Backcountry Thread

[Tin Woodsman]

Edit: Actually, this brings up an interesting point. You're working in the woods, and suddenly you stumble across someone else's work. What's the protocol? Do you leave it alone entirely? Thin out the shwack? Try to improve it based on your judgement? I've come across lines that proved to be far to tight, or poorly cut, or had some other defect and I never know if I should do something about it.

One man's defect might be another man's joy. Never considered this situation before, have no idea what protocol if any exists.

I'd leave it alone and check it out again this winter...it might look different covered with snow.

To be certain, the stuff we found this year was a joy. Low angle, room to roam, etc... No problems there. It's what we found last year that I have a problem with. Starts out well enough, though in an area that is usually wind scoured. Then narrows down to one track wide with tight mandatory turns as it gets steeper before suddenly plunging over ledges. Certainly a challenge, but not exactly enjoyable, especially if you're with friends (as you shouold be in the woods). Almost had several collissions as we came barelling down the single track at the mandatory high speed.

 

[dmc]

I always gotta think big..
First time I cut - I cut too small...

 

[JimG.]

Edit: Actually, this brings up an interesting point. You're working in the woods, and suddenly you stumble across someone else's work. What's the protocol? Do you leave it alone entirely? Thin out the shwack? Try to improve it based on your judgement? I've come across lines that proved to be far to tight, or poorly cut, or had some other defect and I never know if I should do something about it.

One man's defect might be another man's joy. Never considered this situation before, have no idea what protocol if any exists.

I'd leave it alone and check it out again this winter...it might look different covered with snow.

To be certain, the stuff we found this year was a joy. Low angle, room to roam, etc... No problems there. It's what we found last year that I have a problem with. Starts out well enough, though in an area that is usually wind scoured. Then narrows down to one track wide with tight mandatory turns as it gets steeper before suddenly plunging over ledges. Certainly a challenge, but not exactly enjoyable, especially if you're with friends (as you shouold be in the woods). Almost had several collissions as we came barelling down the single track at the mandatory high speed.

Sounds like someone else's sucker line.

 

[riverc0il]

Edit: Actually, this brings up an interesting point. You're working in the woods, and suddenly you stumble across someone else's work. What's the protocol? Do you leave it alone entirely? Thin out the shwack? Try to improve it based on your judgement? I've come across lines that proved to be far to tight, or poorly cut, or had some other defect and I never know if I should do something about it.

excellent point! while working others lines, i would only do major work like clearing a blow down or something clearly unintended. in general, i believe less is more. besides, you can only cut once then it is gone forever. my strategy is not just what to cut, but what to leave for 30+ years down the road. so it is difficult to determine what someone was thinking. also, a tight line for one person could be ideal for the original cutter. etc.

i think leaving it and scoping it out during the winter when the line is filled in is a good idea, as suggested by JimG. then you can get a better feel for if something was intentional or not.

 

[Treeliner]

Edit: Actually, this brings up an interesting point. You're working in the woods, and suddenly you stumble across someone else's work. What's the protocol? Do you leave it alone entirely? Thin out the shwack? Try to improve it based on your judgement? I've come across lines that proved to be far to tight, or poorly cut, or had some other defect and I never know if I should do something about it.

excellent point! while working others lines, i would only do major work like clearing a blow down or something clearly unintended. in general, i believe less is more. besides, you can only cut once then it is gone forever. my strategy is not just what to cut, but what to leave for 30+ years down the road. so it is difficult to determine what someone was thinking. also, a tight line for one person could be ideal for the original cutter. etc.

i think leaving it and scoping it out during the winter when the line is filled in is a good idea, as suggested by JimG. then you can get a better feel for if something was intentional or not.

I agree - can you imagine having worked on a line you've been thinning for years (to your liking), and then come winter finding that some random guys completely ruined your line by over cutting or something of that nature.

 

[riverc0il]

but if it's a clearly abandoned line, by all means go nuts! :beer:

 

[Greg]

Question from a non-BC skier: what's the approach when clearing lines? Will you guys whack down large trees, or is it a matter of simply clearing brush/small saplings?

 

[dmc]

Question from a non-BC skier: what's the approach when clearing lines? Will you guys whack down large trees, or is it a matter of simply clearing brush/small saplings?

I look for natural lines...
Move fallen wood out of the way or point it down the falline...
Also will trim small trees, low branches and underbrush...
Fill in gaps before rocks and clear out landings of deris...
I always leave pines alone... They're the natural flora before deforestation for tanning...

 

[JimG.]

Question from a non-BC skier: what's the approach when clearing lines? Will you guys whack down large trees, or is it a matter of simply clearing brush/small saplings?

I look for natural lines...
Move fallen wood out of the way or point it down the falline...
Also will trim small trees, low branches and underbrush...
Fill in gaps before rocks and clear out landings of deris...
I always leave pines alone... They're the natural flora before deforestation for tanning...

What d said...cleaning, trimming, pruning, and pampering, not wholesale cutting.

 

[Tin Woodsman]

I agree - can you imagine having worked on a line you've been thinning for years (to your liking), and then come winter finding that some random guys completely ruined your line by over cutting or something of that nature.

Oh no doubt. And that's what I was thinking as well. I know I wouldn't be too pleased if something I had worked hard on was subsequently hacked to pieces by a random crew. OTOH, the run in question just cries out for some judicious love.

 

[riverc0il]

yea, what they said. i generally never clip trees if i can't do it with a small hopper (blow downs excluded).

