to the aquarium, bowling, ride the largest Farris wheel in north American and take a vacation (believe or not!!!).
 

cdskier

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I don't think it is reasonable to compare this place to places like Disney Land or the Garden State Plaza. People go to Disney Land for only entertainment and people go to the Garden State Plaza to basically only shop. People are going to go to this place to visit a doctor in urgent care, workout, go to the spa, see a movie, ride a roller coster, ski, ice skate, swim, attend a work convention, stay at the hotel for the football game, shop, go out to dinner, see a concert, etc. It's for that reason that I don't think the projected numbers are unreachable. I did read that they are actually building a second one down in Miami.

I didn't compare them directly. In a sense to hit the numbers they project they would need to be the #1 draw in this area for each of those items that you mentioned. It makes 0 logical sense that that would ever happen. Just because you put a bunch of different things all under one roof doesn't mean the new collective entity is going to be more popular than all the individual pieces combined. This is an over-saturated market already. It really seems like they realized they had no chance of hitting the original numbers so just started throwing tons of random ideas out there hoping that a few of them would be successful in bringing in people.

Is it publicly funded? I feel like putting the worlds ugliest building on the side of a busy highway is a great way to kill support.

As with the parking, I think the stadium and the mall share a parking lot and the mall will close for games, otherwise what a waist. I think the mall will suck up a lot off there air from other nearby malls and possibly close some of them but I don’t know much about those malls.

It is built on state-owned land and received considerable amount of public assistance (hundreds of millions in tax breaks, over a billion in government bonds, etc). One of the major political advocates for it was also found guilty of federal bribery and fraud charges in 2015 (although the one charge directly related to the project itself he wasn't convicted of, but should have been).

Not sure how you can say you think it will suck people away from other nearby malls and close some of them when you admit that you know nothing about them. The retail portion of American Dream is targeting a luxury high-end experience. (Even the renderings on their website show people walking around dressed in suits and dresses and all sorts of high-end designer clothes). That doesn't fit the demographic of people that shop at most of the other malls in this area. I also don't see the target demographic for American Dream saying "Let's dress up and go out to that place in the swamplands of Jersey tonight."
 
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I didn't compare them directly. In a sense to hit the numbers they project they would need to be the #1 draw in this area for each of those items that you mentioned. It makes 0 logical sense that that would ever happen. Just because you put a bunch of different things all under one roof doesn't mean the new collective entity is going to be more popular than all the individual pieces combined. This is an over-saturated market already. It really seems like they realized they had no chance of hitting the original numbers so just started throwing tons of random ideas out there hoping that a few of them would be successful in bringing in people.



It is built on state-owned land and received considerable amount of public assistance (hundreds of millions in tax breaks, over a billion in government bonds, etc). One of the major political advocates for it was also found guilty of federal bribery and fraud charges in 2015 (although the one charge directly related to the project itself he wasn't convicted of, but should have been).

Not sure how you can say you think it will suck people away from other nearby malls and close some of them when you admit that you know nothing about them. The retail portion of American Dream is targeting a luxury high-end experience. (Even the renderings on their website show people walking around dressed in suits and dresses and all sorts of high-end designer clothes). That doesn't fit the demographic of people that shop at most of the other malls in this area. I also don't see the target demographic for American Dream saying "Let's dress up and go out to that place in the swamplands of Jersey tonight."

Every mall markets themselves as upscale. Kind of like midwestern casinos. The brochures are all girls in party dresses clearly having fun. The reality is senior citizens feeding their social security check and trailer rent into a slot machine. All the NJ malls think that having a Mont Blanc pen store makes them luxury destinations, while in reality, they're a waiting area for a grotty seated multiplex and a Panda Express.

I doubt American Dream (nee Xanadu) will be any different. I'll go check it out for a summer one-off, but as has been pointed out in other threads, it's 13 miles from 274 vertical foot Campgaw, which while hilariously tiny and very Jersey, is at least built on a real hill. OTOH, it might very well be a good place for never evers to learn to ski.
 

nycskier

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I taught my kids to ski at Campgaw and that's probably who this indoor ski resort is for. I wish this was around a few years ago because by the time it opens my kids will be 5 and 7 years old they both might be too good of a skier for this place. But for them to get a few turns in and practice their skills in the summer this would be great and I definitely plan on taking them there next year after ski season is over.
 

