Belleayre closing due to layoffs

[dmc]

What local repair shops.

The ones that will start up and add jobs to the valley.. If not already there...

 

[threecy]

What local repair shops.

There is not a single person in the valley who can work on a four wheeler?

Some ski areas have people they can give a call to, who will pull up with a trailer, take the bike back to their house or shop, service it, then bring it back, for a reasonable price. In the middle of the ski season, when maintenance workers are focussed on snowmaking and grooming, it's a waste of resources to spend time on broken four wheelers.

 

[deadheadskier]

55 full time year round benefitted employees seems way high for pretty much any Eastern Ski Resort. I know we didn't have that many at Snowshoe when I worked there in 02. That despite doing 500K skier visits and having revenue north of 35mil.

I wonder if any one that actually works at a ski area (preferably privately held) could comment on the percentage of full time employees to part time and/or seasonal? My guess is that the adjustments bring Belleayre's work force into line with what is actually standard at other areas. Just my guess though, would love to hear from someone currently or that has previously worked at a ski area.

I'll try and jog my memory regarding year round benefitted staff when I worked Snowshoe. Big operation with a large village and lodging for 5000+ slopeside, 12 Food and Beverage outlets, 5 retail stores, golf course, MTB operations.

GM
Director of Lodging, Director of F&B, Director of IT, Director of Mountain OPS, Director of Retail, Director of Sales, Director of Communications, Director of Marketing, Director of Finance, Director of Golf/Ski School, Director of Loss Prevention / Security

2 - Security Personnel
4-5 - Lodging Managers
8-10 - Marketing/Sales/Communications Staff
Housekeeping Manager
Maintenance Manager and 4-5 year round workers
8 - F&B Managers / Culinary Staff
2 - IT support
4 - Accting
2 -3 - Year round Recreation folks. Did Ski School in Winter, MTB operations in summer etc.

Approximately 50. Though I'm not sure how Belleayre compares in terms of size to Snowshoe.

 

[gmcunni]

not as large a ski area but Ski Sundown reports (as of Jan 2010) to employ 12 full timers and approx 400 seasonal workers.

 

[drjeff]

I'll try and jog my memory regarding year round benefitted staff when I worked Snowshoe. Big operation with a large village and lodging for 5000+ slopeside, 12 Food and Beverage outlets, 5 retail stores, golf course, MTB operations.

GM
Director of Lodging, Director of F&B, Director of IT, Director of Mountain OPS, Director of Retail, Director of Sales, Director of Communications, Director of Marketing, Director of Finance, Director of Golf/Ski School, Director of Loss Prevention / Security

2 - Security Personnel
4-5 - Lodging Managers
8-10 - Marketing/Sales/Communications Staff
Housekeeping Manager
Maintenance Manager and 4-5 year round workers
8 - F&B Managers / Culinary Staff
2 - IT support
4 - Accting
2 -3 - Year round Recreation folks. Did Ski School in Winter, MTB operations in summer etc.

Approximately 50. Though I'm not sure how Belleayre compares in terms of size to Snowshoe.

I think it's quite safe to say that Belleayre DOESN'T have the same quantity of mountain owned/managed lodging properties that Snowshoe does, and it seems like a significant portion of those F/T employees that you mentioned there DHS are tied to lodging needs.

 

[catskillman]

This is crazy - like I said I am certain that this was no shock to these employees and hpefully they were proactive. I would not be surprised to see the announcement of several new LLC's of the maintenance type being established in the ares. OR - if the mountain needs some maintenace on a snow cat - they will call one of the seasonal maintenance associates from a neighboring mountain to help out on their day off.

every other mountain manages. I cannot for begin to imagine how they got away with that kind of full time staff. If I had one of those jobs I would be the most well read individuals in the state and would speak 5 languages. What else would there be to do at worK?

Another thought - these folks can all apply for positiions at the new casino/resort Paterson is sliding through in his last days in office

 

[4aprice]

I'll try and jog my memory regarding year round benefitted staff when I worked Snowshoe. Big operation with a large village and lodging for 5000+ slopeside, 12 Food and Beverage outlets, 5 retail stores, golf course, MTB operations.

GM
Director of Lodging, Director of F&B, Director of IT, Director of Mountain OPS, Director of Retail, Director of Sales, Director of Communications, Director of Marketing, Director of Finance, Director of Golf/Ski School, Director of Loss Prevention / Security

2 - Security Personnel
4-5 - Lodging Managers
8-10 - Marketing/Sales/Communications Staff
Housekeeping Manager
Maintenance Manager and 4-5 year round workers
8 - F&B Managers / Culinary Staff
2 - IT support
4 - Accting
2 -3 - Year round Recreation folks. Did Ski School in Winter, MTB operations in summer etc.

Approximately 50. Though I'm not sure how Belleayre compares in terms of size to Snowshoe.

Snowshoe is a resort, Belleayre is a ski area in the woods. Alot of the positions you list would not be necessary at Bellearye. Camelback has a healthy year round business with the summer parks. I'll try to find out what their full time staff is.

Alex

Lake Hopatcong, NJ

 

[threecy]

Approximately 50. Though I'm not sure how Belleayre compares in terms of size to Snowshoe.

I don't have citable numbers, but I believe the rumor is that Belleayre skis 180K and Snowshoe 450K

 

[deadheadskier]

I don't have citable numbers, but I believe the rumor is that Belleayre skis 180K and Snowshoe 450K

Then my experience at Wisp might be a more comparable comparison. There I'd put the number around 20 year round full time employees.

