Belleayre closing due to layoffs

[catskillman]

Who pays for unemployment for the seasonal hourly workers? Well probably the same people who pay for it the 7-8 months of the year Belleayre isn't open? So us? Am I right?[/QUOTE]

Seasonal workers are not eligible for unemployment - mabye state workers have some loophole. That is one reason why areas are going to foreign workers. Locals jepordize their long term state aid ....... by taking seasonal work.

 

[drjeff]

If those 180,000 skiers and riders decided to relocate to your favorite place to ski and the lift line doubled in wait time, you might give a crap and have a crap.

Gotta remember that it's not actually 180,000 individual people were talking about here, unless the "average" Belleayre skier/rider just goes there 1 time per season.

In terms of individual folks, if their average customer skis/rides there 10 times a season, then it's 18,000 individuals, if it's 5 times a season, then it 36,000 individuals, etc.

So *if* Belleayre was close, over the course of an entire season, the surrounding ski areas would undoubtedly see an increase in skier/rider vists, but not likely a mega dramatic increase.

 

[dmc]

Seasonal workers are not eligible for unemployment - mabye state workers have some loophole. That is one reason why areas are going to foreign workers. Locals jepordize their long term state aid ....... by taking seasonal work.

At Hunter they are eligible for unemployment if they work a certain length of time. I think like 6 months...

 

[dmc]

So *if* Belleayre was close, over the course of an entire season, the surrounding ski areas would undoubtedly see an increase in skier/rider vists, but not likely a mega dramatic increase.

Remember Belleayre is never crowded so I'm not worried...

 

[catskillman]

But the problem is that large swaths of Hunter One are usually closed on weekdays, including E lift which would qualify as intermediate terrain.

YES - that is Hunter's way of saving $, budget management - Belleayre would keep all the lifts open for 2 people skiing. -- Need to be cost effective............

 

[Geoff]

I have family that works at Bell and family that lives on the mountain...spoke to 1 yesterday and she said that the full time employees lost their full time status but they can be hired back as seasonal employees. Only 10 people got to keep their full time status.

Sounds like a mini-version of what POWDR did at Killington. This is all about screwing people out of their health insurance benefits. Locals can't afford to go without health insurance so many go elsewhere rather than go without insurance. At Killington, Preston Smith used to talk about his number of full-timers as a matter of personal pride and obligation.

 

[catskillman]

Look - I am sure that everyone of the full time associates knows they had a great deal and were very lucky every day they worked there. They had to know the mountain did not need 55 full time year round employees! I am sure if you speak to them thye undersatnd the situation and probally expected the gravy train to end eventually. Hopefully they planned ahead.

Keep in mind the food operation is leased.

Anyway - I will miss the "free" tickets I always get in the spring after Hunter closes. Not to mention the free beer!

 

[oakapple]

As for Bell skiers hating on Hunter...I am NOT 1 of them.

I don’t actually recall anyone using “hate” to describe Hunter. I suspect you are mistaking “hate” for merely, “doesn’t like it as much as you do.”

Hunter is a more challenging mountain and is where i will be found the most. . . . If you cant handle the terrain, stay at Hunter One. I agree that there isnt much for the lower intermediate to ski on except Hellgate and Belt and even Hell can be a clusterf**k on the weekends...i have seen plenty of carnage on there with people who are over their heads.

Some advanced skiers, and I fear you may be one of them, have completely forgotten what it was like to be intermediate. There actually is a decent amount of intermediate terrain on the main hill at Hunter (Belt Parkway, White Cloud, 42nd Street, 7th Avenue, Gun Hill Road, Kennedy Drive, etc.).

I was rather annoyed, though, that even on a weekend in (IIRC) early March, E lift did not operate, taking a lot of Hunter One’s intermediate terrain off the map.

YES - that is Hunter's way of saving $, budget management - Belleayre would keep all the lifts open for 2 people skiing. -- Need to be cost effective............

