East Coast One Ski Quiver Help

[timm]

I found the Bushwacker to be much too soft for a full time east coast ski. Especially if, as the original poster said he would be spending at least 50% of his time on trail. Different strokes though, ymmv.

 

[mister moose]

I am an Advanced/Expert skier who tends to like the smaller classic N.E. trails, bumps and woods/out-of-bounds.

You might not like what I'm going to say, but if you are truly an advanced/expert, and all mountain ski just is going to be limiting you, and your fun.

This is spring, and with it, sales. This is also the east coast. True powder days are limited. I say start with a pure frontside ski, or a bump ski for the spring. Add to the quiver as you can. Add the back country ski next fall before Columbus Day. Feed the addiction. Stalk Ebay, Evo, Steap & Cheap, ski shops. I'm skiing an over cut sub 12m slalom ski, a barely mid fat bump/day after the snowfall ski, a 100mm burly powder ski, a worn mid fat powder thin cover ski, and a stiff stable Super G/ Skiercross ski. I'll never go back to an "all mountain ski". I hate over 90 mm frontside. Nothing turns faster and carves like a rail under your foot like 66mm. And in the spring above 50 degrees I don't want to be on anything under 85mm. You're lookng for perfection in one ski. Find it in several skis. Skis are not women, they don't care if you have several at once.

 

[Blanton]

They advertise early rise and a soft tip for easy float. On hard pack you want a tip that's stiff and always pressing hard (traditional camber) into the ice. If the tip is rising early or is soft enough to bounce, it's lost it's ability to keep the edge in the snow.

A mogul ski will be ~165cm in length with a 65mm waist. The line would probably be in the 180cm length and they're 98mm at the waist. A mogul ski is also soft (foam core) and the Line advertises a stiff tail for turn finish. I'm going to assume that they'll get through the moguls if you can keep the wide stiff tail in check but this is not even close to the tool for zip lining at 2-3 moguls per second.

I'm sure it's a great powder, crud and tree ski but it's design doesn't match the models for ice or moguls. IMO

Hart, Volkl, Dynastar, IDone, K2 mogul skis all use wood cores because they are stiffer and more durable than foam. About the only adult mogul ski I can think of from the last 10 years that used foam was the Rossignol Mogul Exhibition. The non Lab 1080s were foam but that is going back really far.

 

[St. Bear]

You might not like what I'm going to say, but if you are truly an advanced/expert, and all mountain ski just is going to be limiting you, and your fun.

This is spring, and with it, sales. This is also the east coast. True powder days are limited. I say start with a pure frontside ski, or a bump ski for the spring. Add to the quiver as you can. Add the back country ski next fall before Columbus Day. Feed the addiction. Stalk Ebay, Evo, Steap & Cheap, ski shops. I'm skiing an over cut sub 12m slalom ski, a barely mid fat bump/day after the snowfall ski, a 100mm burly powder ski, a worn mid fat powder thin cover ski, and a stiff stable Super G/ Skiercross ski. I'll never go back to an "all mountain ski". I hate over 90 mm frontside. Nothing turns faster and carves like a rail under your foot like 66mm. And in the spring above 50 degrees I don't want to be on anything under 85mm. You're lookng for perfection in one ski. Find it in several skis. Skis are not women, they don't care if you have several at once.

I don't necessarily disagree with you, but most of us can't drop a few hundred dollars every few months on skis. Or, if we can, then we wouldn't be able to afford to actually go out and use the ski.

There's a reason why the "All-Mountain" or "Quiver-of-One" ski is so successfully marketed, and it's because I'll take performance trade offs all day long if it means saving hundreds of dollars. and I know I'm not alone in my thinking.

 

[mister moose]

I don't necessarily disagree with you, but most of us can't drop a few hundred dollars every few months on skis. Or, if we can, then we wouldn't be able to afford to actually go out and use the ski.

There's a reason why the "All-Mountain" or "Quiver-of-One" ski is so successfully marketed, and it's because I'll take performance trade offs all day long if it means saving hundreds of dollars. and I know I'm not alone in my thinking.

