Extreme Snowboard Carving Serious Safety and Skiing Community issue

[kingslug]

Time for the code to change.

 

[AdironRider]

Or just time for you to start following it.

 

[cdskier]

Uhh...not like the code was just created and never updated. Most recent version of the code was updated just a few years ago by NSAA.

 

[drjeff]

The reality is, that at times, sometimes you HAVE to just slow down and not go full out. Some people seem to not get this. That may be because of skier/rider density on a trail, or it could even be due to snow conditions off trail. The notion that some have that it's always full charge 100% of the time, is the source of so many of these "who's fault is it?" posts and/or scenarios like have been mentioned in this thread is often the common denominator

 

[LuckyStrike]

Any changes to the code require ratification from 2/3rds of all public ski areas in North America. Seems like a tall order to me.

 

[kingslug]

Or just time for you to start following it.

Ski 100 days a year..never hit anybody...
You say some dumb shit...
You like starting arguments...
Awesome...

 

[kingslug]

Kid today on a narrow crowded Slope pulls a quick right and stops right in front of me..
Good thing I see everything and avoided him.
Think this is ok to do..
What if someone wasn't looking at everything and plowed him.
It's a free for all out there..

 

[letitsnow1]

Alot of people fail to look uphill before taking off from a stop, they just pull out right in front of you. Most people know downhill skier has the right of way but ignore the rest of the code. Many people drive the same way

 

[da-bum]

The code seems to be a simple guide where one doesn't have to think what applies in a situation that one is encountering. No one is going to think, this person in the front is making regular turns, so I (the person behind) is should watch out for them, but their turn is wider than the proscribed limit of being in their lane, so now I have the right of way and will not cede my position.

I sometimes see a much faster skier A swing across a moderate speed skier B from behind, then arc around and pass the same person at almost 90 deg from the front. Technically skier B was on the wrong because skier B has been slightly behind skier A. Maybe the code should be updated to the responsibility lying on who can see whom.

 

[SkiingInABlueDream]

on the highway, let's say someone verry quickly merges right in front of you, like less than one car length in front of you, and then immediately goes full brakes, and you rear end them. Would anyone consider that their own fault? I don't think so.

The people here saying that you should always absolutely be able to avoid absolutely anyone on the slopes regardless of how ignorantly and unpredictability quickly their path runs into your path, are being unrealistic.
I've personally never had anyone run into me, nor ran into anyone, and I hope it stays that way. But avoiding collisions, even with people in your field of view, is not 100% in your own control.

 

[kingslug]

on the highway, let's say someone verry quickly merges right in front of you, like less than one car length in front of you, and then immediately goes full brakes, and you rear end them. Would anyone consider that their own fault? I don't think so.

The people here saying that you should always absolutely be able to avoid absolutely anyone on the slopes regardless of how ignorantly and unpredictability quickly their path runs into your path, are being unrealistic.
I've personally never had anyone run into me, nor ran into anyone, and I hope it stays that way. But avoiding collisions, even with people in your field of view, is not 100% in your own control.

Exactly...

 

[SteezyRob]

snowboarders fucking suck. thank god for mad river glen.

 

[SteezyRob]

Thank you SOOO much Bumpsis, truly! I am starting to feel like i'm in some sort of re-education camp. is anyone else listening to themselves? Where do they ski, down waterslides?

all of the people telling you that you were wrong are either pretentious libtards, snowboard cucks, or FIS narcs. don't worry about it, it's good no one got hurt.

 

[crippity]

Stay classy SteezyRob

 

[cdskier]

on the highway, let's say someone verry quickly merges right in front of you, like less than one car length in front of you, and then immediately goes full brakes, and you rear end them. Would anyone consider that their own fault? I don't think so.

The people here saying that you should always absolutely be able to avoid absolutely anyone on the slopes regardless of how ignorantly and unpredictability quickly their path runs into your path, are being unrealistic.
I've personally never had anyone run into me, nor ran into anyone, and I hope it stays that way. But avoiding collisions, even with people in your field of view, is not 100% in your own control.

There's a big difference between driving and skiing/boarding. Roads have lanes and cars have mirrors and blinkers (whether people choose to use those is another story). Skiing has none of those. Actually the FIS code specifically calls this out and elaborates on the fact that skiing is a "free activity sport" where people can make their own lines. And this is exactly why in skiing the person behind needs to keep a safe distance from people in front of them. This should not be a difficult concept to grasp.

 

[Bumpsis]

There's a big difference between driving and skiing/boarding. Roads have lanes and cars have mirrors and blinkers (whether people choose to use those is another story). Skiing has none of those. Actually the FIS code specifically calls this out and elaborates on the fact that skiing is a "free activity sport" where people can make their own lines. And this is exactly why in skiing the person behind needs to keep a safe distance from people in front of them. This should not be a difficult concept to grasp.

Since this topic is still going on, here are my additional couple of cents.
I just looked up what seemingly is the FIS code of conduct (CD's post made me do it) and at least the first four rules clearly show that the idiot snowboarder who caused the bumpybrady's (original author of this conversation) collision was totally and absolutely in the wrong. And so is everyone else here who ganged up on the guy telling him "it's the uphill rider/skier..."

Common sense would dictate that if you pull a fast turn in front of someone on the slope, you're just made a stupid and dangerous move. So, that should not be "a difficult concept to grasp", if I were to quote CD's judgy little line here. You just can't "keep a safe distance from people in front", if they essentially do a 90 degree right in front you. Come on!! Get real.

