AT in alpine boots without walk mode?

[sankaty]

Hi all,

I'm considering breaking into the AT world. Nothing too sophisticated at first. I'm anticipating an occasional morning climb at Pico or Ascutney, perhaps.

For starters at least, I'm thinking a frame binding makes the most sense. My boots are Dalbello Krypton AX 110 IDs. They don't have a walk mode. Will that make me miserable, or is a fixed cuff OK for casual AT? I know there is a range of opinions on this, but would appreciate a little guidance.

Not too concerned about weight at the moment. My tours will be relatively short, and the workout to get to the top will be part of the point. Does that sound reasonable?

Thanks!

 

[ironhippy]

You will be fine.. to a point.

I started "touring" by walking up the hill (no walk mode, regular boots) with my skis on my backpack. It's doable it's just not as comfortable.

My boots now have walk mode, but I honestly haven't noticed a difference when I use and when I don't, maybe my boots aren't tight enough.

I don't tour that often, but I did 3300 m (10826 feet) in 7 hours during a challenge at the local hill in January.

In summary, if you aren't going for a long time, you should be fine with your boots, however if you find they are too uncomfortable, you might need something better if you plan on continuing.

 

[KustyTheKlown]

I have frame AT bindings on one pair of my skis, I have regular alpine boots. granted I don't hit the skin track too often and most of my off resort skiing is just slackcountry, but I have not found a serious need for walk mode for light AT'ing

 

[machski]

Same here. I have skinned up in Atomic Redsters which are basically a plug type racing boot. Would not recommend long tours like this, but for the once up the hill, works fine.

Sent from my XT1650 using AlpineZone mobile app

 

[abc]

Do all "frame" bindings accept regular alpine boots? Or only the newer kind of dual use alpine boots?

 

[KustyTheKlown]

Do all "frame" bindings accept regular alpine boots? Or only the newer kind of dual use alpine boots?

frame bindings like a marker baron or salomon guardian should take any alpine boot, not only WTR boots

 

[Not Sure]

I have a set of Marker Dukes , the only place walk mode would be nice is on skinning on a flat areas, the only time I got blisters. Even though you’re not worried about weight it can add up quickly. I like Dalbellos they are heavy though.

 

[sankaty]

I have a set of Marker Dukes , the only place walk mode would be nice is on skinning on a flat areas, the only time I got blisters. Even though you’re not worried about weight it can add up quickly. I like Dalbellos they are heavy though.

Is it possible to skate on flat areas with skins on?

 

[Hawkshot99]

Is it possible to skate on flat areas with skins on?

Not really.

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[Hawkshot99]

The first couple years that I did any touring, I just used my regular downhill boots. I got really bad blisters one time, but after that I just figured out the proper way to buckle them that my foot was held in their securely, but still gave me a little bit range of motion. I ended up getting a really good deal on a pair of dalbello touring boots, and started using those. After getting them I truly saw how much more comfortable they were to Turin and was way more comfortable going up. They suck coming down, versus my downhill boots however I am told the newer boots are much better.
Basically if you never have a AT boot to compare it to I think you'll be fine as long as you're not touring a ton. There is no way I could bring myself to go back to a downhill boot now, but I was fine when I was doing it.

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[Not Sure]

Rail bindings are much safer than the tech bindings as they release like a downhill binding . There is the weight cost but if your young and don't plan on touring much are a better choice.

My boot issue only showed up on relatively flat skinning , my favorite place was a 2 mile flat skin to get to the hill . On the way back I took off my skins and made better time in the already packed trail .Skating would not have worked. My boots were downhill boots and very heavy , funny they never gave me any trouble going uphill ?

I have a set of touring boots and Dynafit radical bindings , an incredible difference on the way up .

Do lots of reading , it's amazing the amount of choices . I had been skiing along time before I even knew touring equipment existed .
https://www.evo.com/guides/how-to-buy-alpine-touring-bindings

 

[KustyTheKlown]

Do lots of reading , it's amazing the amount of choices . I had been skiing along time before I even knew touring equipment existed .
https://www.evo.com/guides/how-to-buy-alpine-touring-bindings

the explosion of AT is a pretty recent phenomenon. the introduction and spread of frame touring bindings did a lot to open people to it.

