ASC Big Rumor

[skibum]

http://www2.steamboatpilot.com/news/2006/sep/01/sheraton_steamboat_sale/
Here's an interesting link
A large chunk of real estate at the base of Steamboat is now for sale. Steamboat ski area by itself offers no space for real e$tate development. ASC sold off all it's valuable lots (tennis meadows, snowflower II ) over the years. Put the two together and you've got something.
In other 'boat news a 24 year old New Hampshire man is facing 6 months in jail for dumpster diving. Booo!
http://www2.steamboatpilot.com/news/2006/sep/04/too_much_time/

 

[ski_resort_observer]

I read that statement but the rumor has it that the additional sale review is above-and-beyond the Steamboat work.

It's ironic that 6 months ago Intrawest basically announced the same thing and ended up selling the whole shooting match with the new owner going private.

 

[SKIVT2]

I bought my ASC season pass for the purpose of skiing Killington and Pico. I'm glad I paid the VT taxes and bought the pass from Killington. I think that gives me a bit of a leg up on hoping to be able to continue to use the pass at K and Pico if either is sold. The VT state attorney general might fight for the pass holders who actually paid the VT sales tax. I might not be as comfortible if I bought my pass from Attitash to avoid the taxes. This was the actual reason that I bought from K and paid the tax. The pass had fine print about it not being valid at any resort that was sold by ASC.

 

[thebigo]

Is that true about the fine print. Can you post a link?

I have never seen or heard anything to that effect.

Im almost positive that sugarbush honored the asc passes after being sold. Although that could have been for good pr.

 

[madskier6]

The pass had fine print about it not being valid at any resort that was sold by ASC.

Sold by ASC when? Prior to the commencement of the season or during the season? It would be helpful to see the specific fine print language.

Presumably for public relations purposes the terms of any sale would include a provision requiring the buyer to honor the ASC pass during 2006-2007 (as in the Sugarbush deal). From ASC's perspective, I imagine they don't want a bunch of unhappy customers complaining to them about not being able to access a particular resort after a sale. In exchange for this, the buyer would presumably negotiate a slightly lower overall purchase price to compensate it for that.

 

[ALLSKIING]

Presumably for public relations purposes the terms of any sale would include a provision requiring the buyer to honor the ASC pass during 2006-2007 (as in the Sugarbush deal). From ASC's perspective, I imagine they don't want a bunch of unhappy customers complaining to them about not being able to access a particular resort after a sale. In exchange for this, the buyer would presumably negotiate a slightly lower overall purchase price to compensate it for that.

I would agree with this as well. There is no way they are going to stiff all the people that bought ASC passes for the season.

 

[andyzee]

I would agree with this as well. There is no way they are going to stiff all the people that bought ASC passes for the season.

As an ASC Pass holder that skis Killington more than anywhere else, that's all I would need to turn Sugarbush into my new home mountain.

 

[tjm235]

I bought my ASC season pass for the purpose of skiing Killington and Pico. I'm glad I paid the VT taxes and bought the pass from Killington. I think that gives me a bit of a leg up on hoping to be able to continue to use the pass at K and Pico if either is sold. The VT state attorney general might fight for the pass holders who actually paid the VT sales tax. I might not be as comfortible if I bought my pass from Attitash to avoid the taxes. This was the actual reason that I bought from K and paid the tax. The pass had fine print about it not being valid at any resort that was sold by ASC.

If you bought a Ski All America pass then I have no clue where you're seeing that... the Ski All Am's we're selling out Steamboat have nothing of the sort. We're having people sign liability waivers, but it's purely the typical "assumption of risk" stuff... in fact I'm looking at one right now and there is nothing referring to resorts sold by ASC. The pass itself just has the typical Co Skier Safety Act printed on the back. I can't speak for All East passes, but obviously All East's are not valid at Steamboat anyways. Scan the so-called fineprint if it really exists, because I'm curious where you're seeing this too.

 

[SKIVT2]

When you buy an All East Pass there is a disclaimer Pop-up window that appears on the website that you must agree to. I can't re-create it without putting my credit card info into the site again but I remember it distinctly. I actually was on Sugarloaf's site in the process of buying passes there to avoid the tax when I read the disclaimer the fist time. I exited the site and did some thinking. At the time the following two threads were active on K-zone:

http://www.killingtonzone.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=10299&highlight=one+pass

http://www.killingtonzone.com/forum...s=0&postorder=asc&highlight=asc+pass&start=15

Between these two threads and my own misgivings about the disclaimer, I decided that $40 was not a lot to pay to ease my mind. I bought passes from the mounatin that I intended to ski most often (Killington/Pico).You can make your own decision.

Perhaps someone who has not bought an All East pass yet but who is planning to soon could copy and paste the disclaimer into this thread so everyone can read the actual words. One of the links above does have the most applicable sentence from the disclaimer quoted.

Again, everyone has their own appetite for risk and their own interperatation of what they read.

 

[BeanoNYC]

Perhaps someone who has not bought an All East pass yet but who is planning to soon could copy and paste the disclaimer into this thread so everyone can read the actual words. One of the links above does have the most applicable sentence from the disclaimer quoted.