I understand budget constraints. With some patience and persistence though I still say you can get 2 pairs good skis for the price of this year's model. There are ways to save money on every aspect of skiing, and skis are no different. Recent very lightly used is an alternative as well. If you talk yourself into demoing all the latest stuff until you find your 'perfect ski', you will then have to pay the price that perfect new ski commands, plus all those demo fees. 'Perfect' might be related to the day you demoed the ski, not just the ski itself.

I have had a lot of different skis strapped to my feet, and I have enjoyed most of them. I only had to sell 2 pairs over the years because they just weren't working for me, and got about what I paid for them.

Each to his own. Just know that there are alternatives.

 

[vinnyv11]

Tough season to buy feels like everywhere's inventories are ridiculously low.

 

[Gilligan]

I understand budget constraints. With some patience and persistence though I still say you can get 2 pairs good skis for the price of this year's model. There are ways to save money on every aspect of skiing, and skis are no different. Recent very lightly used is an alternative as well. If you talk yourself into demoing all the latest stuff until you find your 'perfect ski', you will then have to pay the price that perfect new ski commands, plus all those demo fees. 'Perfect' might be related to the day you demoed the ski, not just the ski itself.

I have had a lot of different skis strapped to my feet, and I have enjoyed most of them. I only had to sell 2 pairs over the years because they just weren't working for me, and got about what I paid for them.

Each to his own. Just know that there are alternatives.

Not just the conditions of the day, but also how a ski is tuned can make a difference. A slight increase in base bevel can make a hooky ski slide through the bumps much better. A sharper edge on any ski will make it grip better on the hard stuff. Even a different length of the same ski can make a bigger difference than switching models.

 

[goldsbar]

Powder - >100mm underfoot, soft, rockered tip and tail and >180cm in length (Pro: Great float and easy to turn. Con: Challenging at speed on hard pack or ice)
Bumps - <80mm underfoot, soft and <170cm in length (Pro: Light and quick turning. Con: Challenging at speed on hard pack or ice)
Slalom = <80mm underfoot, stiff and <170cm in length (Pro: Quick turning on hard pack or ice. Con: Challenging at speed on hard pack or ice)
Giant Slalom = <80mm underfoot, stiff and >180cm in length (Pro: Stable at speed on hard pack or ice. Con: Challenging to turn quickly)

Above are the things you're trying to do and the ski types I feel are designed to do it easily. What you'll notice are differences in widths, stiffness and length for each category that just don't mix. Honestly, I don't think you're going to find a ski that's quick and responsive on groomers, bumps and trees but is steady making larger GS turns at speed. There are fundamental design differences there. But, you're after an All Mountain Ski so I'll just leave you with the categories and let you decide which is most important to you.

Perfect answer. OP, if you're truly advanced/expert, there's no way a one ski quiver will satisfy you completely. GS turns? Dynastar Speed Course Ti. Knee deep straighlining in Utah? Salomon Rocker 2 115mm. Slalom turns? One of the multitudes of SL skis. Personally, off piste I like a medium-soft flex wider ski with rocker. On piste, medium-hard flex traditional camber and narrow. That's not even getting into sidecut for GS vs SL. The one ski quiver skis are fairly amazing at deliving 80% of everything. If you really love skiing, that missing 20% will eventually really bother you.

 

[Gilligan]

Perfect answer. OP, if you're truly advanced/expert, there's no way a one ski quiver will satisfy you completely. GS turns? Dynastar Speed Course Ti. Knee deep straighlining in Utah? Salomon Rocker 2 115mm. Slalom turns? One of the multitudes of SL skis. Personally, off piste I like a medium-soft flex wider ski with rocker. On piste, medium-hard flex traditional camber and narrow. That's not even getting into sidecut for GS vs SL. The one ski quiver skis are fairly amazing at deliving 80% of everything. If you really love skiing, that missing 20% will eventually really bother you.