Belleayre’s configuration makes it awfully awfully impractical to take any lifts out of service, aside from either of the two fixed-grip doubles at the Discovery Lodge. The others serve unique terrain, and losing any of them would make a lot of the mountain inaccessible. Hunter’s lift configuration and mountain layout has a lot more redundancy. They can run a subset of lifts, and still provide a very good skier experience.

 

[dmc]

Look - I am sure that everyone of the full time associates knows they had a great deal and were very lucky every day they worked there. They had to know the mountain did not need 55 full time year round employees! I am sure if you speak to them thye undersatnd the situation and probally expected the gravy train to end eventually. Hopefully they planned ahead.

Keep in mind the food operation is leased.

Anyway - I will miss the "free" tickets I always get in the spring after Hunter closes. Not to mention the free beer!

Nobody likes it when the gravy train derails..

I think I've only paid for 1 ticket there and I've been a bunch of times..

What about the 2 unions that are at Belleayre? They seem to be quiet..

 

[dmc]

I don’t actually recall anyone using “hate” to describe Hunter. I suspect you are mistaking “hate” for merely, “doesn’t like it as much as you do.”

Strongly dislike? better?

Whatever... There's lot's of "strong dislike" for Hunter - it's culture and trails - from Belleayre skiers on this board..

 

[threecy]

They had to know the mountain did not need 55 full time year round employees!
...
Keep in mind the food operation is leased.

Ouch!

 

[RootDKJ]

I have family that works at Bell and family that lives on the mountain...spoke to 1 yesterday and she said that the full time employees lost their full time status but they can be hired back as seasonal employees. Only 10 people got to keep their full time status. They will be open this year. Dont know what the opening and closing days are, but they will be open.

I'm glad to hear this. I've been wanting to get to Belleayre for a few seasons now, but I haven't made the time to do so. I have time time off to use yet this year and in the time period between when they and Blue open, I'm going to make some trips there. I'd hate to have the place closed down and never skied there.

 

[thinnmann]

DEC's layoff & ERI lists

snip----->>>>

Responding to a Freedom of Information Law request, the state Department of Environmental Conservation has provided the Enterprise with a list of DEC positions that are slated to be eliminated by the end of the year.

The list (see below) includes 134 positions, including 45 from the state-run Bellleayre Mountain Ski Center in the Catskills. The DEC has about 3,150 employees, according to the state Division of Budget. ​

The rest is here
http://www.adirondackdailyenterpris...ist-of-DEC-positions-scheduled-to-be-cut.html

 

[gmcunni]

DEC's layoff & ERI lists

snip----->>>>

Responding to a Freedom of Information Law request, the state Department of Environmental Conservation has provided the Enterprise with a list of DEC positions that are slated to be eliminated by the end of the year.

The list (see below) includes 134 positions, including 45 from the state-run Bellleayre Mountain Ski Center in the Catskills. The DEC has about 3,150 employees, according to the state Division of Budget. ​

The rest is here
http://www.adirondackdailyenterpris...ist-of-DEC-positions-scheduled-to-be-cut.html

of the jobs being cut -
Ski Patroller 1, Belleayre
Ski Patroller 2, Belleayre

i thought all ski patrol was volunteer, are there SP managers on full time payroll?

 

[thinnmann]

of the jobs being cut -
Ski Patroller 1, Belleayre
Ski Patroller 2, Belleayre

i thought all ski patrol was volunteer, are there SP managers on full time payroll?

Guess so. Looks like two patrollers and a lot of maintenance people. I hope nothing breaks.... If a lift goes down, will it be down for days? Hm... hope not.

 

[threecy]

These were all full time, year round jobs at Belleayre?!?