BenedictGomez

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I also don't see the target demographic for American Dream saying "Let's dress up and go out to that place in the swamplands of Jersey tonight."

In East Rutherford. Not happening. People from the parts of NJ with money are not getting in their cars and driving to the Meadowlands to go to a giant, ugly, mall. Ferris wheel or not.
 

Domeskier

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Every mall markets themselves as upscale. Kind of like midwestern casinos. The brochures are all girls in party dresses clearly having fun. The reality is senior citizens feeding their social security check and trailer rent into a slot machine. All the NJ malls think that having a Mont Blanc pen store makes them luxury destinations, while in reality, they're a waiting area for a grotty seated multiplex and a Panda Express.

Agreed. A 2015 press release announced the following retail tenants: Aritzia, Banana Republic, Gap, Lululemon, MAC, Microsoft, Pink, Uniqlo, Victoria’s Secret and Zara. Another announced a Lord & Taylor and Saks Fifth Avenue OFF 5TH. In 2016, they announced a 60,000 sqft Century 21. Although there was also mention of an 8,000 sqft Hermes (which in 2015 was planning to relocate from Riverside Square in Hackensack) and a Saks Fifth Avenue, this is not going to be primarily a luxury retail or dining destination. Unless they've changed plans. In which case I case I'll have to wear my formal ski attire to the dome:

chanel.png
 

BenedictGomez

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All I know is Nieman Marcus, Mikimoto, and Morton's wont thrive with a Lids, Nike, and Johnny Rockets crowd, so they best go with the latter.
 

HowieT2

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couple of thoughts.
I haven't seen it lately but it was one of the ugliest buildings I have ever had the misfortune of setting my eyes upon.
I had read some time ago that there was to be a Cabela's there. Not sure if this is still true.
While there are many other "malls" to compete with in northern NJ, none of them are readily accessible via public transportation from NYC. That's obviously a big market and there really isn't an entertainment alternative other than maybe coney island in the summer and while that is technically in NYC, east rutherford is easier to get to for most NYC residents.
I have no idea whether they will make their projections (and really, that is the owners problem), but it will be "cool" to have an indoor year round ski hill in the area. how awesome would it be to teach kids how to ski in a climate controlled environment with perfect snow day in and day out. you could actually have a kids birthday party there. My biggest fear is that it will be too crowded. But this could be a boost to the ski industry in general by opening up the sport to many who otherwise wouldnt give it a try.
 

cdskier

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couple of thoughts.
I haven't seen it lately but it was one of the ugliest buildings I have ever had the misfortune of setting my eyes upon.
I had read some time ago that there was to be a Cabela's there. Not sure if this is still true.
While there are many other "malls" to compete with in northern NJ, none of them are readily accessible via public transportation from NYC. That's obviously a big market and there really isn't an entertainment alternative other than maybe coney island in the summer and while that is technically in NYC, east rutherford is easier to get to for most NYC residents.
I have no idea whether they will make their projections (and really, that is the owners problem), but it will be "cool" to have an indoor year round ski hill in the area. how awesome would it be to teach kids how to ski in a climate controlled environment with perfect snow day in and day out. you could actually have a kids birthday party there. My biggest fear is that it will be too crowded. But this could be a boost to the ski industry in general by opening up the sport to many who otherwise wouldnt give it a try.

Thankfully they've redone the exterior and it is no longer the ugliest thing in the world.

Cabela's pulled out several years ago after one of the many delays.

Garden State Plaza and Willowbrook malls in NJ can be readily accessed via NJ Transit buses from Port Authority in NYC. Maybe others can be too, but I know both of those are definitely easy to get to via public transit from NYC. For entertainment this may be a closer option for NYC people than anything else though.

For the ski area, my biggest fear wouldn't be crowding (other than maybe initially when it first opens before the fad wears off), but it would be that they over-price it.
 
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