 

[threecy]

There I'd put the number around 20 year round full time employees.

Are their benefits (health/retirement) comparable to State of NY?

 

[deadheadskier]

Are their benefits (health/retirement) comparable to State of NY?

best health benefits I've ever had actually. Zero out of pocket expense per pay check and the copays were very low.

Not sure what their retirement benefits were like as my year round full time position was cut after ski season, so I never became eligible. :lol:

Actually, I guess I should revise that statement to 15 year round full time and 5 nine month full time positions. A handful of other positions were cut when mine was, then come summer they recreated the positions again. End of the following season, the positions were cut once again. I think that was part of their plan to get decent managers. Sell them on year round employment, work them 80 hours a week through the ski season, then cut them in the spring.

 

[millerm277]

no what i am saying is at what point do you make it yr round .Having seaonal winter with seasonal summer = yr round full time work..No?

If we're talking low-skill labor, which is most of the jobs, why on earth would you do that? Hiring two guys for 19 hours a week each is still going to be cheaper than one guy for 40 hours a week + benefits + retirement.

 

[snafu]

best health benefits I've ever had actually. Zero out of pocket expense per pay check and the copays were very low.

Not sure what their retirement benefits were like as my year round full time position was cut after ski season, so I never became eligible. :lol:

Actually, I guess I should revise that statement to 15 year round full time and 5 nine month full time positions. A handful of other positions were cut when mine was, then come summer they recreated the positions again. End of the following season, the positions were cut once again. I think that was part of their plan to get decent managers. Sell them on year round employment, work them 80 hours a week through the ski season, then cut them in the spring.

Is Shoeshoe privately owned? If so I give them much respect for having that good of health benefits.

But I would bet that their retirement benefits pale in comparison to what NY state workers get. This is the BIG issue - defined benefit pensions that most public unions enjoy. They are simply not sustainable - workers usually pay a fraction into it while the state(taxpayers) puts in the rest. And these pension funds base their numbers on a 7-8% return on their investments - which these days is totally outrageous. So it comes down to cut or tax more. And taxpayers have had enough.

 

[threecy]

Is Shoeshoe privately owned? If so I give them much respect for having that good of health benefits.

But I would bet that their retirement benefits pale in comparison to what NY state workers get. This is the BIG issue - defined benefit pensions that most public unions enjoy. They are simply not sustainable - workers usually pay a fraction into it while the state(taxpayers) puts in the rest. And these pension funds base their numbers on a 7-8% return on their investments - which these days is totally outrageous. So it comes down to cut or tax more. And taxpayers have had enough.

Great post.

 

[drjeff]

Is Shoeshoe privately owned? If so I give them much respect for having that good of health benefits.

But I would bet that their retirement benefits pale in comparison to what NY state workers get. This is the BIG issue - defined benefit pensions that most public unions enjoy. They are simply not sustainable - workers usually pay a fraction into it while the state(taxpayers) puts in the rest. And these pension funds base their numbers on a 7-8% return on their investments - which these days is totally outrageous. So it comes down to cut or tax more. And taxpayers have had enough.

Great post.

Additionally, the per worker costs that NYS pays for medical/dental vs. what a private company pays don't compare either

 

[deadheadskier]

Is Shoeshoe privately owned? If so I give them much respect for having that good of health benefits.

But I would bet that their retirement benefits pale in comparison to what NY state workers get. This is the BIG issue - defined benefit pensions that most public unions enjoy. They are simply not sustainable - workers usually pay a fraction into it while the state(taxpayers) puts in the rest. And these pension funds base their numbers on a 7-8% return on their investments - which these days is totally outrageous. So it comes down to cut or tax more. And taxpayers have had enough.

I was referring to Wisp regarding the benefits. Snowshoe's were pretty decent as well. Snowshoe was owned by Intrawest at the time.

no doubt, very few privately held businesses have retirement plans anywhere near as rewarding as State plans.

 

[skidbump]

If we're talking low-skill labor, which is most of the jobs, why on earth would you do that? Hiring two guys for 19 hours a week each is still going to be cheaper than one guy for 40 hours a week + benefits + retirement.

Me , i would rather have the expense of a full timer versus the issues involved with 2 part timers who could possibly be new hires that need to be trained over and over. Also full timers usually have way fewer issues than part timers .

State is saving 250 million on layoff and losing 5 billion a yr in medicare/medicaid fraud ..Who took the easy way out?

Same attitude most companys have..Make the easy cuts save a few bucks keep stock holders happy..God forbid we actually make cuts/savings where they are really needed

 

[dmc]

Me , i would rather have the expense of a full timer versus the issues involved with 2 part timers who could possibly be new hires that need to be trained over and over. Also full timers usually have way fewer issues than part timers .

What if they were the same guy/guys who just took the Seasonal instead of losing a job?

Seems like a no brainer to Bell...

 

[dmc]

State is saving 250 million on layoff and losing 5 billion a yr in medicare/medicaid fraud ..Who took the easy way out?

Same attitude most companys have..Make the easy cuts save a few bucks keep stock holders happy..God forbid we actually make cuts/savings where they are really needed

Why can't they do both?

Trim the staff and get a handle on fraud..

 

[skidbump]

What if they were the same guy/guys who just took the Seasonal instead of losing a job?

Seems like a no brainer to Bell...

Got no real problem with that.