No need, Google to the rescue:

2006/2007 Season Pass - Terms & Conditions of Use


1. Season Passes MUST BE VISIBLE to lift attendants at all times.

2. Unlimited Season Passes are valid any day the designated resort is open for skiing/riding during the 2006/2007 winter
season. All For One, College, and Ski America season passes may have other restrictions including certain black-out
dates. Midweek passes are not valid on weekends and the following holiday periods: November 24-25, 2006, December
25, 2006 – January 1, 2007, January 13-15, 2007 and February 17-23, 2007. All multi-resort passes are valid only at
those designated resorts which are owned by American Skiing Company. In the event of the sale or transfer of any
resort, American Skiing Company reserves the right to terminate the acceptance of multi-resort passes at the transferred resort.

3. Season Passes must be paid in full and the Express Acceptance of Risks, Release, Indemnification & Forum
Selection Agreement form must be signed or accepted on-line, before actual passes will be issued.

Here's the link to it.

How do you like my googlitity now Bvibert?

 

[bvibert]

Here's the link to it.

How do you like my googlitity now Bvibert?

Very good googlitity Beano! :beer: I'm impressed!

 

[madskier6]

That language just gives ASC the right to exclude resorts that have been sold from the pass. It doesn't mean that the pass will definitely not be valid at any resort that they decide to sell. There's a big difference.

As I said before, if they sold Killington between now and April 07, I have to believe ASC would negotiate a requirement that the buyer honor the All for One Passes for this year. There are too many KMart skiers that use the pass for ASC to just turn their backs on them. That would be a public relations fiasco for ASC to have all those pass holders pissed off at them.

 

[Geoff]

That language just gives ASC the right to exclude resorts that have been sold from the pass. It doesn't mean that the pass will definitely not be valid at any resort that they decide to sell. There's a big difference.

As I said before, if they sold Killington between now and April 07, I have to believe ASC would negotiate a requirement that the buyer honor the All for One Passes for this year. There are too many KMart skiers that use the pass for ASC to just turn their backs on them. That would be a public relations fiasco for ASC to have all those pass holders pissed off at them.

When they sold Sugarbush, people were given a choice between a Sugarbush-only pass or an ASC-East pass. The State of Vermont Attorney General's Office forced them to give anybody who wanted it both an ASC-East pass and a Sugarbush pass. The new wording prevents that.

ASC is in such tough financial shape that there's no predicting what resorts might get sold and when. I doubt they'd turn down a vaid offer for any of their resorts. Of course, anybody buying would likely want to wait for the fire sale.

 

[ski_resort_observer]

That language just gives ASC the right to exclude resorts that have been sold from the pass. It doesn't mean that the pass will definitely not be valid at any resort that they decide to sell. There's a big difference.

As I said before, if they sold Killington between now and April 07, I have to believe ASC would negotiate a requirement that the buyer honor the All for One Passes for this year. There are too many KMart skiers that use the pass for ASC to just turn their backs on them. That would be a public relations fiasco for ASC to have all those pass holders pissed off at them.

I agree 100%. I also beleive that this disclaimer would not stand up in court if ASC did sell a resort and then the new owners did not honor the passes.

Again, no easy answers for ASC. I am starting to wonder that in hindsight if moving the companies headquarters to Park City was such a good idea. It appears that the sale of the Boat is a matter of when, not if. Thinking about some of the meetings I attended in the late 90's I have thought the last couple of years that ASC was way over focused on getting as large a presence as possible for the SLC Winter Olympics.

Every season we all talk about ASC's impending demise but they are still here. Company financials while still not in the black, the red ink has decreased. If they do sell the Boat and have a great year here in the east..ya never know.

 

[RISkier]

I have no idea about the legal issues concerning honoring the pass, but it strikes me that the new ownership would be making a huge public relations blunder if they didn't honor the pass.

 

[SKIVT2]

I bought my pass in April to Killington and paid the VT tax. I was betting that if Killington or Pico were sold to another party the new owners would probably want to honor the ASC all east Pass with the Killington logo. I thought it was more of a gamble to assume that the new owner of either killington or Pico would honor an ASC pass with an Attitash, Sugarloaf etc. logo. The risk of any of this in given year is minimal. I just thought the small extra bucks was worth minimizing the risk, however small.

49 days until 10/29

 

[tirolerpeter]

ASC "legaleez"

The year that ASC sold Sugarbush I had purchased an ALL EAST Bronze Pass. When I first contacted them they indicated that the pass would NOT honored at Sugarbush that season. I wrote back and indicated that I was pissed enough to look for as many other early season pass purchaser's as I could find, and try to put together a campaign that would certainly cost them a bundle in negative publicity. The compromise they came up with was that we could go to Sugarbush and get ONE free pass that season from the new owners. I never actually got there that season, so it ended up being totally irrelevant to me.

 

[BeanoNYC]

I have no idea about the legal issues concerning honoring the pass, but it strikes me that the new ownership would be making a huge public relations blunder if they didn't honor the pass.

You must have been reading my mind.

 

[Geoff]

I have no idea about the legal issues concerning honoring the pass, but it strikes me that the new ownership would be making a huge public relations blunder if they didn't honor the pass.

The new owners would be nuts to honor an ASC pass. The only arrangement that wouldn't be financial suicide for the acquiring company is to negotiate with ASC to get the season pass cash for people who want to swap their ASC pass for their single mountain pass. That's what happened when Sugarbush was sold. I'd expect the same thing to happen if they sell any other eastern resort.

 

[sledhaulingmedic]

Given that the resorts all scan the passes, it should be relatively easy to a resort buyer to come to an agreement on this issue should a resort be sold mid season: ASC rebates the new resort owner a pre-detirmined amount for each skier visit, as documented by the pass scanning.

Actually, I'd guess that this already happens within ASC for assigning season pass revenue to each resort.