 

[JimG.]

Bump.

Just got back from a business trip to Anaheim. Saw some tremendous views of the Grand Canyon on the flight back and saw some fresh snow on several high peaks near the continental divide.

Now I'm really stoked!!

 

[awf170]

bump...
Just curious if anyone would want to do a bc day, because there has been some talk of it. Possibly on Cardigan because it is one of the easier routes, and that is something I could get to easily. I'm not sure if anyone would be comfortable meeting with me because of liability because I'm only 17. But I'm almost positive my parents would let me go as long as it was, a) easy to get to(under 2 hours) b)A pretty easy trail(no gullies or chutes, but thats kinda obvious) c) atleast 2 or 3 other people went. Mid/Late march would be the best for me, and the best chance of me going. I fully understand if no one would want to do it with me, but whatever maybe some other people can jump of this and have there own BC meeting.

 

[JimG.]

bump...
Just curious if anyone would want to do a bc day, because there has been some talk of it. Possibly on Cardigan because it is one of the easier routes, and that is something I could get to easily. I'm not sure if anyone would be comfortable meeting with me because of liability because I'm only 17. But I'm almost positive my parents would let me go as long as it was, a) easy to get to(under 2 hours) b)A pretty easy trail(no gullies or chutes, but thats kinda obvious) c) atleast 2 or 3 other people went. Mid/Late march would be the best for me, and the best chance of me going. I fully understand if no one would want to do it with me, but whatever maybe some other people can jump of this and have there own BC meeting.

I'm glad you bumped this. The weather lately really does prove one thing...

it's tough to make any BC plans when there isn't any snow! This weather is starting to :angry: me off.

 

[JD]

Devil's advocate....You all realize you are breaking the law when you cut. While everyone may see this as a more spiritual way to enjoy skiing, I imagine that a low percentage of us has a degree in forestry. And on state land, it's just wrong. I ski lines that have been cut, and know alot of people that are very active in the greens, and I don't agree with their philosophy. It seems that when the Mtn. Company wants to widen trails, everyone freaks out about them cutting trees down, but then they go out in high evelvation (fragile) areas and cut lines, as if they have a right. As an avid MTBer and trail advocate putting in 100+ hours of legal work a year, I have witnessed over the last decade what renegade cutting has done to access. Doing the same thing at a resort is kinda lame IMO. I don't have a ski pass and ski only BC. Maple glades, when we get enough snow, are naturally open areas, plus slide paths and drainages offer plenty to ski, but everyone wants to be ranger Rick, or have their own "stash". The fact that a person is out cutting a line and runs accross other people work is indicative of an area having too much going on. Ski what nature has provided off of the legal trail systems that exsist all over the N.E. Just my 2 cents.
Dave

ps
Anyone ever in the area, lemme know. The Mansfield zone has tons of great tours with steep descents and bueatiful places not often seen by most skiers.

 

[JimG.]

Devil's advocate....You all realize you are breaking the law when you cut. While everyone may see this as a more spiritual way to enjoy skiing, I imagine that a low percentage of us has a degree in forestry. And on state land, it's just wrong. I ski lines that have been cut, and know alot of people that are very active in the greens, and I don't agree with their philosophy. It seems that when the Mtn. Company wants to widen trails, everyone freaks out about them cutting trees down, but then they go out in high evelvation (fragile) areas and cut lines, as if they have a right. As an avid MTBer and trail advocate putting in 100+ hours of legal work a year, I have witnessed over the last decade what renegade cutting has done to access. Doing the same thing at a resort is kinda lame IMO. I don't have a ski pass and ski only BC. Maple glades, when we get enough snow, are naturally open areas, plus slide paths and drainages offer plenty to ski, but everyone wants to be ranger Rick, or have their own "stash". The fact that a person is out cutting a line and runs accross other people work is indicative of an area having too much going on. Ski what nature has provided off of the legal trail systems that exsist all over the N.E. Just my 2 cents.
Dave

ps
Anyone ever in the area, lemme know. The Mansfield zone has tons of great tours with steep descents and bueatiful places not often seen by most skiers.

I agree with you...in an earlier post in this thread, I mentioned that cleaning up brush, trimming branches, pruning a little here or there, and moving deadfall is as far as I ever go when suggesting that clearing an OB line is in order. I don't suggest cutting even small saplings. Cleaning is a better word for it than clearing.

 

[JD]

exactly.

 

[ski_adk]

I'm dying to try Thunderbolt or Tucks this year. Any suggestions for preparation or planning that might not always obvious to the first time BC skier (I already know not to do it alone)?

 

[redalienx11]

I'm dying to try Thunderbolt or Tucks this year. Any suggestions

I went to Tucks last year it was amazing... here are a few random thoughts / tips about it.

If you go in March / Early April, you might have better snow and will be able to ski all the way back down to the car. If you go Late April / May, you will have to hike back to the car.

Early season: snowshoes and/or crampons advised. Later season: you can hike up the headwall in ski boots.

If you have more specific question, post them!

 

[riverc0il]

here is your tuckerman info:
http://timefortuckerman.com/

from experience regarding my first BC tour, you learn a LOT that first time out. you will be amazed how much you did wrong. you will also be amazed how much you did right ("wow, i did really need that stupid thing i brought thinking i'd never use it"). i'd say go for the smaller trip for a first time BC if possible. better to make mistakes on a smaller tour with less exposure. then again, at tucks you have the benefit of lots of people and a patrol in the bowl. cheers either way you go.