For your review:

FIS Rules for the Conduct of Skiers & Snowboarders​

For more safety on the slopes​

1. Respect for others
A skier or snowboarder must behave in such a way that he or she does not endanger or prejudice others.
2. Control of speed and skiing or snowboarding
A skier or snowboarder must move in control. He must adapt the speed and manner of skiing or snowboarding to his personal ability and to the prevailing conditions of terrain, snow and weather as well as to the density of traffic.
3. Choice of route
A skier or snowboarder coming from behind must choose his route in such a way not to endanger skiers or snowboarders ahead.
4. Overtaking
A skier or snowboarder may overtake another skier or snowboarder above or below and to the right or to the left provided that he leaves enough space for the overtaken skier or snowboarder to make any voluntary or involuntary movement.

 

[cdskier]

Since this topic is still going on, here are my additional couple of cents.
I just looked up what seemingly is the FIS code of conduct (CD's post made me do it) and at least the first four rules clearly show that the idiot snowboarder who caused the bumpybrady's (original author of this conversation) collision was totally and absolutely in the wrong. And so is everyone else here who ganged up on the guy telling him "it's the uphill rider/skier..."

Common sense would dictate that if you pull a fast turn in front of someone on the slope, you're just made a stupid and dangerous move. So, that should not be "a difficult concept to grasp", if I were to quote CD's judgy little line here. You just can't "keep a safe distance from people in front", if they essentially do a 90 degree right in front you. Come on!! Get real.

For your review:

FIS Rules for the Conduct of Skiers & Snowboarders​

For more safety on the slopes​

1. Respect for others
A skier or snowboarder must behave in such a way that he or she does not endanger or prejudice others.
2. Control of speed and skiing or snowboarding
A skier or snowboarder must move in control. He must adapt the speed and manner of skiing or snowboarding to his personal ability and to the prevailing conditions of terrain, snow and weather as well as to the density of traffic.
3. Choice of route
A skier or snowboarder coming from behind must choose his route in such a way not to endanger skiers or snowboarders ahead.
4. Overtaking
A skier or snowboarder may overtake another skier or snowboarder above or below and to the right or to the left provided that he leaves enough space for the overtaken skier or snowboarder to make any voluntary or involuntary movement.

I agree 1 applies to the snowboarder in this scenario to a degree, although you can argue if he didn't know someone is behind him, he's not intending to endanger anyone. 2 is borderline. You can make a sharp turn and still be in control. Neither of us were there so we can't comment on how much traffic there was to know whether that applies. If the traffic was behind him and he wasn't aware of it, he could have thought he had the trail to himself (and the subsequent elaboration from FIS on Rule 2 talks about things within the skier's vision, which wouldn't apply to someone behind them).

But how exactly are 3 and 4 showing that the idiot snowboarder was in the wrong? 4 in fact states the skier behind essentially needs to account for idiots. And 3 again applies to the skier behind. (FWIW, I agree the snowboarder is an idiot, but again if the skier behind is following at a safe distance as is a major point of the code, this is a moot point). You seem to have skipped reading the following page of the FIS code that elaborates on each of the points.

 

[deadheadskier]

Personal skier responsibility code:

Don't trust anyone else on the trail. Even my own kids. . Below me, behind me, beside me, don't matter.... don't trust anyone

Serves me well.

 

[machski]

I agree 1 applies to the snowboarder in this scenario to a degree, although you can argue if he didn't know someone is behind him, he's not intending to endanger anyone. 2 is borderline. You can make a sharp turn and still be in control. Neither of us were there so we can't comment on how much traffic there was to know whether that applies. If the traffic was behind him and he wasn't aware of it, he could have thought he had the trail to himself (and the subsequent elaboration from FIS on Rule 2 talks about things within the skier's vision, which wouldn't apply to someone behind them).

But how exactly are 3 and 4 showing that the idiot snowboarder was in the wrong? 4 in fact states the skier behind essentially needs to account for idiots. And 3 again applies to the skier behind. (FWIW, I agree the snowboarder is an idiot, but again if the skier behind is following at a safe distance as is a major point of the code, this is a moot point). You seem to have skipped reading the following page of the FIS code that elaborates on each of the points.

The problem is today, to make 4 work you almost have to give them 8 cat widths to pass. And then even if you have that and are passing on the opposite side of the trail, that may not be enough at times. Since personal responsibility seems out the window these days, something making it the skier/rider who choses to cut a rapid/sharp 90 degree turn across a trail shall ensure that path is clear prior to commencing the aforementioned turn. Seems straightforward and smart but as I have witnessed, many do not. And I'm not saying the code empowers them so, I'd bet most couldn't even tell you one of the codes,

 

[SkiingInABlueDream]

There's a big difference between driving and skiing/boarding. Roads have lanes and cars have mirrors and blinkers (whether people choose to use those is another story). Skiing has none of those. Actually the FIS code specifically calls this out and elaborates on the fact that skiing is a "free activity sport" where people can make their own lines. And this is exactly why in skiing the person behind needs to keep a safe distance from people in front of them. This should not be a difficult concept to grasp.

There is a lot of overlap between common sense behavior on the road and on the slopes. If you pass a skier very closely and then hockey stop right in front of them there's a good chance they'll run into you if they're moving much faster than pizza speed. This is pretty comparable to my car merging example.

In both cases the letter of rules states the person behind is at fault, even though the other person violated common sense. (And actually point 4 of the FIS code undermines that fault). But regardless, whether it's on the road or slopes you can't expect the person behind to ALWAYS be able to stop. This should not be a difficult concept to grasp.