 

[sankaty]

I'm feeling like a light frame binding is the way for me to go. Because I don't weigh much, I think I can get by with just the 10 DIN max versions (my alpine bindings are set to 7.5, I think), though probably anything between 10-13 max would be fine.

My Blizzard Ones, while heavy, have the Max IQ slider binding system. If could find another set of slider plates somewhere I could just mount new frame bindings on those and swap out the alpine vs. AT frame setups in just a few minutes.

The main catch is that Max Slider Plates are manufactured anymore and seem hard to find. Anyone got a pair of Max Slider Plates gathering dust somewhere to sell me :smile:?

 

[KustyTheKlown]

I know it's the opposite of what you just posted, but can sell you or anyone lightly used salomon guardian 16 from the first year they made that binding, for a very fair price. admittedly heavy. i took them off my kastles and replaced with look pivots, made my moments my only touring ski, which have marker barons on them. The guardians have sat in my trunk for a couple years

 

[Scruffy]

If you're skinning Pico, why not stop by Base Camp Outfitters just across the mountain access road to Killington and demo some frame bindings and then demo some real AT gear. If you really want to get into this, getting the right gear the first time is the way to go instead of spending money on a "just for now hack" only to spend more money down the road replacing it. It starts out just a little Slack Country tour, then the morning Dawn Patrol, just for exercise, and then the hey let's go do some serious tour, so choose wisely.

 

[sankaty]

If you're skinning Pico, why not stop by Base Camp Outfitters just across the mountain access road to Killington and demo some frame bindings and then demo some real AT gear. If you really want to get into this, getting the right gear the first time is the way to go instead of spending money on a "just for now hack" only to spend more money down the road replacing it. It starts out just a little Slack Country tour, then the morning Dawn Patrol, just for exercise, and then the hey let's go do some serious tour, so choose wisely.

Thanks for the guidance. The Base Camp rental is a great idea.

I'm a little wary of tech bindings from a safety point of view. I know that their release properties have improved, but I'd want the safest binding possible. My wife broke her ankle last April from a late release during a freak slow-speed fall in sticky snow. She's fully recovered, but it has us all on edge about injuries from bindings not releasing.

I'm somewhat optimistic that a light frame binding will be cheap enough and useful enough that I won't soon regret it, but I would like to make the most informed decision possible.

 

[fbrissette]

As other have said touring on alpine ski boots will work, just like 210cm 60mm wide skis work in powder. Not ideal but you can make it work.

If you go uphill on a steady pitch with risers (e.g. up a ski hill) will be fine. But on longer tours on flatter terrain you need long leg extension and you will get blisters even with buckles undone. For serious touring a full tech AT setup is a must. I have extensive touring experience with inserts, frame bindings and tech bindings and tech is miles ahead of the other systems.

Recent setups have high certified DIN release (16) as well as release mechanisms close to the best standard bindings.

 

[sankaty]

As other have said touring on alpine ski boots will work, just like 210cm 60mm wide skis work in powder. Not ideal but you can make it work.

If you go uphill on a steady pitch with risers (e.g. up a ski hill) will be fine. But on longer tours on flatter terrain you need long leg extension and you will get blisters even with buckles undone. For serious touring a full tech AT setup is a must. I have extensive touring experience with inserts, frame bindings and tech bindings and tech is miles ahead of the other systems.

Recent setups have high certified DIN release (16) as well as release mechanisms close to the best standard bindings.

I think I understand the benefit of touring boots over alpine, but aside from weight, why are tech bindings miles ahead of a light frame binding? Thanks!

 

[fbrissette]

I think I understand the benefit of touring boots over alpine, but aside from weight, why are tech bindings miles ahead of a light frame binding? Thanks!

Switch from touring to downhill mode with your boot in, boot closer to the ski, no plate to lift every step, better riser system, ability to put couteaux (ski crampons) that remain on the ski instead of rising with the plate and finally, weight. The best frame bindings come nowhere close to tech bindings w/r to weight.

Frame bindings are perfectly adequate but if you really want to get into serious backcountry touring, tech is the way to go.

 

[kingslug]

Marker Kingpin might be the ticket. My guide here at Revelstoke had them..he skis year round. He said they can be tough to put on in powder though and require a good cleaning.
As far as AT boots..lighter and a lugged rubber sole make climbing and just walking around much better. Just walking around the lodge and going up and down stairs..like a human as opposed to Frankenstein is a plus.