Carpenter, Belleayre

Clerk 1, Belleayre

Clerk 1, Belleayre

Clerk 2, Belleayre

Clerk 2, Belleayre

Conservation Operations Supervisor 1, Belleayre

Conservation Operations Supervisor 1, Belleayre

Electrician, Belleayre

General Mechanic, Belleayre

General Mechanic, Belleayre

General Mechanic, Belleayre

General Mechanic, Belleayre

General Mechanic, Belleayre

General Mechanic, Belleayre

General Mechanic, Belleayre

General Mechanic, Belleayre

General Mechanic, Belleayre

General Mechanic, Belleayre

General Mechanic, Belleayre

General Mechanic, Belleayre

General Mechanic, Belleayre

Keyboard Specialist 1, Belleayre

Laborer, Belleayre

Laborer, Belleayre

Maintenance Assistant, Belleayre

Maintenance Assistant, Belleayre

Maintenance Assistant, Belleayre

Maintenance Assistant, Belleayre

Maintenance Assistant, Belleayre

Maintenance Assistant, Belleayre

Maintenance Assistant, Belleayre

Maintenance Assistant, Belleayre

Maintenance Assistant, Belleayre

Maintenance Assistant, Electrician Belleayre

Maintenance Helper, Belleayre

Maintenance Supervisor 1, Belleayre

Park Worker 2, Belleayre

Park Worker 3, Belleayre

Park Worker 3, Belleayre

Park Worker 3, Belleayre

Park Worker 3, Belleayre

Park Worker 3, Belleayre

Ski Patroller 1, Belleayre

Ski Patroller 2, Belleayre

Supervisor of Plumbing and Steamfitting, Belleayre

 

[UVSHTSTRM]

These were all full time, year round jobs at Belleayre?!?

How does this stack up to other areas of the same relative size? Some of those positions seem a bit over-staffed from an outsiders perspective. Again I have no real knowledge, just curious. The park workers (guessing this means park as in rails, jumps, etc) and general mechanic caught my eye. If these numbers are on target for a normal ski area of similar size then I feel bad for the resort and really home nothing craps the bed during the season, could be a long winter.

 

[millerm277]

How does this stack up to other areas of the same relative size? Some of those positions seem a bit over-staffed from an outsiders perspective. Again I have no real knowledge, just curious. The park workers (guessing this means park as in rails, jumps, etc) and general mechanic caught my eye. If these numbers are on target for a normal ski area of similar size then I feel bad for the resort and really home nothing craps the bed during the season, could be a long winter.

This being the observations of someone who has only very limited direct knowledge of resort operations...

That's a ridiculous number of mechanics for any time of the year, especially considering they have 5 lifts. You could have a mechanic sitting at each chairlift, 2 in the snowmaking plant, 2 in the groomer shop, all waiting for something to break and still have 3 extras.

And obviously, those guys don't fix the little stuff either, that's what the 12 members of the maintenance staff must be for.

I am also curious as to what exactly you need with 2 patrollers and 6 park crew members full time, in the summer.

I recognize my post is, ahem...full of sarcasm, but I can't see any possible way to need this much staff in these positions, even if they somehow were equally busy in the summer as the winter. And even if you did, the normal practice would probably be to hire different people, so you don't have to spend a bunch of money on benefits and retirement for low-skill work.

EDIT: A quick look at their summer offerings shows absolutely nothing in terms of anything that's hugely labor intensive or needing frequent repairs.
EDIT2: As a basic point, have you ever looked at a ski area in summer? (not counting summer ops) It's generally dead and there's nothing going on until near the end of the summer unless they're installing a lift or 100 fan guns.

 

[threecy]

How does this stack up to other areas of the same relative size? Some of those positions seem a bit over-staffed from an outsiders perspective. Again I have no real knowledge, just curious. The park workers (guessing this means park as in rails, jumps, etc) and general mechanic caught my eye. If these numbers are on target for a normal ski area of similar size then I feel bad for the resort and really home nothing craps the bed during the season, could be a long winter.

I don't have any personal experience with detachables (they take a lot more work than fixed grips), but they have dozens of full time, year round maintenance employees for an area with 5 chairlifts. Unreal.

 

[andrec10]

And we wonder why New York is in the shape its in! If Belleayre is this overstaffed, imagine the rest of the state! I hate to see anyone lose thier job, but this is crazy!