I do understand your point. However, this is the East. In one run I am likely to encounter a steep, icy headwall, gnarly bumps, maybe duck into the trees for some pow, then long GS turns on the groomed runout back to the chair. You cannot change skis mid run. I want the ski that comes closest to doing it all.

 

[ScottySkis]

Dyanstar legend ,great ski.

 

[BenedictGomez]

I understand budget constraints. With some patience and persistence though I still say you can get 2 pairs good skis for the price of this year's model. There are ways to save money on every aspect of skiing, and skis are no different. Recent very lightly used is an alternative

Agree 100%.

I don't know that I'll ever buy a "new" pair of skis again. I just don't see the point. Let someone else drive it off the lot and depreciate it 50%.

 

[deadheadskier]

The one ski quiver skis are fairly amazing at deliving 80% of everything. If you really love skiing, that missing 20% will eventually really bother you.

Agree 100%.

My "All Mountain" ski is a Fischer Motive 84. It's a great ski for me 80% of the time, but only because of where I live and primarily ski - New Hampshire at lower natural snowfall ski areas where I spend a lot of my time railing groomers. I bought these because of the reality of the conditions I ski most of the time, not the dream reality of the conditions I'd like to be skiing most of the time. The times I do get to ski Powder or Bumps, I'm definitely not thrilled with the Motive 84's performance.

For me, a true quiver of one All Mountain ski doesn't exist. I'm intrigued to try something like the Line Prophet 90 or 100; or the Nordica Hell and Back as they get such high reviews as do anything skis, but I doubt I'd like them so much that I'd trade in my quiver for that one ski. I'm sure they are great skis, but I doubt they'd match the race ski like performance I get out of my Fischer's on the groomers. They definitely couldn't touch the mogul performance of my 70mm Rossi BXs I bought 6 years ago as a bump specific ski for only $200 new. I also doubt with at least the Line 90s that I'd be thrilled with the skis Powder Performance. I have a 92 waisted ski (High Society Free Rides) and they somewhat collect dust. I bought them 3 years ago and I probably only have a dozen days on them. They're not a bad ski, they're better than the Fischer's in Powder, Spring Corn and surprisingly bumps for sure, but anything over 6-8 inches of fresh or if the snow is heavy; I'm taking out my 110mm Rossi Powder skis I bought 13 years ago for dirt cheap.

I've always been a big proponent of having multiple pairs of skis for different conditions; even back in the skinny skis days. Throughout the 90s I always had a 200cm GS ski and a 190cm Bump ski. In 2000 I got my first Powder ski, the one mentioned prior. After buying that ski, my second ski became my "All Mountain" ski and I'm on my 3rd pair of "All Mountain skis" since that time. Since that time I've bought bumps specific skis on the cheap as well as the High Societies. Barring catastrophic damage, most well built skis are good to go for 100-150 days on the hill. Hence why I'm still skiing 13 year old Powder skis and I'm sure I'll still be skiing my bumps skis that I only bring out a few days a year, ten years from now. The Fischer's will last me a good 5 years. Next purchase will be new Powder skis or perhaps used new Powder skis as I only get 3-5 Powder days on average a season, so it doesn't make much sense to invest big money in something new. I like the dimensions of a 183cm Armada TST for an East Coast pow ski.

 

[timm]

Watch out, once you give up on a OSQ, you'll find there's more and more niches you'd like to fill haha.

Hell and Back is on my potential list too along with the narrower one in that line, the Steadfast. Seems like being a bit softer (and floating better) they could be a potential OSQ...for days I spend in the wood or softer bumped up runs ha.

 

[ScottySkis]

Just ski on one foot in the morning, eat health breakfast. Every day egg , then kiss your kids and family. Go to work if you can. Try the West. Enjoy life. Ski ,snowboarding. Say hi to Roxbury hills more sick terrain to come.

 

[St. Bear]

Perfect answer. OP, if you're truly advanced/expert, there's no way a one ski quiver will satisfy you completely. GS turns? Dynastar Speed Course Ti. Knee deep straighlining in Utah? Salomon Rocker 2 115mm. Slalom turns? One of the multitudes of SL skis. Personally, off piste I like a medium-soft flex wider ski with rocker. On piste, medium-hard flex traditional camber and narrow. That's not even getting into sidecut for GS vs SL. The one ski quiver skis are fairly amazing at deliving 80% of everything. If you really love skiing, that missing 20% will eventually really bother you.

My skis are 89mm underfoot, and perform great in bumps, crud, and carveable groomers. I was even impressed with their performance at Magic with 15" of fresh. The only condition they don't do well in is icy or frozen groomers, but I really don't care if I'm skidding in those conditions. I guess I just don't love skiing as much as the rest of you guys.

I do understand your point. However, this is the East. In one run I am likely to encounter a steep, icy headwall, gnarly bumps, maybe duck into the trees for some pow, then long GS turns on the groomed runout back to the chair. You cannot change skis mid run. I want the ski that comes closest to doing it all.

100% this.

 

[Gunny J]

Gilligan you just described the near perfect day in the east that you usually get.

 

[57stevey]

Agree 100%.

My "All Mountain" ski is a Fischer Motive 84. It's a great ski for me 80% of the time, but only because of where I live and primarily ski - New Hampshire at lower natural snowfall ski areas where I spend a lot of my time railing groomers. I bought these because of the reality of the conditions I ski most of the time, not the dream reality of the conditions I'd like to be skiing most of the time. The times I do get to ski Powder or Bumps, I'm definitely not thrilled with the Motive 84's performance.

For me, a true quiver of one All Mountain ski doesn't exist. I'm intrigued to try something like the Line Prophet 90 or 100; or the Nordica Hell and Back as they get such high reviews as do anything skis, but I doubt I'd like them so much that I'd trade in my quiver for that one ski. I'm sure they are great skis, but I doubt they'd match the race ski like performance I get out of my Fischer's on the groomers. They definitely couldn't touch the mogul performance of my 70mm Rossi BXs I bought 6 years ago as a bump specific ski for only $200 new. I also doubt with at least the Line 90s that I'd be thrilled with the skis Powder Performance. I have a 92 waisted ski (High Society Free Rides) and they somewhat collect dust. I bought them 3 years ago and I probably only have a dozen days on them. They're not a bad ski, they're better than the Fischer's in Powder, Spring Corn and surprisingly bumps for sure, but anything over 6-8 inches of fresh or if the snow is heavy; I'm taking out my 110mm Rossi Powder skis I bought 13 years ago for dirt cheap.

What is this 110 Rossi of which you speak? I'm on the lookout for a cheap, nimble, surfy fat ski, but have no idea what might have fit that bill in years past...
,

 

[deadheadskier]

Axioms.

 

[KD7000]

However, this is the East. In one run I am likely to encounter a steep, icy headwall, gnarly bumps, maybe duck into the trees for some pow, then long GS turns on the groomed runout back to the chair. You cannot change skis mid run. I want the ski that comes closest to doing it all.

This is so true... I've never had a good day that didn't encompass multiple different conditions. I'm a one-ski quiver person; probably because I don't really ski that much. I keep considering becoming a multiple-snowboard owner, but then I know that whichever board I choose for a specific trip, I will have some regrets. And I don't really want to deal with dragging multiple boards out every time I go somewhere.

Not only that, the $300-$600 another board would cost will buy an awful lot of gas and lift tickets. This holds true for skis as well.

I'm happy with a quiver of one snowboard, one set of dh skis, and one set of XC BC skis.

 

[goldsbar]

I do understand your point. However, this is the East. In one run I am likely to encounter a steep, icy headwall, gnarly bumps, maybe duck into the trees for some pow, then long GS turns on the groomed runout back to the chair. You cannot change skis mid run. I want the ski that comes closest to doing it all.

That's what you think! I have a spoof picture from Ski Magazine from the 60s/70s(?) I found on Epicski where they have a guy with a ski caddy. I can't upload it as the picture is the wrong size or something like that.

Fair point, though.